Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[onewithhim]

[Replying to Tcg in post #2199]

There may have been people that were hoping for the end over the past millennia, but if we examine the Scriptures we can see that there never before have been the elements of the end of the system of things that we can deduce now. Jesus said that one of the signs of the end of the age would be war of the kind that is unprecedented. There have been wars since time began, but never a world war. That's why the first WW was called a world war....World War I. Unprecedented. This happened in 1914. That began the last days of this system of things. Read Matthew chapter 24 again. All the things Jesus said would signify the end of the system, and we see the things he mentioned along with the nations rising against nations. It's all happening now, in unprecedented amounts. Earthquakes (see Luke 21), lawlessness, famine, diseases.....like never before.

Look up the Immense Image of Daniel chapter 2 on Google and notice where we are on this image. We are in the feet, and the feet is the last Kingdom before God's own Kingdom takes over the earth. We are so close now. Centuries ago the people did not have the prophecies coming true like we have today.

.

[JehovahsWitness]

I agree.

How close we are to the and we cannot say for sure, but it is , I believe, imminent. I can only hope this memorial will be our last. The brotherhood looks to Jehovah as we enter this most important of weeks.

Agape to all my beloved brothers and sisters worldwide,




JW

[William]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

What is the question for debate?

[myth-one.com]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

What is the question for debate?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"?

[William]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

What is the question for debate?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"?

Yes - since that was the only question in the OP, I thought that the likely candidate.
I also thought;

"There could be many relevant answers to the question, none of which I can identify as being debatable..."

Even if the question for debate wanted a simply 'yes' or 'no'.

[William]

Now clearly, the question was asked 6 years ago and the thread has developed into - reading the posts - a type of fortification/haven/campsite for the Jehovah's Witnesses to specifically have a place in which to argue their belief as to future events...

Perhaps in that, it became what it was intended...

But still, the OP subject which states...;

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

shows that here is a question within that statement - which again doesn't really ask anything debatable, because it is framed rhetorically.
The two questions...;
Q: Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

Q: If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"?

...do appear to be rhetorical, rather than anything which can clearly be debated.

If I were to answer the first question with "I don't want to" and give good logical well thought out reason for why - then I open myself to JW proselyting , which is evidence that the topic itself is not one for actual debate.

viewtopic.php?p=838349#p838349

William: "The Earth is too small to enjoy forever."

A Jehovah Witness [onewithhim] proselyting "No. If all the people who ever lived were brought back, we all would have at least an acre to ourselves. Not all will be resurrected, esp. those who fight God & Jesus right to the end. There will be room. If more people are born, God will either stop reproduction OR there might be options far out in the universe in other solar systems. We'll wait and see."

Clearly the reply to my answer was not debating my answer but proselyting JW beliefs.
Clearly the OP asks a question specific to now, rather than some believed-in future event.

Nonetheless I go along with it ... most likely because I did not fully appreciate at that time [Tue Jan 03, 2017 10:35 pm] that the OP was not asking a question for debate...that the thread was not intended to be one of debating the OP's rhetorical questions

[This in turn gave opportunity for more proselyting re JW beliefs]

onewithhim: "Points taken. I agree that main-line religious thought is and has been politically motivated, for centuries upon centuries. But actually no religion (except JWs) has recently taught very much about a Savior coming to save mankind and set everything right . "

viewtopic.php?p=840697#p840697

We both back and forth for a few posts after this but this in itself had more to do with JW beliefs than the thread OP and supposed "questions for debate".

______________________________________________

So re the evidence, is it honest to identify this thread as one of debate [re the OP] or is it simply an established place in which JWs can get about proselyting JW beliefs?

Since there is no subforum for specific Christian-denomination proselyting, is it fair that the JW's have such a thread, which is obviously for the purpose of proselyting, in the debate section ?

[Because, as I pointed out, the actual questions which are asked in the OP, are rhetorical in nature and as such, are not really debatable.]

