The Atonement

[Revelations won]

To all true Christians there is nothing more important to our salvation than "The Atonement of Jesus Christ".

Having said that, is it not therefore extremely important to every individual to understand fully what and how the atonement works for our benefit?

What does the atonement do or does not do?

What is required on our part to receive the full benefits of the atonement?

What and when and by whom did the atonement begin?

Can anyone clearly show all scriptures pertaining to the atonement?

I look forward to hearing your "take" on this most important topic.

Kind regards,
RW

[Brightfame52]

mythone

So Christians can sin without any fear of punishment?

Is that your claim? If so, you are incorrect.

Christians will and do sin everyday because we are sinners in the flesh, yet people who Christ died for will not be punished eternally for their sins, that penalty has been paid. Now God will chasten His people, correct them if they are wayward, and that can be grievous, but its out of Love and not out of His wrath and vengeance and justice as it will be for the non Christian, unbeliever.

[myth-one.com]

mythone

So Christians can sin without any fear of punishment?

Is that your claim? If so, you are incorrect.

Christians will and do sin everyday because we are sinners in the flesh, yet people who Christ died for will not be punished eternally for their sins, that penalty has been paid.

Which particular sin was that penalty for?

Now God will chasten His people, correct them if they are wayward, . . .

Yes, it's called punishment.

. . . and that can be grievous, but its out of Love and not out of His wrath and vengeance and justice as it will be for the non Christian, unbeliever.

Nonbelievers pay the final wages for their sins when they are cast into the lake of fire and perish. They will never sin again after that punishment.

On the other hand, believers will be born again as everlasting spiritual bodied beings, and if given commandments from God, they are eternally capable of sinning by disobeying Gods commandments!

And it is possible that everlasting beings may be punished eternally -- such as the devil will be.

[Brightfame52]

The declared Blessing of Rom 4:25

All those Jesus Christ died for are by His Death made Righteous Rom 5:19, first and foremost before God, and this is their Justification, this is True because Paul states before, in regards to all for whom He died, that He was delivered on account of our sins or Transgressions, this was because they had been charged to Him 1 Cor 15:3

3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for [for the sake of] our sins according to the scriptures; 2 Cor 5:21

21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Note: In order for Christ to have died for sin, the sins had to be charged to Him !

And He was raised again on account of our Justification, because their Justification was an accomplished Fact Rom 4:25

25Who was delivered for [on account of]our offences, and was raised again for[on account of] our justification.

Now if Christ died and rose again for an Individual in 33 ad, and this individual or individuals were not physically born sinners until 1960ad, this sinner or sinners are born already Justified, unless we undo the accomplished fact that the resurrection of Christ verified ! If all for whom Christ died for the sake of, had not been Justified or made Righteous before God, by His obedience unto Death [Phil 2:8], then He could not have or would not have been raised from the dead, and all for whom He did die would still be in their sins ! 1 Cor 15:17. You see the resurrection took place as a consequence of the Justification of all Christ died for, in the same manner, His death occurred as a consequence of the sins of all He died for. The Resurrection proved that God had been fully satisfied and propitiated, and all our sins forgiven, at the Blood of Christ !

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to Brightfame52 in post #413]

Under the New Testament Covenant, mankind no longer needs to be free from sin to gain everlasting life:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16)

There is no longer any requirement of remaining sinless or atoning for our sins to gain everlasting life. The only requirement to gain everlasting life for any human under the existing covenant between God and man is to believe in Jesus Christ as one's Savior.

[Brightfame52]

None shall be Lost whom Christ died for !

Jn 6:37-40

37All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

38For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

The christ of antichrist religions will loose many he intended to save ! The anti christ jesus died to save millions, and yet the gates of hell prevailed against them, and they shall hear these words in the day of Judgment Matt 7:23

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Their iniquities as we can read here were held against them in the day of Judgment ! This in spite of the fact that supposedly their iniquities were charged to him Isa 53:6

6All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

The word laid here is the hebrew word paga` and means:


to encounter, meet, reach, entreat, make intercession

a) (Qal)

1) to meet, light upon, join

2) to meet (of kindness)

3) to encounter, fall upon (of hostility)

4) to encounter, entreat (of request)

5) to strike, touch (of boundary)

The idea here is that God caused our iniquities to fall upon Him !

