Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Exploring the details of Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
Miles
Prodigy
Posts: 3345
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:19 pm
Has thanked: 255 times
Been thanked: 921 times

Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #1

Post by Miles »

.


After reading another thread mentioning Jehovah's Witnesses I became interested in their beliefs about blood. They reject blood transfusions and don't eat meat with more than a trace of blood in it. Searching around a bit I came across the following from a pro-JW web site.


"Do Jehovah's Witnesses Eat Red Meat Since it May Contain a Trace of Blood?

Though Christians are to abstain from blood (Acts 15:29), the Bible shows that the eating of flesh by Christians is proper, for God Himself told us that we could eat meat from "every animal". "Every moving animal that is alive may serve as food for YOU." (Gen. 9:3)

But God commanded that before eating the flesh of an animal, his people were to pour out its blood on the ground and cover it with dust, being careful not to eat the blood, on pain of death. (Deut. 12:23-25; Lev. 7:27) This is our way for us to show respect for God's view of life.

So when someone carefully takes the strict precautions that God outlined by making sure that an animal is properly bled before consumption, they wouldn't be breaking God's command of eating blood. Since God Himself has issued these directions, obviously, if properly done, God does not have a problem with eating the meat from "every animal".

People can rest assured that nearly all blood is removed from meat during slaughter, which is why you don’t see blood in raw “white meat”; only an extremely small amount of blood remains within the muscle tissue when you get it from the store. (Also see: The Red Juice in Raw Meat is Not Blood (todayifoundit.com)"
source
(My emphasis)


However, from a comprehensive explanation of the slaughtering of animals: (I urge anyone who's interested to access the link below)

"Blood loss as a percentage of body weight differs between species: cows, 4.2 to 5.7%; calves, 4.4 to 6.7%; sheep, 4.4 to 7.6%; and pigs, 1.5 to 5.8%. Blood content as a percentage of live weight may decrease in heavier animals since the growth of blood volume does not keep pace with growth of live weight. Approximately 60% of blood is lost at sticking *, 20-25% remains in the viscera, while a maximum of 10% may remain in carcass muscles."
source

So my question is, if the muscle (meat) can contain up to 10% of an animal's blood wouldn't this make it unacceptable to Jehovah's Witnesses?



*"Cattle and pigs are usually exsanguinated [drained of blood] by a puncture wound which opens the major blood vessels at the base of the neck, not far from the heart. The trade name for this process is sticking"
Source: ibid.



.

User avatar
onewithhim
Savant
Posts: 7440
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
Location: Norwich, CT
Has thanked: 629 times
Been thanked: 146 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #81

Post by onewithhim »

[Replying to Miles in post #80]

Well, you'd better look into it a bit more. You have taken verses out of context and haven't explained what was going on in each case. Jehovah never delighted in smashing babies against rocks or anything of the like. Something like that was going to happen either to Babylon OR to Israel for being unfaithful. It was a warning. One of the nations would do that awful thing to the other nation because of their forgetting God. One has to find out what the situation was in each case before blaming God for being bloodthirsty.

.

User avatar
Miles
Prodigy
Posts: 3345
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:19 pm
Has thanked: 255 times
Been thanked: 921 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #82

Post by Miles »

onewithhim wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 4:49 pm [Replying to Miles in post #80]

Well, you'd better look into it a bit more. You have taken verses out of context and haven't explained what was going on in each case. Jehovah never delighted in smashing babies against rocks or anything of the like.
Hosea 13:4-16
4 But I am the Lord your God from the land of Egypt; you know no God but me, and besides me there is no savior.
5 [god still speaking]
6 [god still speaking]
7 [god still speaking]
8 [god still speaking] I will fall upon them like a bear robbed of her cubs; I will tear open their breast, and there I will devour them like a lion, as a wild beast would rip them open. [and this is the Christian god of love no less]
9 [god still speaking] “Israel, I helped you, but you turned against me. So now I will destroy you.
10 [god still speaking]
11 [god still speaking]
12 [god still speaking]
13 [god still speaking]
14 [god still speaking]
15 [god still speaking]
16 [god still speaking] "Samaria shall bear her guilt, because she has rebelled against her God; they shall fall by the sword; their little ones shall be dashed to pieces, and their pregnant women ripped open.