[JehovahsWitness]

... the actual questions which are asked in the OP, are rhetorical in nature and as such, are not really debatable.

One cannot debate one's feelings but there is nothing in the forum rules that prohibits sharing them. Still if you do not want to answer the questions asked, you are, if I am not mistaken, under no obligation to do so.

The fact is most normal people cherish life and wish to continue living. Since the bible promises humans everlasting life in our physical bodies right here on this our planet earth, it calls into question the teaching of life after death or even the popular (but biblically untenible) teaching that all good people going to heaven. Indeed this idea (that no humans can cease to exist ie. nobody ever really dies...) is a mainstay of most, if not all of the worlds religions, as amusing as it is to those of us that know scripture well.

These unbiblical teaching make nonsense of the bible and in my experience turn clear thinkers that value logic and reason away from the appealing information in scripture.


JW

[JehovahsWitness]

"Forever and ever"??? What does that mean exactly? The Greek words used are "aion aion". Aion means "age". How can an age mean forever, much less forever and ever.

#QUESTION: Is there anything in scripture to imply Aion(s) can be never ending?

Yes; while in most cases in the bible an AION definitely does end (whether we can see what that end is or not) however, the word basically means "an age(s)" and by implication an AION (age/epoch) CAN be "everlasting".

When Jesus spoke of aionios sin, contrasting it with sin that can be forgiven the implication is evidently that this catatory of sin is "everlasting" or without possibility of forgiveness.

Truly I say to YOU that all things will be forgiven the sons of men, no matter what sins and blasphemies they blasphemously commit. 29 However, whoever blasphemes against the holy spirit has no forgiveness forever, but is guilty of everlasting [aionios] sin." - NWT

Furthermore, humans are promised AIONIOS life, which is contrasted with that which is temporal; implying that this type of life at least has the possibility of being unending.

Furthermore, the world is passing away and so is its desire, but he that does the will of God remains forever.

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him will not perish , but have aionios life.

Again, this is not to say the word means "unending" it does not it means "of the age(s)" but it would be unscripturally restrictive to say that it MUST have an end. In view of the above and to respect the full scope of the word as reflected by its hebrew equivalent of "unseen", in context one can say no more than it might have and and it might not.

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

EVERLASTING LIFE, IMMORTALITY and ...THE PURPOSE OF LIFE

[JehovahsWitness]

X

[William]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #2207]

So re the evidence, is it honest to identify this thread as one of debate [re the OP] or is it simply an established place in which JWs can get about proselyting JW beliefs?

Since there is no subforum for specific Christian-denomination proselyting, is it fair that the JW's have such a thread, which is obviously for the purpose of proselyting, in the debate section ?

[Because, as I pointed out, the actual questions which are asked in the OP, are rhetorical in nature and as such, are not really debatable.]

One cannot debate one's feelings but there is nothing in the forum rules that prohibits sharing them.

Sure. There are sub-forums for such sharing.
index.php#:~:text=LAST%20POST-,General% ... wable%20by
or even
index.php#:~:text=11%3A46%20pm-,Members ... chat%20for

Still if you do not want to answer the questions asked, you are, if I am not mistaken, under no obligation to do so.

Rhetorical questions are not meant to be answered, let alone debated. That is my point.

The fact is most normal people cherish life and wish to continue living.

There are different reasons why people might 'cherish life and wish to continue living'.

Since the bible promises humans everlasting life in our physical bodies right here on this our planet earth, it calls into question the teaching of life after death or even the popular (but biblically untenible) teaching that all good people going to heaven.

Whatever. That is just opportunist JW proselyting - which might be fine to do in the sub-forums I linked, but doesn't have anything to do with the OP questions, which are not even questions for debate. The questions are just asking for peoples views, not peoples biblical interpretations.

Q: Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

I for one do not. What is to debate?

Q: If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"?

What kind of question is that for debate? It would depend on the individuals circumstances. It would depend upon how the God would go about asking. None of that was mentioned...it makes the question non-sensible.