YHWH

[Wootah]

Y - the hand
H - reveals
W - the nail
H - reveals

How is anyone that believes YHWH is God able to negate the evidence above that YHWH is Jesus?

https://www.desiringgod.org/articles/je ... -is-yahweh

YHWH is the name above all names correct?

Philippians 2:9-11 says — Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.

Anyone want to directly confront both pieces of evidence?

[tam]

Peace to you RW,

Dear Pin Seeker,

As I have read your responses to Tam and JW, I compliment you on your clear presentations! You are on target and your points are well supported and established.

I suspect that the big problem is that both Tam and JW is that they both fail to understand and falsely assume that YHWH is God the Father. YHWH is God the Son. Christ himself clearly stated that his Father was "greater than he".

Christ did state that His Father is greater than him. I'm certainly not arguing against anything my Lord said. But the name of Christ is Jaheshua (meaning JAH saves/savior of JAH). He came in the name of His Father (whose name is JAH... most are referring to Him as [YHWH]). Prophets before Him had the name of God (JAH) in their names as well (or the title of God, "El").

Such as:
ELiJAH: my God is JAH
JeremIAH
EzekiEL
DaniEL
IsraEL


I believe I might have posted this earlier (perhaps on another thread), but Christ said that His Father is the One whom the Jews claimed as their God. The Jews claimed JAH (or YHWH) as their God.

"If I glorify myself, my glory means nothing. My Father, whom you claim as your God, is the one who glorifies me." John 8:54


Therefore, the God and Father of Christ is JAH.

Sing to God, sing praises to his name: extol him that rides on the heavens by his name JAH, and rejoice before him. Psalm 68:4

27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

First: I think it is very clear that Peter’s testimony in answer to Christ’s question was based upon "revelation from God the Father".

Second : Christ testified "For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works".

Do you realize that in the scriptures Christ is referred to as Son of man about 81 times?

If Christ were not God the Son, then he could not come in the glory of his Father and reward every man according to his works ?

The Son of God comes in the glory of His Father, and rewards every man according to his works. I don't see that I have suggested otherwise?

In the scriptures, Christ is referred to as the Son of Man, and He also states that He is the Son of God. I don't see where He refers to Himself as God the Son, though.

John 3:11
Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
12
If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?
13
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

It would appear the both Tam and JW have the same unbelief problem that the unbelieving Jew had in Christ's day.

I don't think I understand. What problem is that exactly?

I mean, I am not going to 'believe' something just because men teach it.

I accept what my Lord (Christ Jaheshua) teaches. He did not teach the trinity doctrine; and He did not teach that He was [YHWH].

He does teach that He is the Son of God. I am taking Him at His word. Nothing more; nothing less.

John 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

One should also observe that is was not Christ, but the unbelieving Jews who made the above false railing accusations against Christ. I love this beautiful response which Christ gives in the following verses.

19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

20 For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel.

21 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.

22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.


It might be well for anyone to gain new understanding from the above and understand one of the mysteries of godliness is the clear revelation that Jesus Christ is DIVINE and is indeed the the very SON of the Eternal FATHER. He is indeed Lord of lords and King of kings!

Indeed. Never argued otherwise.

The only difference seems to be in what you mean when you write the above; where you believe that Christ is [YHWH], and the Father is someone else, someone higher, but not named. If I have mistaken your belief, I apologize, please feel free to correct me.

He is the very Emmanuel or GOD with us as stated in:

Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Yes.

Was “Jesus the Christ” foreordained before the foundations of the earth were laid to become the savior of all mankind as stated by Peter?

The name of Christ is Jaheshua (he was never called 'Jesus'), but other than that, yes.

Is Jesus Christ indeed the very “Immanuel” or God with us as the scriptures clearly state?

Same as above.

Ise Jesus Christ the author and finisher of our salvation?

Same as above.

Is Jesus Christ the “Holy one of Israel” who alone, has provided the gift of resurrection for all mankind?

Christ Jaheshua is the Holy One of Israel. He is also the Holy One of God. Yes?

Simon Peter replied, “Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 We believe and know that You are the Holy One of God.

Christ is the Holy One (of Israel and of God).

God is the MOST Holy One.

Israel was given a very specific layout of the temple so as to help Israel get a sense of the spiritual.

Hence, no one could enter into the MOST Holy Place without passing first through the HOLY place. Just as no one comes to the Father (the MOST Holy One) except through the Son (the Holy One).

**

All that being said, Christ did not provide that gift alone. He received His authority and His power from His God and Father. I don't think you disagree on that part, but I could be mistaken.

