GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

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shawnskin
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GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #1

Post by shawnskin »

I get hung up right in genesis when after he creates us and we sin he regrets making us. (and all powerful being should not have regrets ) I believe there’s a God, Or more accurately something going on so far beyond our understanding that Other than a small glimpse our human minds are not capable of understanding it. our brains/egos would rather make something up and admit we don’t understand, come to believe that people Who think they know Gods will ,understand him ,and can speak for him ,are either delusional Or deceitful...I believe we have created God In our on image.and What is really going on iso much more amazing than we can ever imagine

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #2

Post by shawnskin »

God has feelings. human emotions love ,hate, JEALOUSY? he created this huge universe and then just put life on this one planet ..He spends all his time watching us and pulling strings in mysterious ways and leaving little clues here and there to let us know he’s around. We’re like a reality TV show that heaven and hell are watching and influencing? Surely God has better things to do..

I have to believe God is way cooler than that.I have to believe we are more than a chess match between heaven and hell. Trying to imagine technology 3 million years from now I believe is the same as trying to understand God..Caveman trying to understand computer programming

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #3

Post by JehovahsWitness »

[Replying to post 6 by JehovahsWitness]

QUESTION: How can a perfect God "regret"?
Genesis 6:
[6] And it repented [regretted] the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
Various scriptures in the bible speak of God feeling "regret" or "repenting" of certain actions. The original Hebrew word translated into the English is NaHaM and it basically pertains to a change of attitude or intention. While in humans this may be due to past errors this is not inherent in the word itself. Just as someone may say "I'm sorry it has come to this" reflecting not necessarily an error on their part but a feeling of regret that events have lead to a particular action, God was "sorry" or "repented" (naham) at the way humans had exercised their free will had necessitated a "change in intended actions" on His part. G. J. Wenham, an Old Testament scholar at Cambridge University, writes:
"'Regret' or 'repent' may suggest a change of attitude, but when God 'repents,' he starts to act differently. Here [Gen. 6:6] and in 1 Sam 15:11 and Jer 18:10 he regrets some good thing he has done for his people, whereas in Exod 32:12, 14; 2 Sam. 24:16; Amos 7:3, 6 he repents of some evil he is carrying out. That God should change his mind might lead to his being accused of capriciousness, which Scripture firmly denies: 'God is not a son of man that he should repent' (Num 23:19; Cf. 1 Sam 15:29). Such remarks obviously raise various questions for the doctrine of divine sovereignty and its correlate human responsibility, but theological systematization is hardly the concern of the biblical narrators. For them divine repentance is a response to man's changes of heart, whether for better or worse" - Wenham, J. G. Genesis 1-15. Waco, Texas: Word, 1987, 144.


CONCLUSION verses such as Genesis 6:6 does not support the idea that God makes mistakes or errors, rather it reflects his feelings about the need He saw to "change his mind" as to his intended treatment of humans due to their own wicked actions. See NOTES below viewtopic.php?p=1018449#p1018449


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS


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Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:26 am, edited 7 times in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #4

Post by shawnskin »

Thanks Jehovah I appreciate you taking the time to give a surprisingly logical answer.It appears intelligent Christians have Come up with a good Answer to reconcile God having regrets..

I vaguely remember my brother a devout Christian and part-time preacher using several translation books to get to the bottom of what The Bible was really trying to say. Like a child from the 50s using his decoder ring to solve a puzzle in the back of his comic book.(they must not of had the right decoder ring at the council of Nicaea) Although Being a JW you probably don’t use the king James version..


I don’t know I’m not well informed enough on the translations to speak intelligently on them.. however it does seem like a convenient way to make sense of inconsistencies or worse redefine the scripture to fit the narrative you want to Believe or tell.

if we Had been a little less ambitious building the tower of babel we Could’ve had a Bible With no translation in the same language we all be speaking, I guess we can thank that Nimrod KING Nimrod..

I Grew up a believing Christian Who always tried to spread the word and Convince nonbelievers the Bible was the word of God the older I got the more I realized I was only trying To convince myself..

I have no doubt there’s Intelligence Behind the experience we are all currently sharing.
Maybe once language isn’t a barrier and computers are translating for us seamlessly ..We can come together and start scratching the surface of the riddle..

We just Gotta make sure to keep our egos in check this time so God doesn’t come back down and confound the language on us again...

his temper is short and his hand is heavy just like my dad was after a 12 pack of Natural light!!!!

