Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[tam]

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

God did not warn Adam and Eve that if they ate from that tree, He (God) would condemn them to death. He warned them that if they ate from that tree, they would die.

No he didnt warn them, he COMMANDED them.

Well sure....

Well sure what?

Well sure, He commanded them not to eat of that tree... but as I said, I was referring to His (God's) warning of what would happen if they did eat from that tree.



Peace again to you.

[Revelations won]

Dear JW,

You asked: “What would you call God condemning Adam to death, a blessing?”

My response: Absolutely! It seems like you have a negative or dismal attitude regarding death.

May I remind you that without DEATH and the resurrection provided by our savior NO ONE could receive the remission of sins without the blessings of the atonement of Jesus Christ.

No one could be resurrected until they first died.

When we stop and consider and ponder all of this is it not simply amazing that each and every one of us, (including Christ) must pass through this amazing process we call death.

I think this is super cool! Just think how amazing this will be, no pain, no suffering, no sickness, no missing body members, perfect health, perfect vision, perfect hearing……etc. My what great and marvelous blessings death brings to all of us!

Sorry JW, but I cannot view death as anything but a fantastic step in our eternal progression as we receive
The blessing of being heirs and joint heirs with Jesus Christ!

Yes! I testify that death is not a bitter end, but the divine process initiating the process of a glorious resurrection!

I have personally experienced imminent death as a intended mutilation murder victim held hostage at gunpoint by 4 individuals just released from prison and was spared by a divine providence at the last moment. I have had a few other experiences since then and was protected. I do not fear death. I love mortal life as we currently know it. I also, when my time comes, look forward to this journey we call death and the most glorious and exciting events this will trigger in our eternal progress!


You also stated your post#1814: “No I am saying that the first requirement for forgiveness is repentance , it is not automatic (see Acts 3:19) and there is nothing in the bible that indicates Adam repented nor that he was forgiven.

My response:

There is nothing in the Bible that states that he did not repent.

The bible also likewise, records nothing that states JW has repented.

Kind regards,
RW

[JehovahsWitness]

Dear JW,

You asked: “What would you call God condemning Adam to death, a blessing?”

My response: Absolutely!

So would you be happy if I said to you "I wish death on you, your family and your children" ?

If death is a blessings why did Jesus cry at his friend Lazarus' grave ?



JW

[tam]

Peace to you RW,

Just some things for your consideration:

[Replying to Revelations won in post #1823]

I think this is super cool! Just think how amazing this will be, no pain, no suffering, no sickness, no missing body members, perfect health, perfect vision, perfect hearing……etc. My what great and marvelous blessings death brings to all of us!

Those things are super cool, but those are things that LIFE brings to us (Life being Christ... "I am the Way, the Truth, and the LIFE"). Part of those super cool blessings is that there is no more death or mourning.

Death is an enemy, the last enemy to be destroyed; a curse (not a blessing).

I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse. Therefore choose life, that you and your offspring may live, Deut 30:19

The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 1 Corinth 15:26

**

One other thing for consideration... Adam did not have to die in order to receive eternal life. Had Adam listened to God and eaten of any tree in the garden (save the Tree of knowing good and bad), including eating of the Tree of Life, he would have lived, even forever. He only needed to eat from the Tree of Life (Christ) in order to live forever. While there is certainly blessing that Christ gave His life FOR our lives so that we could live, (us) dying is not a prerequisite to receiving eternal life. Because some of us (who are alive when Christ returns) will never die.

“I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live, even though he dies. 26And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die."

A - Tho one who believes in Him will live, even though he dies. (Because of the resurrection)

B - The one who lives (such as at the time He returns) and believes in Him will never die.


(Glad to hear that you made it through that hostage situation!!)


Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[PinSeeker]

Dear JW, You asked: “What would you call God condemning Adam to death, a blessing?” My response: Absolutely!