The NASB: All of us like sheep have gone astray, Each of us has turned to his own way; But the LORD has caused the iniquity of us all To fall on Him.

God caused our Punishment to meet upon Him for our iniquities !

However the anti christ ministers says many, millions for whom this occurred, shall here yet the dreadful words from Christ mouth Matt 7:23

That means they were lost, they perished. Now the Christ that I know and Preach of, did not Loose any, none for whom He died shall Perish.

He can always boast Jn 17:12

While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

Jn 18:9

That the saying might be fulfilled, which he spake, Of them which thou gavest me have I lost none.

Jesus gave one exception, the son of perdition, however none that He died for can go into perdition. Only those whose names that were not written in the book of life from the foundation shall meet with such an end Rev 17:8

8The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

You see, all those whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation, shall follow and worship the beast of perdition Rev 13:8

8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

None for whom Christ died shall go into perdition, or be lost, but every last one of them shall hear these words from their Saviour King Matt 25:34

34Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

You know why Jesus said the Kingdom was prepared for them from the foundation of the world, before they even had being ? Because that's when their names were written in the book of Life, from the foundation of the world ! They are the antithesis of these Rev 13:8

8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. or Rev 17:8

8The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

What caused them to differ ? God's Eternal Elective Love, that's it. What Christ do you follow today ? The one that millions for whom he died shall shall still go into perdition, be lost, or the One that None for whom He died shall be Lost ?

[myth-one.com]

None shall be Lost whom Christ died for !

That's correct. And Christ died so that whosoever believeth in Him shall have everlasting life.

Here's a much shorter version that none of those that believeth will be lost:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.

None of those that believeth will perish.

All who do not believeth will perish.

Christ died so that all may have everlasting life.

Whether or not any one individual will actually have everlasting life depends on their choice of believing or rejecting Jesus as their Savior.

[Brightfame52]

mythone

Whether or not any one individual will actually have everlasting life depends on their choice of believing or rejecting Jesus as their Savior.

Thats salvation conditioned on man and not the atonement of Christ.

[myth-one.com]

mythone

Whether or not any one individual will actually have everlasting life depends on their choice of believing or rejecting Jesus as their Savior.

Thats salvation conditioned on man and not the atonement of Christ.

No, that's salvation based on the New Testament Covenant between God and mankind!

And God cannot break His everlasting covenant. Whosoever believes in Jesus will have everlasting life. God cannot refuse any believer.

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Adam and Eve had to choose to eat or not eat from the Tree of Knowledge.

God sets before us life and death and recommends that we choose life.

Jesus Christ states that whosoever believeth in Him shall have everlasting life.

All three of those events required a free will choice being made. That is, something is required on the part of the recipient.

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How does one gain salvation accidently, without doing anything?

[Brightfame52]

The Lord will not impute sin

Rom 4:8

Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

The word impute means :

to reckon, count, compute, calculate, count over

a) to take into account, to make an account of

1) metaph. to pass to one's account, to impute

For those Christ died for, who had their sins imputed to Him, or Charged to Him, those are the men that are Blessed in Rom 4:8, because God, having imputed their sins to Christ, will not imputed sin unto them !

Thats another accomplishment of the Atonement, Because sins have been already paid for by Christ's Death, those sins can never be charged to those same ones that had their sins charged to Christ. The strength of sin is the Law.

No one Christ died for owes any debt of sin against God's Law. That goes for Believer or Unbeliever who Christ died for, because Christ has already paid their debt to God's Law and Justice. This is a fact whether it is believed or not, even though in due time this fact will be made known to all for whom Christ died. 6

[Brightfame52]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #418]

Yes you condition salvation/atonement on mans choice. Thats works, mans religion. Bible doesnt teach that ! All of Salvation is conditioned on Jesus Christ, what He has performed for His People !