Biblical Creation Stories - Same Event - Different Day

[William]

From the Fudging The Evidence Thread;

Paleontology is the science that primarily seeks to understand fossil evidence:

It would be quite a stretch to suggest that it supports biblical accounts.

The creation of Adam & Eve can be traced back to about 6,000 years ago. But the earth is about 4.55 billion years of age according to scientists.

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. (Genesis 1:1-2)

From this point there are two possibilities: Either God created the earth originally without form, void, and dark; or God created the earth as "good" and over time it came to be without form, void, and dark.

Before making that choice, note that everything God created in Genesis beginning in verse 3 of chapter 1 was said to be "good" by God.

Also, other translations of the original Hebrew text indicate that something occurred and the earth had reached this state. For example, the New International Version® of the Bible renders the same verses as follows:

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty; darkness was over the surface of the deep... (Genesis 1:1-2)

That is, God originally created the heavens and the earth good in verse one, and over a period of time the earth had become formless, void, and dark.

The Biblical evidence points to the idea that Genesis 1:1 describes the complete original creation of the heaven and the earth:

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. (Genesis 1:1)

This verse is all the info we are given about the original creation of the heaven and the earth. We are not told more because it does not affect us. In fact, Adam and Eve do not appear until the re-creation of the decimated earth which does not occur until about 4.55 billion years later.

That re-creation begins in Genesis 1:3.

============== How Paleontology supports the biblical account above =============

Dinosaurs became extinct about 66 million years ago according to Paleontologists.

Adam and Eve were created about 6,000 years ago.

In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth.

Since man was created in a six-earthly-day creation 6,000 years ago, and dinosaurs roamed the earth billions of years ago, then paleontology supports the biblical account that the earth was created billions of years ago and had come to be without form, void, and dark sometime prior to 6,000 years ago.

That is, Genesis 1:1 describes the original creation of the heaven and the earth, and Genesis 1:3 then begins the re-creation of a formless, void, and dark earth to it's original good condition.

The Bible and Paleontology are complementary on this accounting.

Q: If the above is true, are we to suppose that Adam [and Eve] were implanted upon the planet in forms which did not evolve naturally, in order to account for the 6,000 years the 2nd biblical story of creation works off of [specific to Humans], when we know that the human form evolved through a far longer period of time?

[William]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #10]

There is no such thing as something that doesn't exist as something.

Yes there is. It is called a "Void".

If there is a thing it is some thing.

Yes. In this case, that something is a "Void".

Void: A completely empty space.

Space has volume:

Space: a continuous area or expanse which is free, available, or unoccupied.

Therefore space exists as something.

Yes. In this case, that something is a "Void".

Paleontology supports the notion that the Earth did indeed exist, as a planet.

So does the Bible.

The earth was completed as good in verse one of the Bible, and became without form, void, and dark as described in verse 2.

Paleontology does not support the notion that the Earth existed as a planet, and then did not exist as a planet, and then existed again as a planet.

[William]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #8]

Adam & Eve were created in the garden of Eden, why would they have to be planted there?

Not according to the script. Eve may have been, but Adam was created elsewhere - before the Garden was created, and he was placed within it.

And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.

[1213]

...
Q: If the above is true, are we to suppose that Adam [and Eve] were implanted upon the planet in forms which did not evolve naturally, in order to account for the 6,000 years the 2nd biblical story of creation works off of [specific to Humans], when we know that the human form evolved through a far longer period of time?

I would avoid the whole problem by just saying there is no proof for the millions of years, is is simply a belief that some have.

[William]

...
Q: If the above is true, are we to suppose that Adam [and Eve] were implanted upon the planet in forms which did not evolve naturally, in order to account for the 6,000 years the 2nd biblical story of creation works off of [specific to Humans], when we know that the human form evolved through a far longer period of time?

I would avoid the whole problem by just saying there is no proof for the millions of years, is is simply a belief that some have.

Then you would be telling a lie, for we have the Universe as evidence, and the calculations we are able to do re the evidence, supports the proof of billions of years.

We even see how this process is carried out. How planets form and how long such a process takes.

The way it is for you, in order to avoid the whole 'problem' one has to tell lies to oneself.

The question then begged, is;

"Why do folk avoid the truth by telling themselves - and others - lies?" [and as often as not, do so in a boastful manner, as if it were something to be proud of.]