Did not “Jesus the Christ “ truly have glory with the “Father” before he came to this earth as the literal “Son of God”?

Same as above, yes.

Did he not also by his sacrifice bring further glory to his father?

Yes.

You or I or anyone has NO authority from God to falsely claim that “Jesus the Christ” has made any mistake regarding his second coming.

Who has suggested that Christ made a mistake regarding His second coming? I certainly have not.

Ezekiel 37:11 Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.

12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.

13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,

14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.


I would challenge anyone to show from the scriptures that above scriptures found in Ezekiel 37:11-14 apply to anyone other than Jesus Christ.

He (God) gave His Son that authority and power. God does all of these things through His Son, His Holy One.

It might be well for anyone to gain new understanding from the above and understand one of the mysteries of godliness is the clear revelation that Jesus Christ is DIVINE and is indeed the the very SON of the Eternal FATHER. He is indeed Lord of lords and king of kings! He is the very Emmanuel or GOD with us as stated in:

Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Again, no argument on what is written here.





Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[PinSeeker]

As I have read your responses to Tam and JW, I compliment you on your clear presentations! You are on target and your points are well supported and established.

Thank you, RW.

I suspect that the big problem is that both Tam and JW is that they both fail to understand and falsely assume that YHWH is God the Father. YHWH is God the Son.

Yes. The only thing I would add -- and I feel sure you would agree; this is maybe outside the point you were making -- is that YHWH is also God the Holy Spirit. Not correcting you or anything like that, finishing the thought.

Christ himself clearly stated that his Father was "greater than he".

Right, and as I said earlier -- I think to you, and by extension to anyone else reading... I can't remember if it was this thread or another -- Christ was referencing the Father's and His positions, respective of each other, not in any sense either that the Father was "greater in divinity" than the Son or that the Son was "not divine." I feel sure again that you agree with that.

As I'm sure you well know, in John 17:1-5, Jesus prays to the Father that, having glorified Him on earth and having accomplished the work that He (the Father) gave Him (the Son) to do, that the Father glorify the Son in the Father's own presence with the glory that the Son had with the Father before the world existed. Jesus is speaking of a sharing of glory between the Father and the Son prior to creation, saying that there was mutual giving of honor in the interpersonal relationships of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit from all eternity! What a magnificent thing, right? Verse 1 of that passage is itself a claim to deity, since the Old Testament affirms that God will not give His glory to another (Isaiah 42:8, 48:11), and Jesus here calls on the Father with absolute certainty and confidence that the Father will restore to Him the same glory that the Father has and that they always had together! And, of course, even then, Christ still had it, it's just that He had humbled Himself and laid it aside for a time (Philippians 2) for the sake of man and making atonement for all sin (Philippians 2:5-11).

The John 5 passage you draw from is filled with multiple claims of divinity by Christ with the Father, and you're right, it is indeed beautiful. That's pretty much the theme of John's whole Gospel, from chapter 1 through chapter 21. And I love, love, LOVE Ezekiel 37 and the valley of dry bones... It all goes together.

It might be well for anyone to gain new understanding from the above and understand one of the mysteries of godliness is the clear revelation that Jesus Christ is DIVINE and is indeed the the very SON of the Eternal FATHER. He is indeed Lord of lords and king of kings! He is the very Emmanuel or GOD with us as stated in: Matthew 1:23 "Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us." I so personally Testify and bear personal witness that Jesus Christ is God the Son who, under the direction of God the Father, organized and created this earth and all things therein, and who is the very “Immanuel” or “God with us” as clearly stated in the scriptures. It is he alone who atoned for our sins and provided by his grace the free gift or common salvation known as the resurrection to all mankind.

Absolutely. Well said.

Pin Seeker keep up the good work! You have done well...

Thank you again, and the very same to you. To God be the glory, right?

...there are also in our day those who reject Christ's teachings and rely on their own "private interpretations" to base their opinions.

Yes. Paul says it well to Timothy, and by extension to us in 2nd Timothy 4:
.

"(3) For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, (4) and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths. (5) As for you, always be sober-minded, endure suffering, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry." (verse 5 is his exhortation to Timothy and us)

The scriptures truly mean just what they say.

Yes they do. God said what He meant, and He meant what He said.

Grace and peace to you, RW. And to all, of course.

[PinSeeker]

That's a great point about the prophets' names in the Old Testament and what they mean: "YHVH is..." "YHVH does..." etc. It's not just limited to the prophets, as some may be aware. And the great thing is, in the New Testament, we see Jesus say "I am..." and "I do..." to every single one of these things -- in addition to actually doing all the things mentioned. There is -- or should be, anyway -- no doubt that Christ is the Second Person of the triune Jehovah.