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #5

Post by 2timothy316 »

shawnskin wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:58 am God has feelings. human emotions love ,hate, JEALOUSY?
Yes. But It's not that God has human emotions but that we have God's emotions. "Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness..." Gen 1:26. Although we were created in the likeness of God our emotions are skewed due to our sinful state. Think of a fun house and it's Hall of Mirrors, with it's misshaped mirrors. Sin distorts our images. Our hate my not always reflect God's hate. It can be corrected some through study of the Bible but we will all still fall short of the perfect proper display of emotions by God.
he created this huge universe and then just put life on this one planet ..He spends all his time watching us and pulling strings in mysterious ways and leaving little clues here and there to let us know he’s around. We’re like a reality TV show that heaven and hell are watching and influencing? Surely God has better things to do..
Sadly this is the picture that many cartoons, movies and TV shows portray the Almighty God. Some old man in a white robe. Aloof, or mean or sometimes a raving lunatic. However, this is not the case. The Almighty God, "loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life. For God did not send his Son into the world for him to judge the world, but for the world to be saved through him." John 3:16, 17.

“I myself well know the thoughts that I am thinking toward you, . . . thoughts of peace, and not of calamity, to give you a future and a hope.”​—JEREMIAH 29:11.

Psalm 8:4 says, "What is mortal man that you keep him in mind, And a son of man that you take care of him?" God is not so prideful that he doesn't think about us and our situation. He is very active in trying to help us to attain a better life. He has left us the Bible which is packed full useful information. Including what He thinks of mankind and what He wants for them. This is not a reality TV show to Him. It is to Satan though. This master of wickedness wants all to view God as a washed-up old man.
I have to believe God is way cooler than that.I have to believe we are more than a chess match between heaven and hell. Trying to imagine technology 3 million years from now I believe is the same as trying to understand God..Caveman trying to understand computer programming
God is way cooler than what many portray Him as. This is no chess match for Him as our lives are no game to Him. They are to Satan though. Death, disease, disasters, hunger etc. Satan will cause whatever to try to prove that the Almighty is not worth following. The book of Job dives into this challenge. Interesting you'd say 'cavemen trying to understand computer programming because in Job God says to Job, "Then Jehovah answered Job out of the windstorm: “Who is this who is obscuring my counsel And speaking without knowledge? Brace yourself, please, like a man;I will question you, and you inform me. Where were you when I founded the earth? Tell me, if you think you understand." Job 38:1-4. This chapter and the next after it Jehovah God is indeed asking Job 'what do you know of anything'. Even today mankind can't explain how life came to be on the Earth. No one knows. God knows though. It's His design. However, God doesn't have to tell us anything. Yet He has given us a Bible so, "that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work." He is not going to share everything He knows. Mankind has proven that we are not responsible with power. The destruction of our own planet and the hydrogen atom bomb is proof of that. Imagine the horror if we knew how to create our own life-forms from nothing. Though right now there are people trying to do this very thing.

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #6

Post by JehovahsWitness »

shawnskin wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:08 am Thanks Jehovah['s Witness] I appreciate you taking the time to give a surprisingly logical answer.It appears intelligent Christians have Come up with a good Answer to reconcile God having regrets..
You're most welcome. We all rely on the skill and integrity of bible translators and your brother had the right idea in looking to serveral different translations to get a good overall picture of what the original thought would have been. I don't believe God is shortempered or heavy handed on the contrary he is loving, patient and kind. His beautiful personality is revealed in the bible... maybe you should consider giving scripture a second chance.



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Free online bible lesson #2 Who Is God, the Creator?
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/o ... tor/#start
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #7

Post by Icey »

shawnskin wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:37 am I get hung up right in genesis when after he creates us and we sin he regrets making us. (and all powerful being should not have regrets ) I believe there’s a God, Or more accurately something going on so far beyond our understanding that Other than a small glimpse our human minds are not capable of understanding it. our brains/egos would rather make something up and admit we don’t understand, come to believe that people Who think they know Gods will ,understand him ,and can speak for him ,are either delusional Or deceitful...I believe we have created God In our on image.and What is really going on iso much more amazing than we can ever imagine
Simply being all powerful doesn't mean you can't regret something to my mind.
The concept of an all knowing 'thing' being surprised by what something imperfect did is stupid IMO. No all knowing 'thing' worth anything couldn't have seen what was coming. Thinking God didn't know what Adam and Eve would do is beyond silly to me and should be to everyone.

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #8

Post by Miles »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:01 am [Replying to post 6 by JehovahsWitness]

QUESTION: How can a perfect God "regret"?
Genesis 6:
[6] And it repented [regretted] the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
Various scriptures in the bible speak of God feeling "regret" or "repenting" of certain actions.
Or was "sorry." Source: many Bibles.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:01 am The original Hebrew word translated into the English is NaHaM and it basically pertains to a change of attitude or intention.
Not according to the authors of Strong's Concordance who write:

" נָחַם nâcham, naw-kham'; a primitive root; properly, to sigh, i.e. breathe strongly; by implication, to be sorry, i.e. (in a favorable sense) to pity, console or (reflexively) rue; or (unfavorably) to avenge (oneself):—comfort (self), ease (one's self), repent(-er,-ing, self)."