Wholeheartedly agreed. The blessing -- promise -- was that Adam would not have to endure the judgment placed upon himself (and the whole human race, the world) forever, and the possibility of escaping God's judgment and regaining life, even eternal life. And He based that promise upon Himself -- in the person of Jesus Christ -- making it a surety, not upon Adam or any other person, in which case it would have been impossible. Absolutely a blessing. To God be the glory. Yes, absolutely!

Grace and peace to all.

[Revelations won]

Dear JW,

It looks like you missed my point, so lets back up and take a closer view from the beginning in the Garden of Eden.

Genesis 1:
31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

At the end of the creation God makes it very clear that everything he made “was very good”.

Genesis2:
8
And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
9
And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Previously God testified that everything he created was very good.

1. So was the tree of knowledge of good and evil a good or evil tree?

2. So are you saying that Adam and Eve should have remained forever in ignorance, not discerning good from evil?

Remember that the eyes of their understanding were not yet opened before partaking of the fruit.

3. So JW, tell me flat out, should Adam have partaken of that fruit?

When I receive your answers to the above (3 )questions I will address the other issues involved which you introduce by your answers.

Kind regards,
RW

[Miles]

Dear JW,

It looks like you missed my point, so lets back up and take a closer view from the beginning in the Garden of Eden.

Genesis 1:
31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

At the end of the creation God makes it very clear that everything he made “was very good”.

Genesis2:
8
And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
9
And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Previously God testified that everything he created was very good.

1. So was the tree of knowledge of good and evil a good or evil tree?

2. So are you saying that Adam and Eve should have remained forever in ignorance, not discerning good from evil?

Remember that the eyes of their understanding were not yet opened before partaking of the fruit.

3. So JW, tell me flat out, should Adam have partaken of that fruit?

When I receive your answers to the above (3 )questions I will address the other issues involved which you introduce by your answers.

Kind regards,
RW

For what it's worth, my two cents.

1. So was the tree of knowledge of good and evil a good or evil tree?

Life that's incapable of possessing morals, such as mushrooms, hedge hogs, and trees for instance, are also incapable of being good or evil. Like rocks, they are amoral entities.


2. So are you saying that Adam and Eve should have remained forever in ignorance, not discerning good from evil?

Answering for myself.
In as much as god purposely put "the tree of life and the tree that gives knowledge about good and evil" in the garden, and from which he knew Adam and Eve would eat its fruit, it's pretty obvious god intended A&E to know both good and evil and be able to tell the difference between the two. So there was no "should have remained forever in ignorance." They had no choice.


3. So JW, tell me flat out, should Adam have partaken of that fruit?

Again, answering for myself.
There was no should or should not about it. God's omniscient knowledge of the future, that both A&E would eat the fruit, insured Adam's participation. He had no choice in the matter. He was fated to take a bite or two.


.

[onewithhim]

I thought I might reason a bit concerning God's viewpoint on Paradise on Earth. (Isaiah 1:18, KJV)

1) What was God's original purpose for the earth and humans? Genesis 1:28: "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth." Genesis 2:15: "And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it."(KJV)

It's clear that God made humans and the earth to form a compatible joining together, if you will...a place for humans to live with everything they needed and for them to take care of, spreading the Garden earth-wide.

2) Has God's purpose changed? The Bible says: "So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it." (Isaiah 55:11, KJV)

The Scripture says that when God plans something, it will be accomplished. That goes absolutely for His designs for the planet and mankind, which we see in Genesis. Even though Adam dropped the ball and turned on Jehovah, deliberately disobeying Him, God's will will be done eventually on Earth, as it is in heaven.

3) Where does Revelation 21:2 show the heavenly New Jerusalem going? "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

So God's government, the New Jerusalem, will come down to the earth. This is where God's will will be done, and we see what He will do in the following verses. (God's government/Kingdom will always be stationed in heaven, but its influence will be what "comes down" and rules over the earth.) The idea is that not all of God's worshippers will go to heaven. The Kingdom of God will influence and reign over the earth, where He planned for His human creation to be in the first place.

4) The final outcome will be: (Psalm 37:10,11, KJV) "For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be. But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace."

