JESUS IS NOT GOD

Exploring the details of Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
onewithhim
Savant
Posts: 8904
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
Location: Norwich, CT
Has thanked: 1217 times
Been thanked: 305 times

JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #1

Post by onewithhim »

I would very much like to get opinions on this subject. I'll provide several verses from the King James Version of the Bible, and I ask you to give me feed-back.


Jesus' words:

1) "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise." (John 5:19)

2) "My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me." (John 7:16)

3) "Neither came I of myself, but he sent me." (John 8:42)

He replied, after the Pharisees accused him of making himself God:
4) "Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the SON of God?" (John 10:36)

5) "For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say....Whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak." (John 12:49,50)

6) To his Father in prayer: "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God , and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3)

7) "I ascend unto my Father, and your Father, and to my God, and your God." (John 20:17)

To John in the Revelation:
8) "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God..." (Revelation 3:12)



Do these quotations show that Jesus was NOT God?

Do YOU believe that he claimed to be God?

detniona
Student
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2022 12:25 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #381

Post by detniona »

Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:27 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:24 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:21 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:18 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:09 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:04 pm
I read it the first time.
You may have read it, but you didn't answer it. The question stands unanswered. The reason for that will remain a mystery.


Tcg
Here you are making another false statement to which I can
easily prove it.

My answer is my reply.

Now in order for you to win this debate you are going to have to prove
that my reply is not my answer.

To which you cannot.

You are a loser.
Until you provide an alternative to surfer Dave, you haven't answered my question.


Tcg
Here again you are making statements that not only have no merit
but that you cannot prove or offer no evidence at all to
substantiate any of it other than you just said so.

Wisdom may not be your strong suit but
stubbornness is.
The substantiation is the undeniable fact that you've offered no alternative to surfer Dave.


Tcg
Prove it.

User avatar
Tcg
Savant
Posts: 8487
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 am
Location: Third Stone
Has thanked: 2141 times
Been thanked: 2293 times

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #382

Post by Tcg »

detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:32 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:27 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:24 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:21 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:18 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:09 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:04 pm
I read it the first time.
You may have read it, but you didn't answer it. The question stands unanswered. The reason for that will remain a mystery.


Tcg
Here you are making another false statement to which I can
easily prove it.

My answer is my reply.

Now in order for you to win this debate you are going to have to prove
that my reply is not my answer.

To which you cannot.

You are a loser.
Until you provide an alternative to surfer Dave, you haven't answered my question.


Tcg
Here again you are making statements that not only have no merit
but that you cannot prove or offer no evidence at all to
substantiate any of it other than you just said so.

Wisdom may not be your strong suit but
stubbornness is.
The substantiation is the undeniable fact that you've offered no alternative to surfer Dave.


Tcg
Prove it.
No need. You've done it for me.


Tcg
To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.

- American Atheists


Not believing isn't the same as believing not.

- wiploc


I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.

- Irvin D. Yalom

detniona
Student
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2022 12:25 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #383

Post by detniona »

Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:36 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:32 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:27 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:24 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:21 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:18 pm
Tcg wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:09 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:04 pm
I read it the first time.
You may have read it, but you didn't answer it. The question stands unanswered. The reason for that will remain a mystery.


Tcg
Here you are making another false statement to which I can
easily prove it.

My answer is my reply.

Now in order for you to win this debate you are going to have to prove
that my reply is not my answer.

To which you cannot.

You are a loser.
Until you provide an alternative to surfer Dave, you haven't answered my question.


Tcg
Here again you are making statements that not only have no merit
but that you cannot prove or offer no evidence at all to
substantiate any of it other than you just said so.

Wisdom may not be your strong suit but
stubbornness is.
The substantiation is the undeniable fact that you've offered no alternative to surfer Dave.


Tcg
Prove it.
No need. You've done it for me.


Tcg
Cute and paste any part of anything you have said that I have proved it for you.

detniona
Student
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2022 12:25 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #384

Post by detniona »

You were easy to defeat.
But there again I have never been defeated.
Just the thought of my God makes me invincible.

