What if you're wrong?

To solve world problems

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Willum
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What if you're wrong?

Post #1

Post by Willum »

We all have strongly held beliefs, they can't all be right. What if you discover that whatever your particular truth is, is wrong, and that in order to solve the worlds problems, which clearly are not being completely addressed by any belief, you find that in order to make the world better, you need to adopt another approach. Or perhaps it is as simple as committing more completely to the principles of your own, ones you ignore or do not adhere to for whatever reason?

Can we even introspect enough to suspect some aspect of what we do is causing rather than solving the world's problem.

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Re: How to start?

Post #11

Post by Monta »

Willum wrote:

Shouldn't an all powerful god be able to send someone who leaves no doubts.//

I believe that doubt is within Divine Providence.
It keeps us in perfect freedom to look both ways.

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William
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Post #12

Post by William »

I think it is within the human potential to create a shared Utopia over the face of the Earth without any need for some being from outside the problem of our situation coming to save humanity from itself by setting up and enforcing a benevolent dictatorship.

However, potentiality does not = actuality.

My opinion re such a story is that it was manufactured by a collaboration of Roman and Jewish elitists who invented Christianity as a means of controlling the rebellious by way of pacifying.

This inevitably saved money (internal defense costs) by creating a hope in the masses of an eventual promised intervention which could conceivably go on indefinitely whilst inserting a doctrine which specifically encourage those masses to support the systems of disparity which control them as these were effectively God-ordained - or at the very least, tolerated by God and thus citizens needed to obey the state until such a time as God freed human beings from the oppresses/suppresses, evil humans in positions of power and influence.

A nice story invented to encourage hope and obedience.

Organised religion has always evolved from infiltration into things which become popular, are proven to get stronger through oppression and torture, murder etc and the infiltration is specifically political. Organised religion is about mixing state with religion in order to control vast multitudes of individuals toward a specific agenda.

If we really want to fix the problems of the world, we also need to identify them as they are, rather than as they might appear to be.

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Post #13

Post by Monta »

[Replying to William]

"My opinion re such a story is that it was manufactured by a collaboration of Roman and Jewish elitists who invented Christianity as a means of controlling the rebellious by way of pacifying."

Are yu saying that an intelligent person today looks to Roman and Jewish history
in their search for truth and meaning?

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Re: What if you're wrong?

Post #14

Post by TheBeardedDude »

Willum wrote: We all have strongly held beliefs, they can't all be right. What if you discover that whatever your particular truth is, is wrong, and that in order to solve the worlds problems, which clearly are not being completely addressed by any belief, you find that in order to make the world better, you need to adopt another approach. Or perhaps it is as simple as committing more completely to the principles of your own, ones you ignore or do not adhere to for whatever reason?

Can we even introspect enough to suspect some aspect of what we do is causing rather than solving the world's problem.
Pascal's wager isn't particularly convincing. I don't live my life under the assumption I am wrong, only the assumption that I may need to update my opinions and beliefs as new information arises.

So, what if I am wrong about god or prayer, etc? There is no reason for me to think I am wrong, so I'd need to see a good reason why first in order to assess that possibility. Doesn't do much good to live life thinking you're wrong all the time, you'd never be able to get anything done.

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Post #15

Post by William »

Monta wrote: [Replying to William]

"My opinion re such a story is that it was manufactured by a collaboration of Roman and Jewish elitists who invented Christianity as a means of controlling the rebellious by way of pacifying."

Are yu saying that an intelligent person today looks to Roman and Jewish history
in their search for truth and meaning?
No. Why would you think that is what I am saying?

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Post #16

Post by Monta »

[Replying to William]


[Replying to William]

"My opinion re such a story is that it was manufactured by a collaboration of Roman and Jewish elitists who invented Christianity as a means of controlling the rebellious by way of pacifying."

M:
Are yu saying that an intelligent person today looks to Roman and Jewish history
in their search for truth and meaning?

Wm:
No. Why would you think that is what I am saying?

M: You said Christianity was manufactured by Jews and Romans.

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William
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Post #17

Post by William »

Monta wrote: [Replying to William]


[Replying to William]

"My opinion re such a story is that it was manufactured by a collaboration of Roman and Jewish elitists who invented Christianity as a means of controlling the rebellious by way of pacifying."

M:
Are yu saying that an intelligent person today looks to Roman and Jewish history
in their search for truth and meaning?

Wm:
No. Why would you think that is what I am saying?

M: You said Christianity was manufactured by Jews and Romans.
That is my opinion on how Christianity was invented, yes.

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Re: What if you're wrong?

Post #18

Post by ttruscott »

Willum wrote: We all have strongly held beliefs, they can't all be right. What if you discover that whatever your particular truth is, is wrong, and that in order to solve the worlds problems, which clearly are not being completely addressed by any belief, you find that in order to make the world better, you need to adopt another approach.
Yes this happened to me. I was committed to a world wherein man has the right and the duty to choose his own mortality within secular materialism and it led me into the pit of selfish hedonism.

It was only after I realized this system of thought was terribly destructive and started to look for a morality outside and above myself did I decide only the love and righteousness of a God might save the world, did I seek HIM and HE responded. And so it started...

Is this what you meant?
PCE Theology as I see it...

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.

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Re: How to start?

Post #19

Post by ttruscott »

Willum wrote: [Replying to Wissing]
Shouldn't an all powerful god be able to send someone who leaves no doubts.
Doubts are what men use to persuade.
Doubts are also used to encourage a person strive for greater diligence, passion and clarity.
PCE Theology as I see it...

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.

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ttruscott
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Re: How to start?

Post #20

Post by ttruscott »

Willum wrote:All the centuries of belief have not made believers better than non-believers.
Every person in every generation is on his own to find GOD. It is his relationship with GOD that makes him good, not his place in a family or church or other belief system. The belief is new all the time to those who need it and who will be transformed by it.

Belief can't make believers better than non-believers, only going thru the painful discipline of being trained in righteousness has that power. Belief only starts this process - it doesn't imply that the end has been reached in full holiness.
PCE Theology as I see it...

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.

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