___________________________________


Numbers 31 1-2/14-17/25-27
1The Lord said to Moses, 2 Avenge the Israelites on the Midianites; afterward you shall be gathered to your [departed] people.
.
.
.
.
14 Moses was very angry with the leaders of the army, the commanders of 1000 men, and the commanders of 100 men, who came back from the war. 15 Moses said to them, “Why did you let the women live? 16 These are the women who listened to Balaam and caused the men of Israel to turn away from the Lord that time at Peor. The disease will come to the Lord’s people again. 17 Now, kill all the Midianite boys, and kill all the Midianite women who have had sexual relations with a man.
.
.
.
.
25 And the Lord said to Moses,
26 Take the count of the prey that was taken, both of man and of beast, you and Eleazar the priest and the heads of the fathers’ houses of the congregation.
27 Divide the booty into two [equal] parts between the warriors who went out to battle and all the congregation.
.
.
.

Please note that at no time does god admonish Moses for instructing the leaders of the army to "kill all the Midianite boys, and kill all the Midianite women who have had sexual relations with a man." Conclusion: God is just fine with killing the Midianite boys. . . . and non-virginal women.


__________________________________________________________


2 Kings 2:23-24
23 Elisha went from that city to Bethel. He was walking up the hill to the city, and some boys were coming down out of the city. They began making fun of him. They said, “Go away, you bald-headed man! Go away, you bald-headed man!”
24 Elisha looked back and saw them. He asked the Lord to cause bad things to happen to them. Then two bears came out of the forest and attacked the boys. There were 42 boys ripped apart by the bears.



Think the Bible would include a story
wherein god is asked to help out, but without explanation does not? Of course not. The bear story exists because it is suppose to be taken as a fact: God was asked to help out Elisha and did so by sending two bears to rip the 42 boys apart.


So, is blood really precious to god? Not as long as it's keeping people alive is it.



,

2timothy316
Prodigy
Posts: 3393
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2016 10:51 am
Has thanked: 94 times
Been thanked: 228 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #83

Post by 2timothy316 »

[Replying to Miles in post #82]

Do you have anything to add about the OP? Or are you ready to concede talking about that and move on to something else? Otherwise perhaps you'd like to continue your rant about God on a thread that is people ranting on an on about God.
viewtopic.php?f=38&t=34095&hilit=crook

User avatar
Purple Knight
Guru
Posts: 2112
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:00 pm
Has thanked: 668 times
Been thanked: 407 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #84

Post by Purple Knight »

Miles wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 3:48 pmOh, I don't think it's all that precious. God kind of delights in the shedding of blood now and then.
To be fair, he never told anybody to drink it.
onewithhim wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:22 amI don't believe that God is trying to trick anybody.
He does sometimes look favourably on tricking, though. Jacob tricked his older brother out of his inheritance and became arguably the most favoured person in Biblical history. Abraham was tricked by the father of Sarah to take a bride he didn't want, and he didn't reject it because it was tricking; he worked another I believe seven years to earn the other bride that he did want. Tricking is not a bad thing. Tricking is better than violence as a means to take the other guy for everything he has. If God is teaching tricking, then he is a good god.

But regardless, it's pointless to worry about whether God is trying to trick you or not, because he's not going to fail if he's trying.

2timothy316
Prodigy
Posts: 3393
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2016 10:51 am
Has thanked: 94 times
Been thanked: 228 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #85

Post by 2timothy316 »

Purple Knight wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 2:11 pm
Miles wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 3:48 pmOh, I don't think it's all that precious. God kind of delights in the shedding of blood now and then.
To be fair, he never told anybody to drink it.
onewithhim wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:22 amI don't believe that God is trying to trick anybody.
He does sometimes look favourably on tricking, though. Jacob tricked his older brother out of his inheritance and became arguably the most favoured person in Biblical history. Abraham was tricked by the father of Sarah to take a bride he didn't want, and he didn't reject it because it was tricking; he worked another I believe seven years to earn the other bride that he did want. Tricking is not a bad thing. Tricking is better than violence as a means to take the other guy for everything he has. If God is teaching tricking, then he is a good god.