There should be no conflict with these words from God. It is clear what His purpose is, and it will not fail.


.

[Revelations won]

Dear Miles,

Thank you for your responses.

In response to your post #1827:

“Revelations won wrote: ↑
Wed Nov 25, 2020 10:38 pm
Dear JW,

It looks like you missed my point, so lets back up and take a closer view from the beginning in the Garden of Eden.

Genesis 1:
31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

At the end of the creation God makes it very clear that everything he made “was very good”.

Genesis2:
8
And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
9
And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Previously God testified that everything he created was very good.

1. So was the tree of knowledge of good and evil a good or evil tree?

2. So are you saying that Adam and Eve should have remained forever in ignorance, not discerning good from evil?

Remember that the eyes of their understanding were not yet opened before partaking of the fruit.

3. So JW, tell me flat out, should Adam have partaken of that fruit?

When I receive your answers to the above (3 )questions I will address the other issues involved which you introduce by your answers.

Kind regards,
RW

For what it's worth, my two cents.

1. So was the tree of knowledge of good and evil a good or evil tree?

Life that's incapable of possessing morals, such as mushrooms, hedge hogs, and trees for instance, are also incapable of being good or evil. Like rocks, they are amoral entities.

My response: In one sense I agree with you. There is no fault in the tree. Have you considered the possibility that the fruit of the tree may have simply in time may have changed what flowed in their veins to the mortal fluid we call blood? Thus introducing mortality?

2. So are you saying that Adam and Eve should have remained forever in ignorance, not discerning good from evil?

Answering for myself.
In as much as god purposely put "the tree of life and the tree that gives knowledge about good and evil" in the garden, and from which he knew Adam and Eve would eat its fruit, it's pretty obvious god intended A&E to know both good and evil and be able to tell the difference between the two. So there was no "should have remained forever in ignorance." They had no choice.

My response: On this point I also agree with you. The one exception is the they did in fact have a choice.

In fact all of mortal life is a series of events requiring agency and the freedom to choose good or evil. In other words, God created us with the ability to act and not to be acted upon. Each of us has that powerful ability which allows us the freedom to make life forming and life changing choices.

As I see it there must therefore be a force of opposition in all things. You might call it a perfect balance of opposing forces. If this condition of an “opposition in all things did not exist”, then man could not act for himself save he was enticed by one force or the other.

I would ask you was not this the very plan of God our Father who is indeed the father of all spirits?

Did not Christ himself face throughout life the choice to choose his own will or the will of his father?

Why should anyone think that anyone else should be exempt from the same type choices Christ had to face?

We should give careful attention to the following and all
That it portends as it applies to each of us:

Revelation 12:
7
And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8
And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Does this not clearly indicate that this gift of agency was first given in heaven? The scripture shows that Lucifer and all the that followed him were cast out of seven and were cast down to this earth.

Now I would ask you Miles, why on earth would an all wise and all knowing God cast them out of heaven and send them to this earth?

Why did he not send and confine them to some other of the countless planets so they would not be here to tempt and try us?

There is more that I would yet ask of you pertaining to this issue, but this suffice for now. After you have given this deep and serious thought let’s hear your answers.


3. So JW, tell me flat out, should Adam have partaken of that fruit?

Again, answering for myself.
There was no should or should not about it. God's omniscient knowledge of the future, that both A&E would eat the fruit, insured Adam's participation. He had no choice in the matter. He was fated to take a bite or two.

My response:

Miles, I ask you the same question I asked JW.

Should Adam have partaken of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

I await your answers. BTW I am still awaiting JW’s answers to these 3 questions.

Kind regards,
RW

[JehovahsWitness]

1. So was the tree of knowledge of good and evil a good or evil tree?

Life that's incapable of possessing morals, such as mushrooms, hedge hogs, and trees for instance, are also incapable of being good or evil. Like rocks, they are amoral entities.

So who in your'opinon was the tree called "the tree of knowledge of good and evil"?



JW