The Atonement

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Revelations won
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The Atonement

Post #1

Post by Revelations won »

To all true Christians there is nothing more important to our salvation than "The Atonement of Jesus Christ".

Having said that, is it not therefore extremely important to every individual to understand fully what and how the atonement works for our benefit?

What does the atonement do or does not do?

What is required on our part to receive the full benefits of the atonement?

What and when and by whom did the atonement begin?

Can anyone clearly show all scriptures pertaining to the atonement?

I look forward to hearing your "take" on this most important topic.

Kind regards,
RW

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Re: The Atonement

Post #2

Post by 1213 »

Revelations won wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:21 am To all true Christians there is nothing more important to our salvation than "The Atonement of Jesus Christ".
...
That is an interesting claim. For me, the important thing is his words, because:

It is the spirit who gives life. The flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and are life.
John 6:63

By his words forgiveness is declared, and by his words is the new covenant established.

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Re: The Atonement

Post #3

Post by JehovahsWitness »

The "atonement" I believe covers over inherited (adamic) sin and makes salvation of mankind possible. (John 3:16)
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Re: The Atonement

Post #4

Post by Tcg »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:43 am The "atonement" I believe covers over inherited (adamic) sin and makes salvation of mankind possible. (John 3:16)
Really? John 3:16 doesn't mention anything about Adam.



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Re: The Atonement

Post #5

Post by Revelations won »

To JW and Tcg

JW said:
JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Mon Jun 21, 2021 2:43 am
The "atonement" I believe covers over inherited (adamic) sin and makes salvation of mankind possible. (John 3:16)


Tcg said:
Really? John 3:16 doesn't mention anything about Adam.

Interesting! It looks like Tcg made a very accurate response on that one...

Kind regards,
RW

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Re: The Atonement

Post #6

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Revelations won wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 12:17 am To JW and Tcg

JW said:
JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Mon Jun 21, 2021 2:43 am
The "atonement" I believe covers over inherited (adamic) sin and makes salvation of mankind possible. (John 3:16)


Tcg said:
Really? John 3:16 doesn't mention anything about Adam.


JOHN 3:16 NIV

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Revelations won wrote: Wed Jun 23, 2021 12:17 am
Interesting! It looks like Tcg made a very accurate response on that one...

Fair enough, although I don't see how that is relevant to my comment (which is why I did not reply).

While there is no mention of Adam the man (and I wouldn't say the scripture is "about" him) it is about salvation (being saved from destruction / perishing). Biblically, Adam, more precisely "adamic sin" (the inherited tendency for all imperfect humans to sin that came to exist in the world through Adam) is the reason mankind is in NEED of salvation (see Romans 5:12, 14).

John 3:16 speaks of the solution to a problem Adam caused (compare Romans 5:17).
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Re: The Atonement

Post #7

Post by Revelations won »

Dear 1213,

Than you for your response. I quote therefrom:

“Revelations won wrote: ↑
Sun Jun 20, 2021 7:21 am
To all true Christians there is nothing more important to our salvation than "The Atonement of Jesus Christ".
...
That is an interesting claim. For me, the important thing is his words, because:

It is the spirit who gives life. The flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and are life.
John 6:63

My response: What you quote from John 6:63 is indeed important. However we must remember that if he had not made the great, infinite, Last and atoning sacrifice for our sins there would be NO atonement for our sins.


By his words forgiveness is declared, and by his words is the new covenant established.

My response: I certainly agree that by his words forgiveness is declared, but if he had not made the Great and Last sacrifice, the fact remains that there would be no forgiveness of sin.

Kind regards,
RW

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Re: The Atonement

Post #8

Post by onewithhim »

Tcg wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:04 am
JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:43 am The "atonement" I believe covers over inherited (adamic) sin and makes salvation of mankind possible. (John 3:16)
Really? John 3:16 doesn't mention anything about Adam.



Tcg
Well, a whole lot of other verses do. When referred to in the New Testament, the atonement/ransom is the price Jesus paid to BUY BACK what Adam lost.

"For since death came through a man, resurrection of the dead also comes through a man. For just as in Adam all are dying, so also in the Christ all will be made alive." (I Corinthians 15:21,22)

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Re: The Atonement

Post #9

Post by 1213 »

Revelations won wrote: Sun Jun 27, 2021 11:11 am ...but if he had not made the Great and Last sacrifice, the fact remains that there would be no forgiveness of sin.
...
I think the sacrifice Jesus made was similar to a soldier who “sacrifices” his life for his country by defending it. Jesus spent his life for our benefit, by preaching the message and I think that is the sacrifice that he made and it is what can really cause change in us for better. But, I don’t think his death was the key thing, because according to the Bible he and his disciples could forgive sins without death.

The scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, "Who is this that speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?" But Jesus, perceiving their thoughts, answered them, "Why are you reasoning so in your hearts? Which is easier to say, 'Your sins are forgiven you;' or to say, 'Arise and walk?' But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins" (he said to the paralyzed man), "I tell you, arise, and take up your cot, and go to your house." Immediately he rose up before them, and took up that which he was laying on, and departed to his house, glorifying God.
Luke 5:21-25

Whoever's sins you forgive, they are forgiven them. Whoever's sins you retain, they have been retained."
John 20:23

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Re: The Atonement

Post #10

Post by Revelations won »

To all,

In my OP I asked 5 simple questions. To make it easy for everyone I will ask those questions one at a time:

What does the atonement do or does not do?

I look forward to your responses.

Kind regards,
RW

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