But regardless, it's pointless to worry about whether God is trying to trick you or not, because he's not going to fail if he's trying.
Yet Jehovah doesn't trick people into breaking a His laws though. That would be God working against Himself. I.E. God doesn't want us to break His laws yet He tricks us to break His laws makes no sense.

User avatar
Miles
Prodigy
Posts: 3345
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 4:19 pm
Has thanked: 255 times
Been thanked: 921 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #86

Post by Miles »

Purple Knight wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 2:11 pm
Miles wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 3:48 pmOh, I don't think it's all that precious. God kind of delights in the shedding of blood now and then.
To be fair, he never told anybody to drink it.
To be fair (to myself) I wasn't talking about drinking it, only how precious it doesn't appear to be to god. He doesn't appear to have any qualms about blood being shed for various reasons, whether its thousands of enemy warriors or just 42 boys. "Let it flow"


.

User avatar
Purple Knight
Guru
Posts: 2112
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:00 pm
Has thanked: 668 times
Been thanked: 407 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #87

Post by Purple Knight »

Miles wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 3:29 pm
Purple Knight wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 2:11 pm
Miles wrote: Mon Jan 17, 2022 3:48 pmOh, I don't think it's all that precious. God kind of delights in the shedding of blood now and then.
To be fair, he never told anybody to drink it.
To be fair (to myself) I wasn't talking about drinking it, only how precious it doesn't appear to be to god. He doesn't appear to have any qualms about blood being shed for various reasons, whether its thousands of enemy warriors or just 42 boys. "Let it flow"


.
That doesn't preclude its being precious. Yes, you have to be a little generous but why not?

What it seems to me is that when the blood flows out upon the ground, God has counted it as being received back.

Though I do have to wonder about factory farms where the blood is probably incinerated or something.

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 18068
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 430 times
Been thanked: 649 times
Contact:

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #88

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Purple Knight wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 3:38 pm
What it seems to me is that when the blood flows out upon the ground, God has counted it as being received back.
That is exactly the point, it is a symbolic gesture to recognize the life belongs ultimately to God who gave. Blood then becomes something sacred (belonging to God) and it remains for him alone to dictate its use: namely for the atonement of sin.

Its a very serious matter for a Christian.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

User avatar
Purple Knight
Guru
Posts: 2112
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:00 pm
Has thanked: 668 times
Been thanked: 407 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #89

Post by Purple Knight »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 4:06 pm
Purple Knight wrote: Tue Jan 18, 2022 3:38 pm
What it seems to me is that when the blood flows out upon the ground, God has counted it as being received back.
That is exactly the point, it is a symbolic gesture to recognize the life belongs ultimately to God who gave. Blood then becomes something sacred (belonging to God) and it remains for him alone to dictate its use: namely for the atonement of sin.

Its a very serious matter for a Christian.
It seems like various vampire myths grew out of this very seriousness. The idea that drinking blood would be associated with becoming something vile and unholy, but nonetheless very strong, as blood = life.

It seems like a weird association to modern people. Why should crosses harm vampires? Well, because they're anti-Christians. It's not just, the people involved in that myth formation happened to be Christians; plenty of Christian lore went into its formation so you can't really have vampires in a universe where the Christian canon is false. Of course Christianity could happen to be true without vampires but the reverse isn't really possible.

User avatar
Purple Knight
Guru
Posts: 2112
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:00 pm
Has thanked: 668 times
Been thanked: 407 times

Re: Jehovah's Witnesses And Blood

Post #90

Post by Purple Knight »

[Replying to Purple Knight in post #89]

Very very odd that Joey should post this just a bit after I posted the above. My answer to the below is, there wouldn't be that vampire. In a universe where vampire lore is reality, and is consistent, they don't start being formed until there are already Christians.
JoeyKnothead wrote: Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:36 pm Image

Post Reply