[onewithhim]

That's a great point about the prophets' names in the Old Testament and what they mean: "YHVH is..." "YHVH does..." etc. It's not just limited to the prophets, as some may be aware. And the great thing is, in the New Testament, we see Jesus say "I am..." and "I do..." to every single one of these things -- in addition to actually doing all the things mentioned. There is -- or should be, anyway -- no doubt that Christ is the Second Person of the triune Jehovah.

Jesus did not say "I AM," meaning that he is Jehovah. There are other translations of Exodus 3:14 (that Jesus supposedly quoted at John 8:58) that show that a better way of translating Exodus 3:14 is "I WILL be there howsoever I WILL be there" (Everett Fox) or "I WILL become whatsoever I please" (Rotherham) or "I WILL be that I WILL be" (Leeser).....to name just three examples. Therefore, your spurious insistence that Jesus quoted "I Am" in reference to himself doesn't hold water. He just as well would have said at John 8:58, "before Abraham came to be, I WILL." Does that make sense according to your view of Exodus 3:14? Clearly he did not apply Exodus 3:14 to himself. He was using fine grammatical Greek with superior knowledge of Hebrew to show merely that before Abraham existed, he existed. The way to correctly read John 8:58 is:

"Before Abraham was even born, I existed."

[PinSeeker]

That's a great point about the prophets' names in the Old Testament and what they mean: "YHVH is..." "YHVH does..." etc. It's not just limited to the prophets, as some may be aware. And the great thing is, in the New Testament, we see Jesus say "I am..." and "I do..." to every single one of these things -- in addition to actually doing all the things mentioned. There is -- or should be, anyway -- no doubt that Christ is the Second Person of the triune Jehovah.

Jesus did not say "I AM," meaning that he is Jehovah. There are other translations of Exodus 3:14 (that Jesus supposedly quoted at John 8:58) that show that a better way of translating Exodus 3:14 is "I WILL be there howsoever I WILL be there" (Everett Fox) or "I WILL become whatsoever I please" (Rotherham) or "I WILL be that I WILL be" (Leeser).....to name just three examples. Therefore, your spurious insistence that Jesus quoted "I Am" in reference to himself doesn't hold water. He just as well would have said at John 8:58, "before Abraham came to be, I WILL." Does that make sense according to your view of Exodus 3:14? Clearly he did not apply Exodus 3:14 to himself. He was using fine grammatical Greek with superior knowledge of Hebrew to show merely that before Abraham existed, he existed. The way to correctly read John 8:58 is:

"Before Abraham was even born, I existed."

So say Jehovah's Witnesses and those who believe as they do. Wrongly. There is no doubt -- should be none, anyway -- that Christ is the Second Person of the triune Jehovah. Grace and peace to you.

[Eloi]

Does the Bible say that Jesus Christ is Jehovah, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob?

Of course not; That's what some confused believers say. What the Scripture says is this:

Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified his Servant, Jesus, whom you handed over and disowned before Pilate, even though he had decided to release him. 14 Yes, you disowned that holy and righteous one, and you asked for a man who was a murderer to be given to you, 15 whereas you killed the Chief Agent of life. But God raised him up from the dead, of which fact we are witnesses.

[PinSeeker]

Does the Bible say that Jesus Christ is Jehovah, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob? Of course not; That's what some confused believers say. What the Scripture says is this:

Acts 3:13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified his Servant, Jesus, whom you handed over and disowned before Pilate, even though he had decided to release him. 14 Yes, you disowned that holy and righteous one, and you asked for a man who was a murderer to be given to you, 15 whereas you killed the Chief Agent of life. But God raised him up from the dead, of which fact we are witnesses.

But it also says this:

He
(Jesus Christ)

is the image
(of the same essence -- in the same sense as Paul, the author of this passage, says in 1 Corinthians 15 that we bear the image of the man of dust, Adam... we are mere man just as he was, and so Jesus is exactly what the Father is)

of the invisible God
(Jehovah, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of our forefathers)

the firstborn of all creation.
(preeminent over all creation -- this is Paul's very point)
-- Colossians 1:15

As for Acts 3:13-14, yes, Jesus was (and is) the Father's "servant" in the sense that He did (and does) the will of the Father, as Jesus Himself said. This does absolutely nothing to lessen by one iota what Paul says in Colossians 1:15. Peter and Paul were together when Peter spoke in Solomon's portico here in Acts 3, and Paul wrote all his letters on these journeys documented in Acts. Paul in no way contradicts Peter but rather, in his writings, is in perfect harmony with Peter, who in Acts 2 said that Jesus was now, having ascended to heaven, was "exalted at the right hand of God," a clear Old Testament reference meaning Christ is both in a place of proximity to God the Father and in a position of power with the Father above all other powers. And Jesus the Messiah exists at this right hand of God today, perfectly reigning with God the Father and God the Spirit in community and power.

