What really happened in the garden of Eden.

[mickiel]

One of the most distorted events in human history, is the events in Eden and what really happened there. The common perception is that God created Adam and Eve, trained them and taught them and gave them his Holy Spirit: they then had to face satan, as the devil sneeked into Eden and totally messed up the heads of Adam and Eve and thus they failed some kind of test from God, and were thrown out of the garden. And this is erroneously called " The Fall."

I disagree with so much of these religious assumptions. First, there is absolutely no evidence that God gave Adam and Eve his Spirit, or that he prepared them for this " Contest" with satan. The young couple were left totally defenseless and they had absolutely no chance whatsoever against the serpent. The serpent did not sneak into the garden, he could only gain access from God himself, so God planned the event.

In Gen. 1:27, God gives Adam and Eve " Consciousness", which is what " The Image of God " means. The image of God is not anything physical. In Gen. 2:16 God commands that the couple not eat of a tree he created that contained the knowledge of Good and Evil", from that we can know that Adam and Eve had no knowledge of either good or evil, to this point. Now in Gen. 3:1 we can see that the serpent , or satan, was created by God, because he was MORE subtil, MORE deceptive than any OTHER beast THAT GOD HAD MADE! So God MADE him that way.

Then we now have satan inside of the garden of Eden ,we MUST assume that God planned on him being there. So satan was " More", in other words, more powerful than any other creation on earth. Now we have in verse 1, satan begins his deception. He goes directly to Eve, Adam stands by and does nothing, because he did not know anythingelse to do. The serpent does his thing, the young couple does what God commanded them not to do. And God knew this would happen, and God did absolutely nothing to help them, and that must be remembered and understood.

In Gen. 3:7 it clearly states that " The EYES of both of them were OPENED!" This does not mean they were physically blind before this seduction, it means they were SPIRITUALLY blind!! They did NOT have the Spirit of God or any spiritual training. They were CLOSED before this happened; they could NOT see before this event, they were spiritually BLIND!

What do you think will happen when God sends the most seductive, subtle, powerful being on earth to face a spiritually blind couple? Its academic, but totally misunderstood by religion.

[mickiel]

The events in Eden were premedicated by God , things happened exactly how he wanted it to. Nothing can happen that God does not want to happen,.

YHWH does not want sin or evil because He has/had no need for sin and evil to fulfill HIS purpose in our creation, the heavenly marriage. Sin happened against HIS will by our free will no matter how you plead the Calvinist blasphemies.

Of course I disagree ,if God did not want something , it could not be. And if something happened that God did not want to happen , then that something would be greater than God.Isaiah 45:7,"I form the light and create darkness , I make peace and create evil; I the Lord do all these things." This is what God has to say on the matter , what you are saying is meaningless.

[polonius]

It has been pretty well established that the first seven books of the bible were written between 800 and 700 BC in what is now Israel. The Garden of Eden story is just that, a story. It isn't factual.

The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology's New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts,[1] a book published in 2001, discusses the archaeology of Israel and its relationship to the origins and content of the Hebrew Bible. The authors are Israel Finkelstein, Professor of Archaeology at Tel Aviv University, and Neil Asher Silberman, an archaeologist, historian and contributing editor to Archaeology Magazine.

The book remarks that, despite modern archaeological investigations and the meticulous ancient Egyptian records from the period of Ramesses II, there is an obvious lack of any archaeological evidence for the migration of a band of semitic people across the Sinai Peninsula,


Biblical scholar Jonathan Kirsch, writing in the Los Angeles Times, called it "a brutally honest assessment of what archeology can and cannot tell us about the historical accuracy of the Bible", which embraces the spirit of modern archaeology by approaching the Bible "as an artifact to be studied and evaluated rather than a work of divine inspiration that must be embraced as a matter of true belief".



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bible_Unearthed

[dio9]

Yes and added to that the garden story explains how God's good creation , affirming the cosmos is good, got messed up. You know why there are murderers, thieves, organized wars, greed, the whole messy thing we call civilization. The Adam Eve story says the world we have made for ourselves is not the world God had in mind. But importantly Genesis and the both testaments also gives us the message that since we messed it up so we can also fix it too. And lays out a history of restoration from Noah to Abraham David and Jesus, it's not just a story there is a point and direction to it.

[ttruscott]

The events in Eden were premedicated by God , things happened exactly how he wanted it to. Nothing can happen that God does not want to happen,.