Not a thing about נָחַם nâcham basically pertaining to a change of attitude or intention. And no one, other than JWs perhaps, say there is.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:01 am While in humans this may be due to past errors this is not inherent in the word itself.
Then show your work. Show us your evidence that נָחַם nâcham doesn't mean being sorry, regretful or repentant.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:01 am Just as someone may say "I'm sorry it has come to this" reflecting not necessarily an error on their part
Of course not because they aren't attaching themselves as the perpetrator of "it." God does! (See Genesis 6:6 and 1 Samuel 15:35 verses below)
JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:01 am but a feeling of regret that events have lead to a particular action, God was "sorry" or "repented" (naham) at the way humans had exercised their free will had necessitated a "change in intended actions" on His part. G. J. Wenham, an Old Testament scholar at Cambridge University, writes:
Malarky! He repented, regretted, or was sorry for what HE HAD DONE.

Genesis 6:6
KJ21
And the Lord repented that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him in His heart.

AMPC
And the Lord regretted that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved at heart.

ERV
The Lord was sorry that he had made people on the earth. It made him very sad in his heart.

1 Samuel 15:35
CEV
Even though Samuel felt sad about Saul, Samuel never saw him again. The Lord was sorry he had made Saul the king of Israel.

KJ21
And Samuel came no more to see Saul until the day of his death. Nevertheless Samuel mourned for Saul; and the Lord repented that He had made Saul king over Israel.

CEB
Samuel never saw Saul again before he died, but he grieved over Saul. However, the Lord regretted making Saul king over Israel.

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:01 am CONCLUSION verses such as Genesis 6:6 does not support the idea that God makes mistakes or errors, rather it reflects his feelings about the need He saw to "change his mind" as to his intended treatment of humans due to their own wicked actions.
But only if you ignore what is written in the bible---"He made"---and attach convenient, but unwarranted, new meanings to "repented," "regretted," and "sorry."

.

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #9

Post by JehovahsWitness »

NOTES

The word about נָחַם nâcham means “to sigh, i.e., to breathe strongly.” Hence, by implication, to breathe a sigh of relief, to feel sorry, to feel regret. It pertains or relates or is associated with a change in attitude or intention.
Miles wrote: Mon Jul 27, 2020 7:28 pm...no one, other than JWs perhaps, say there is.
TRANSLATIONS

NACHAM : The NAS Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon
NAS Word Usage - Total: 109
am sorry 1, appeased 1, become a consolation 1, change mind 6, change minds 1, changed mind 4, comfort 30, comforted 18, comforter 2, comforters 4, comforts 2, console 3, consolers 1, consoling 1, give rest 1, have compassion 2, moved to pity 1, regret 1, regretted 1, relent 5, relented 4, relenting 3, relents 1, relieved 1, repent 3, repented 2, sorry 6, think better 1, when the time of mourning was ended 2

source: https://www.biblestudytools.com/lexicon ... acham.html

EXODUS 13:17 New King James Version
Then it came to pass, when Pharaoh had let the people go, that God did not lead them by way of the land of the Philistines, although that was near; for God said, “Lest perhaps the people change their minds [nacham] when they see war, and return to Egypt.”

Various other translations
https://biblehub.com/exodus/13-17.htm
COMMENTARIES
“Generally translated ‘repent’ (in the passive form) ‘comfort’ (in the intensive form). Actually the word means ‘to take a breath of relief.’ . . . [and] has to do with ‘change of attitude,’ ‘change of mind,’ any other association being accidental. . . . When the word is translated ‘repent,’ as frequently of God, it means ‘change of mind or intention.’” - The Interpreter’s Bible, Vol. 1, p. 225

"It repented Jehovah.—A peculiarly strong anthropopathic expression, which, however, presents the truth that God, in consistency with his immutability, assumes a changed position in respect to changed man ( Psalm 18:27)..." - Lange's Commentary on the Holy Scriptures: Critical, Doctrinal, and Homiletical
https://www.studylight.org/commentaries ... sis-6.html

"'Regret' or 'repent' may suggest a change of attitude, but when God 'repents,' he starts to act differently. Here [Gen. 6:6] and in 1 Sam 15:11 and Jer 18:10 he regrets some good thing he has done for his people, whereas in Exod 32:12, 14; 2 Sam. 24:16; Amos 7:3, 6 he repents of some evil he is carrying out... For [biblical narrators] divine repentance is a response to man's changes of heart, whether for better or worse" - Wenham, J. G. Genesis 1-15. Waco, Texas: Word, 1987, 144
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Re: GOD has regrets? how can an omnipotent being regret something?

