Paradise on Earth

Exploring the details of Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
onewithhim
Savant
Posts: 7441
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
Location: Norwich, CT
Has thanked: 632 times
Been thanked: 147 times

Paradise on Earth

Post #1

Post by onewithhim »

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 18071
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 431 times
Been thanked: 656 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2161

Post by JehovahsWitness »

myth-one.com wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 12:11 pm


John 11:26 wrote:And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
I Corinthians 15:22 wrote:For as in Adam all die, . . .
Hebrews 9:27 wrote:And it is appointed unto men once to die, . . .
So the Bible states that all will die and some will never die???

Believest thou these three verses??

I believe everything in the bible, don't you?






JW
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

myth-one.com
Savant
Posts: 6070
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:16 pm
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 58 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2162

Post by myth-one.com »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 12:23 pm
I believe everything in the bible, don't you?
But you constantly argue against what is in the Bible.

Why is that?

<==========================================>

For example:
JW wrote:Humans that never die ​can never be raised to spirit life.
Absolutely false according to the Bible.

User avatar
tam
Savant
Posts: 5562
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:59 pm
Has thanked: 244 times
Been thanked: 205 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2163

Post by tam »

Just popping in (peace to you both!),


It is true that some will never die, but it is not true that a person has to die in order to receive the new body (the spirit body), or to reign with Christ in His Kingdom for a thousand years.


From the verses mentioned:

“I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live, even though he dies. And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die."


The ones who are alive when He returns, and who believe in Him, will never die.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

And,

Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.


So we will not all sleep (we will not all die). Even so, the one who is in Christ, who is alive when Christ returns, will indeed be changed 'in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet' (see previous verse from Thessalonians, as to what occurs at that trumpet).




Peace again to you both,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy
- Non-religious Christian spirituality

- For Christ (who is the Spirit)

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 18071
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 431 times
Been thanked: 656 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2164

Post by JehovahsWitness »

myth-one.com wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 1:34 pm
JW wrote:Humans that never die ​can never be raised to spirit life.
Absolutely false according to the Bible.
Am I supposed to just take your word on that or do you have some scriptures to show me in this regard?
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 18071
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 431 times
Been thanked: 656 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2165

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 2:00 pm
The ones who are alive when He returns, and who believe in Him, will never die.
Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.
So we ...we will not all die. Even so, the one who is in Christ, who is alive when Christ returns, will indeed be changed 'in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at ' (see previous verse from Thessalonians, as to what occurs at that trumpet).




Thank you for sharing



JW
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

User avatar
tam
Savant
Posts: 5562
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:59 pm
Has thanked: 244 times
Been thanked: 205 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2166

Post by tam »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:11 pm
tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 2:00 pm
The ones who are alive when He returns, and who believe in Him, will never die.
Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.
So we ...we will not all die. Even so, the one who is in Christ, who is alive when Christ returns, will indeed be changed 'in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at ' (see previous verse from Thessalonians, as to what occurs at that trumpet).
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain [=#008080]will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord. [/color]



Thank you for sharing



JW
Of course.

Also added in the other relevant verse. Paul is clearly describing some who are in Christ who are ALIVE (not dead - as is clearly stated) when Christ returns. The dead are raised... and ..."we who are alive and who remain" will be caught up together with them (the dead who are raised) to meet the Lord in the air. If everyone in Christ was dead, Paul would have said we will all sleep (instead of saying the exact opposite: we will NOT all sleep).



Peace again to you.
- Non-religious Christian spirituality

- For Christ (who is the Spirit)

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 18071
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 431 times
Been thanked: 656 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2167

Post by JehovahsWitness »

paul wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm We will not all sleep
tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm we ...we will not all die


1 CORINTHIANS 15:50 - English Standard Version

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable
1 CORINTHIANS 15: 35, 36, 44

Yes, with what sort of body are they coming?” You unreasonable person! What you sow is not made alive unless first it dies ... It is sown a physical body; it is raised up a spiritual body.
ROMANS 6: 4 , 5

We were therefore buried with Him through baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may walk in newness of life. For if we have been united with Him like this in His death, we will certainly also be united with Him in His resurrection



Thanks for sharing


JW
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:20 pm, edited 6 times in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

User avatar
tam
Savant
Posts: 5562
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:59 pm
Has thanked: 244 times
Been thanked: 205 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2168

Post by tam »

Peace to you,
JehovahsWitness wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:02 pm
paul wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm We will not all sleep
tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm we ...we will not all die.
Thanks for sharing


JW
Um... so you don't understand that sleep is used in place of die?

(and this still overlooks the fact that Paul mentioned 'we who are alive and who remain')
- Non-religious Christian spirituality

- For Christ (who is the Spirit)

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 18071
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 431 times
Been thanked: 656 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2169

Post by JehovahsWitness »

paul wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm ....we who are alive and remain --->

will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air...
tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:06 pm

... 'we who are alive and who remain' --->
tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm ...we will not all die

SCRIPTURES SAYS ....

1 CORINTHIANS 15:50 - English Standard Version

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable
1 CORINTHIANS 15: 35, 36, 44

Yes, with what sort of body are they coming?” You unreasonable person! What you sow is not made alive unless first it dies ... It is sown a physical body; it is raised up a spiritual body.
tam wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm we ...we will not all die
paul wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 3:41 pm We will not all sleep
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Jan 20, 2022 4:50 pm, edited 5 times in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

myth-one.com
Savant
Posts: 6070
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:16 pm
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 58 times
Contact:

Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #2170

Post by myth-one.com »

[Replying to tam in post #2168]

Death: the act of dying; the end of life; the total and permanent cessation of all the vital functions of an animal or plant -- Random House College Dictionary

Two "deaths" are defined in the Bible, the first and the second.

The "first death" is appointed to all mankind.

The second death is optional depending on whether one accepts or rejects Jesus as their Savior.

But every human who ever died their first death will be resurrected.

Since all will be resurrected from the first death, the first death is not really a death as it is not permanent.

Therefore, the Bible usually refers to this death as sleep, slumber, or rest.

All believers will be awakened to everlasting spiritual bodied life at the Second Coming. Christians living at that time will be instantly born again as spirits and meet the others and Jesus in the air.

A thousand years later, the rest of the dead (nonbelievers) will be resurrected as humans and face judgment.

Following judgment, those whose names are not written in the Book of Life will be cast into the lake of fire and instantly suffer their "second death".

This death is the only true death as it is permanent.

Christian humans who die their first death will actually have everlasting life from birth. They live until their appointed death, then rest awaiting the resurrection, then are awakened to everlasting spiritual bodied life.

Post Reply