[myth-one.com]

Paleontology supports the notion that the Earth did indeed exist, as a planet.

So does the Bible.

The earth was completed as good in verse one of the Bible, and became without form, void, and dark as described in verse 2.

Paleontology does not support the notion that the Earth existed as a planet, and then did not exist as a planet, and then existed again as a planet.

Neither does the Bible.

Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth. Psalm 104:30

One cannot renew something that doesn't exist.

[William]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #15]

You're playing with words.

Something which once was and then was not and then was renewed to what it once was, is observed in what evidence the universe provides us with?

Paleontology deals with what is, and cannot support the belief that something once was and then then wasn't and then was renewed to what it once was.

It therefore can only deal with that which is claimed to be 'renewed', but has no evidence to support a suggestion that what was 'renewed' had existed - been erased - and then brought back into existence.

The belief itself is simply an unnecessary additional layer to what is. What "once was" and then "was erased" and then "made again", has no intrinsic value as sensible argument, even outside of a debate setting.

Your claim that Paleontology supports that belief, has been rebutted.

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #15]

You're playing with words.

Something which once was and then was not and then was renewed to what it once was, is observed in what evidence the universe provides us with?

Paleontology deals with what is, and cannot support the belief that something once was and then then wasn't and then was renewed to what it once was.

It therefore can only deal with that which is claimed to be 'renewed', but has no evidence to support a suggestion that what was 'renewed' had existed - been erased - and then brought back into existence.

The belief itself is simply an unnecessary additional layer to what is. What "once was" and then "was erased" and then "made again", has no intrinsic value as sensible argument, even outside of a debate setting.

Your claim that Paleontology supports that belief, has been rebutted.

Show me your evidence that the earth "once was" and then "was erased" and then "made again" mentioned anywhere but in your posts.

[William]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #17]

The reason for the thread is to give you opportunity to explain your belief, not for me to explain your belief.

Are you able to answer the OPQ or do you just want to fool around?

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #17]

The reason for the thread is to give you opportunity to explain your belief, not for me to explain your belief.

Are you able to answer the OPQ or do you just want to fool around?

Paleontology does not support the notion that the Earth existed as a planet, and then did not exist as a planet, and then existed again as a planet.

Since you won't explain your claim, I'll have to guess at it.

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. (Genesis 1:1-2)

"Void" in the above verse is used as an adjective describing the condition of the earth at that time. It can mean desolate, barren, empty, vacant, etc.

It is not being used as a noun.

If it was being used as a noun, it would be stated that the earth was a void, or had become a void.

The Spirit of God moved over it's waters -- so the earth still existed at that time.

Neither the Bible nor paleontology support the notion that the Earth existed as a planet, and then did not exist as a planet, and then existed again as a planet.

So paleontology and the Bible support each other on this point!

[William]

[Replying to myth-one.com in post #17]

The reason for the thread is to give you opportunity to explain your belief, not for me to explain your belief.

Are you able to answer the OPQ or do you just want to fool around?

Paleontology does not support the notion that the Earth existed as a planet, and then did not exist as a planet, and then existed again as a planet.

Since you won't explain your claim, I'll have to guess at it.

It wasn't a claim.

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. (Genesis 1:1-2)

"Void" in the above verse is used as an adjective describing the condition of the earth at that time. It can mean desolate, barren, empty, vacant, etc.

It is not being used as a noun.

If it was being used as a noun, it would be stated that the earth was a void, or had become a void.

The Spirit of God moved over it's waters -- so the earth still existed at that time.

Well now - once you explained that, it makes more sense.

So paleontology and the Bible support each other on this point!

So we can move to the next point.

God originally created the heavens and the earth good in verse one, and over a period of time the earth had become formless, void, and dark.

Why would The Creator not be perpetually thinking it was 'good' in regard to the Earth, regardless of what state of progress it was in, re the process?
In the same way a gardener thinks the earth 'good' even without things being planted?

What made the Earth become "become formless, void, and dark", presuming that you are claiming that it didn't start out that way, because of what you wrote here;

n fact, Adam and Eve do not appear until the re-creation of the decimated earth which does not occur until about 4.55 billion years later.

You also claim;

We are not told more because it does not affect us.

But if that is the case, there is still the conundrum that paleontology and the Bible do not support each other on this point, and it has to concern us, because we have no evidence that any "re-creation of the decimated Earth" ever occurred.