YHWH does not want sin or evil because He has/had no need for sin and evil to fulfill HIS purpose in our creation, the heavenly marriage. Sin happened against HIS will by our free will no matter how you plead the Calvinist blasphemies.

Of course I disagree ,if God did not want something , it could not be. And if something happened that God did not want to happen , then that something would be greater than God.Isaiah 45:7,"I form the light and create darkness , I make peace and create evil; I the Lord do all these things." This is what God has to say on the matter , what you are saying is meaningless.

Ah, the `ra `ra bandwagon of false interpretation from a bad translation: `ra is disaster in this context, not moral evil. You love spouting this verse but ignore the dozen that claim that HE is light (moral righteousness) with no dark (moral evil) in HIM and that there is no wickedness, moral evil, within HIM.

Your choice to ignore Psalm 92:15
New International Version
proclaiming, "The LORD is upright; he is my Rock, and there is no wickedness in him."
and
New Living Translation
They will declare, "The LORD is just! He is my rock! There is no evil in him!" is like Satan tempting Christ in the desert to follow his interpretation of scripture and the serpent's telling the lie to Eve by telling the truth.

If it is not within HIM, it cannot be produced from HIM: James 3:11 Can both fresh water and bitter water flow from the same spring? 12 My brothers, can a fig tree grow olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water.…

GOD is not the source of poisonous water but of life saving water: Jeremiah 2:13 - For my people have committed two evils; they have forsaken me the fountain of living waters, with John 7:37 On the last and greatest day of the festival, Jesus stood and said in a loud voice, “Let anyone who is thirsty come to me and drink. 38 Whoever believes in me, as Scripture has said, rivers of living water will flow from within them.� And in case you can't drink the water, here it is again in a new analogy: Matthew 7:18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit...

Your theology fails...

[mickiel]

There is no pig in God but he created them.

There is no darkness in God but he created it.

There is no horse in God but he created them.

There is no evil in God but he created it.

There is no human in God but he created us.

Its academic, God can create things that are not a part of himself.

[ttruscott]

There is no pig in God but he created them.

There is no darkness in God but he created it.

There is no horse in God but he created them.

There is no evil in God but he created it.

There is no human in God but he created us.

Its academic, God can create things that are not a part of himself.

Your sophistry abounds. What does "IN" mean if not "IN accord with who HE is, HIS attributes, and HIS purposes?!!!"

HE is not a bucket from which HE pulls stuff. Pigs, horses and humans are all in accord with HIS attributes, HIS morality and HIS purposes for us. Darkness (as a metaphor for evil) and evil are not as is clearly stated by the scriptures I quoted.

He is light and in HIM is NO darkness at all.
HE is holy and in HIM is NO wickedness/evil at all.

[mickiel]

There is no human emotion in God, but he created it.

There is no matter in God , but God created matter.

There is no fish in God , but God created fish.

[dio9]

once again God is the ground and generator of creation but the garden story is metaphor. go figure what the trees and their fruit represent .

[ttruscott]

once again God is the ground and generator of creation but the garden story is metaphor. go figure what the trees and their fruit represent .

So far I think the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is the knowledge of our personal good and evil (not a general understanding that good and evil exists) and the fruit that opens their eyes so they are ashamed and seek repentance is any sin they do that is the final straw against their rejection to their being called a sinner; they have no more argument, they know they are evil and worthy of the death penalty and they have no recourse.

The law was given to teach us that as sinners we cannot keep the law and therefore we need a Saviour. 2 Corinthians 3:9 If the ministry [of commandments] that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry [of love in the gospel] that brings righteousness!

Commandments are given to prove our sin by the inability of any to obey the law... Romans 7:7 ...Nevertheless, I would not have known what sin was had it not been for the law.

The command to not eat was put to prove that as sinners they could not keep that command. And when they ate, they saw their nakedness, not their eating which, if the eating was their only sin, they should have seen because there is no sin being naked with your spouse as you were created. This proves that naked, the same word used to describe the serpents evil as crafty, must be being used as a metaphor for their sinfulness and not a reference to them being unclothed.

[mickiel]

There is no dirt in God , but God created dirt.

There are no butterflies in God , but God created butterflies.

There is no evil in God ,but God created evil.

It was God who created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. God had a hand in on the confusing tree.