Post #10

Post by Miles »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:24 pm NOTES

The word about נָחַם nâcham means “to sigh, i.e., to breathe strongly.” Hence, by implication, to breathe a sigh of relief, to feel sorry, to feel regret. It pertains or relates or is associated with a change in attitude or intention.
Miles wrote: Mon Jul 27, 2020 7:28 pm...no one, other than JWs perhaps, say there is.
TRANSLATIONS

NACHAM : The NAS Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon
NAS Word Usage - Total: 109
am sorry 1, appeased 1, become a consolation 1, change mind 6, change minds 1, changed mind 4, comfort 30, comforted 18, comforter 2, comforters 4, comforts 2, console 3, consolers 1, consoling 1, give rest 1, have compassion 2, moved to pity 1, regret 1, regretted 1, relent 5, relented 4, relenting 3, relents 1, relieved 1, repent 3, repented 2, sorry 6, think better 1, when the time of mourning was ended 2

source: https://www.biblestudytools.com/lexicon ... acham.html
TRANSLATIONS

NACHAM : The NAS Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon

NAS Word Usage - Total: 109
am sorry 1, appeased 1, become a consolation 1, change mind 6, change minds 1, changed mind 4, comfort 30, comforted 18, comforter 2, comforters 4, comforts 2, console 3, consolers 1, consoling 1, give rest 1, have compassion 2, moved to pity 1, regret 1, regretted 1, relent 5, relented 4, relenting 3, relents 1, relieved 1, repent 3, repented 2, sorry 6, think better 1, when the time of mourning was ended 2
JehovahsWitness wrote: EXODUS 13:17 New King James Version
Then it came to pass, when Pharaoh had let the people go, that God did not lead them by way of the land of the Philistines, although that was near; for God said, “Lest perhaps the people change their minds [nacham] when they see war, and return to Egypt.”

Various other translations
https://biblehub.com/exodus/13-17.htm

GENESIS 6:6 New King James Version

And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart.

Various other translations
https://biblehub.com/genesis/6-6.htm
JehovahsWitness wrote: COMMENTARIES
“Generally translated ‘repent’ (in the passive form) ‘comfort’ (in the intensive form). Actually the word means ‘to take a breath of relief.’ . . . [and] has to do with ‘change of attitude,’ ‘change of mind,’ any other association being accidental. . . . When the word is translated ‘repent,’ as frequently of God, it means ‘change of mind or intention.’” - The Interpreter’s Bible, Vol. 1, p. 225
Sorry, but when people use quotes in such a manner and leave stuff out (your ellipses), they render it worthless.
JehovahsWitness wrote: "It repented Jehovah.—A peculiarly strong anthropopathic expression, which, however, presents the truth that God, in consistency with his immutability, assumes a changed position in respect to changed man ( Psalm 18:27)..." - Lange's Commentary on the Holy Scriptures: Critical, Doctrinal, and Homiletical
https://www.studylight.org/commentaries ... sis-6.html
Yup, he changed his position and was sorry for what he did. Repented what he did. Regretted what he did.
JehovahsWitness wrote: "'Regret' or 'repent' may suggest a change of attitude, but when God 'repents,' he starts to act differently. Here [Gen. 6:6] and in 1 Sam 15:11 and Jer 18:10 he regrets some good thing he has done for his people, whereas in Exod 32:12, 14; 2 Sam. 24:16; Amos 7:3, 6 he repents of some evil he is carrying out... For [biblical narrators] divine repentance is a response to man's changes of heart, whether for better or worse" - Wenham, J. G. Genesis 1-15. Waco, Texas: Word, 1987, 144
But in the English language when 59 Bibles all agree that god either: felt sorry, repented, regretted, or was "very sad" (NIRV) for what he did, the inescapable conclusion is not that he simply had a "change in attitude or intention.," but that he actually:

re·greted
/rəˈɡret/ed

verb: regret; 3rd person present: regrets; past tense: regretted; past participle: regretted; gerund or present participle: regretting
felt sad, repentant, or disappointed over



re·pented
/rəˈpent/ed

verb: repent; 3rd person present: repents; past tense: repented; past participle: repented; gerund or present participle: repenting
felt or expressed sincere regret or remorse about one's wrongdoing or sin.



[was] sor·ry
/ˈsärē,ˈsôrē/
Learn to pronounce
adjective
adjective: sorry; comparative adjective: sorrier; superlative adjective: sorriest

feeling regret or penitence.
Similar: regretful remorseful contrite repentant rueful penitent



[was] sad
/sad/
adjective
adjective: sad; comparative adjective: sadder; superlative adjective: saddest

1. feeling or showing sorrow; unhappy.


for what he had done.
And why would he do this? Because he made a mistake.

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