This is the problem with the Watchtower narrative, as I have said many times; it causes Paul to appear to contradict Peter (and vice-versa); indeed, it causes many passages of Scripture to appear to contradict one another, which is surely not the case. The "confusion" is on the part of Jehovah's Witnesses.

Grace and peace to all.

[Eloi]

Some people will find a BUT all the time (or a LOL or a WOW).

This is what the Biblia says:

Acts 5:30 The God of our forefathers raised up Jesus, whom you killed, hanging him on a stake. 31 God exalted this one as Chief Agent and Savior to his right hand, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins. 32 And we are witnesses of these matters, and so is the holy spirit, which God has given to those obeying him as ruler.”

Even Jesus himself spoke about the God of the forefathers of the Jews:

John 8:54 Jesus answered: “If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father who glorifies me, the one who you say is your God. 55 Yet you have not known him, but I know him. And if I said I do not know him, I would be like you, a liar. But I do know him and am observing his word.

Why are some people always looking for a BUT? Because they are not the worshipers that Jesus Christ referred to here:

John 4:21 Jesus said to her: “Believe me, woman, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews. 23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

[PinSeeker]

This is what the Biblia says:

Acts 5:30 The God of our forefathers raised up Jesus, whom you killed, hanging him on a stake. 31 God exalted this one as Chief Agent and Savior to his right hand, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins. 32 And we are witnesses of these matters, and so is the holy spirit, which God has given to those obeying him as ruler.”

And this verse too well establishes that Jesus is a distinct Person from the Father, but does absolutely nothing to lessen Christ's status as God and the second Person of the triune Jehovah. Same as above.

Even Jesus himself spoke about the God of the forefathers of the Jews:

John 8:54 Jesus answered: “If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father who glorifies me, the one who you say is your God. 55 Yet you have not known him, but I know him. And if I said I do not know him, I would be like you, a liar. But I do know him and am observing his word.

Yes, He did -- being also fully man (in addition to being fully God but having laid His status as God aside for a time [Philippians 2]) this makes perfect sense. And of course we know what Christ said a mere four verses after this one. Well. Some of us do, anyway; He applied the name God gave Himself in His conversation with Moses to Himself.

Why are some people always looking for a BUT? Because they are not the worshipers that Jesus Christ referred to here:

John 4:21 Jesus said to her: “Believe me, woman, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews. 23 Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

LOL! Well, first of all, verse 23 actually says that true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth (not "with spirit and truth," as if the worshiper somehow conjures up in himself this spirit and truth). Christ emphasizes this in verse 24, saying those who worship God must do so in (again, not "with") spirit and truth. As we well know, Christ is the truth, as Christ Himself said in John 14:6. And we also know that it is the Spirit -- the Holy Spirit, the third Person of the triune Jehovah -- Who gives this spiritual life; the flesh is no help at all, as Jesus says in John 6:63. And in the latter part of verse 63 and through verses 64 and 65, there, Jesus says "The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life. But there are some of you who do not believe. This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father." These are false worshipers, and in so doing, Jesus implicitly clarifies what He says in John 4. True worshipers are those whom the Spirit has given spiritual life and are in Christ (rather than in Adam) -- those who truly worship in spirit (because they have been made alive spiritually by the Holy Spirit, as both Paul and Peter say) and in truth (in Christ and His righteousness).

So, the case is actually that those who are not the worshipers that Jesus Christ referred to in John 4 are those who do not have true spiritual life given them by the Holy Spirit and therefore do not worship the triune Jehovah in Christ, Who Himself is truth. Salvation is of the LORD; the Father wills life to those whom He chooses (elects), the Son accomplishes salvation for those whom the Father has chosen (the Father's Elect), and the Spirit issues the call of the Father and works faith in those whom the Father has chosen (the Father's Elect) at their appointed (by the Father) times. Yes, salvation is surely of the LORD -- all three Persons of YHVH, the One True God.

I do love God's inerrant, infallible Word.

Grace and peace to all.

Yeah, so, again, grace and peace to you all.

[Revelations won]

Dear Tam and Pinseeker,

Thank you for your well stated posts # 171 and #172 I think you both did a commendable job!

Kind regards
RW