User avatar
onewithhim
Savant
Posts: 8904
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
Location: Norwich, CT
Has thanked: 1217 times
Been thanked: 305 times

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #385

Post by onewithhim »

detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 7:40 pm
onewithhim wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 7:22 pm
detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 5:50 pm [Replying to Tcg in post #3]

Who is your Savoir?

A. God
B. Jesus
D. God is Jesus
C. None of the above.

Your answer_____________
My answer is God whose name is Jehovah. (Psalm 83:18, KJV)

Jesus is the means by which Jehovah saves. Therefore, both can be called "Savior."
Since you use the bible as your source I will go with it.
How do you justify the error in your doctrine as pointed out by this
from the bible? Isaiah 43:11
I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
Wherever "LORD" appears in the Old Testament---all capital letters---that is where the personal name of God is in the original Hebrew language. It is called the Tetragrammaton, and consists of four letters, YHWH. It has been removed from the Bible by men some years ago and appears in the King James Version only 4 times out of 7,000 times. You can see what should be there where "LORD" is written, at Psalm 83:18. There it says that Jehovah is the Most High, and his name should be, again, wherever the upper-case letters "LORD" appear. How sad that men have taken out God's name from his own book.

Some versions leave it in, such as Young's Literal Translation, The Divine Name King James Bible, The American Standard, The Living Bible.

User avatar
Difflugia
Prodigy
Posts: 3017
Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:25 am
Location: Michigan
Has thanked: 3247 times
Been thanked: 1997 times

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #386

Post by Difflugia »

detniona wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 9:45 pmYou were easy to defeat.
But there again I have never been defeated.
Just the thought of my God makes me invincible.
Everybody on these forums is undefeated. Just ask them.
My pronouns are he, him, and his.

Revelations won
Sage
Posts: 830
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:13 pm
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 27 times

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #387

Post by Revelations won »

Dear onewithhim,

The following found in Jude chapter 1 we find this testimony of Jude speaking of Jesus Christ:

Jude 1:
17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;
18 How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.
19 These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.
20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

Jude herein clearly identifies Jesus Christ as God and Savior…Are we to believe you or Jude?

Kind regards,
RW

myth-one.com
Savant
Posts: 7079
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:16 pm
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 85 times
Contact:

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #388

Post by myth-one.com »

Revelations won wrote: Sun Apr 03, 2022 10:03 pm Dear onewithhim,

The following found in Jude chapter 1 we find this testimony of Jude speaking of Jesus Christ:

Jude 1:
17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;
18 How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.
19 These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.
20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

Jude herein clearly identifies Jesus Christ as God and Savior…Are we to believe you or Jude?

Kind regards,
RW
Jesus Christ was a man:
1 Timothy 2:5 wrote:For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
And eternal life is a gift from God:
Romans 6:23 wrote:For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Jude 1:25 wrote:To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

Why do you not accept, or at least consider, that "God our Saviour" in Jude 1:25 refers to God the Father?

User avatar
onewithhim
Savant
Posts: 8904
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
Location: Norwich, CT
Has thanked: 1217 times
Been thanked: 305 times

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #389

Post by onewithhim »

Revelations won wrote: Sun Apr 03, 2022 10:03 pm Dear onewithhim,

The following found in Jude chapter 1 we find this testimony of Jude speaking of Jesus Christ:

Jude 1:
17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;
18 How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.
19 These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.
20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

Jude herein clearly identifies Jesus Christ as God and Savior…Are we to believe you or Jude?

Kind regards,
RW
It is JEHOVAH that is being referred to in verses 24 and 25. He is the supreme Savior, the One who chose Christ to be our Savior through what Christ did when on Earth. Jesus was the means by which Jehovah saved the world of mankind. They can both be called "Savior" though they are two individuals. They both had a hand in salvation. Jehovah willed it and Jesus carried out his God's instructions. (John 5:19)

Brightfame52
Sage
Posts: 815
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2022 5:33 am
Location: In the heavenlies in Christ
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: JESUS IS NOT GOD

Post #390

Post by Brightfame52 »

Jesus is God and the Man Christ Jesus the Mediator between God and Man

Post Reply