Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Eloi
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Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by Eloi »

What do Scriptures say about Jesus before he was born as a human? What did Jesus himself say about his past, before he was born? What other reasoning based on the Scriptures can we make to know the reality about Jesus before he was born on earth?

Some biblical statements show that Jesus already existed before he was born as a human. These quotes from the book of John are some examples:

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence. What has come into existence (...) 14 So the Word became flesh and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favor and truth. 15 (John bore witness about him, yes, he cried out: “This was the one of whom I said, ‘The one coming behind me has advanced in front of me, for he existed before me.’”) (...) 18 No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is at the Father’s side is the one who has explained Him.
... 3:13 Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man. (...) 31 The one who comes from above is over all others. The one who is from the earth is from the earth and speaks of things of the earth. The one who comes from heaven is over all others. (...)
... 6:33 For the bread of God is the one who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.” (...) 38 for I have come down from heaven to do, not my own will, but the will of him who sent me. (...) 62 What, therefore, if you should see the Son of man ascending to where he was before?
... 8:23 He went on to say to them: “You are from the realms below; I am from the realms above. You are from this world; I am not from this world. 24 That is why I said to you: You will die in your sins. For if you do not believe that I am the one, you will die in your sins.” (...) 57 Then the Jews said to him: “You are not yet 50 years old, and still you have seen Abraham?” 58 Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, before Abraham came into existence, I have been.” 59 So they picked up stones to throw at him, but Jesus hid and went out of the temple.
... 17:1 Jesus spoke these things, and raising his eyes to heaven, he said: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your son so that your son may glorify you, (...) 5 So now, Father, glorify me at your side with the glory that I had alongside you before the world was.

Some teachers of Christendom teach that Jesus only came into being when he was born as a man. How do they interpret these biblical quotes about the pre-existence of Jesus?

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by Mattathias »

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by onewithhim »

[Replying to Eloi in post #1]

The scriptures certainly do teach that Jesus pre-existed in heaven.

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by Revelations won »

+Dear Eloi,

The scriptures make it very clear that Jesus had a premortal experience and existence.

Also since Jesus is our older brother it stands to reason that we all have had a premortal experience and existence. This is clearly supported by scriptural evidence.

I also fully agree with onewithhim's response on this topic.

Kind regards,
RW

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by Miles »

onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 05, 2021 6:52 am [Replying to Eloi in post #1]

The scriptures certainly do teach that Jesus pre-existed in heaven.
Does it say anything about his purpose back then? Or, for that matter, the purpose of the holy spirit?


.

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by myth-one.com »

Eloi wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 11:46 amDoes the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?
The Word is a God.

Jesus was a man.
==================================

God existed always.

A man exists from conception or birth depending on who you ask.
==================================

God will never die.

The maximum lifetime of a man is presently around 120 years.
==================================
Eloi wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 11:46 amWhat did Jesus himself say about his past, before he was born?
Before He was born, the man Jesus did not exist.

When Jesus talks about "His existence" prior to His physical birth, He has to be referring to the Word.

The Word was made flesh as the man Jesus Christ for thirty-three years.

During that short period of time, they both existed separately.

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by onewithhim »

Revelations won wrote: Tue Oct 05, 2021 8:57 pm +Dear Eloi,

The scriptures make it very clear that Jesus had a premortal experience and existence.

Also since Jesus is our older brother it stands to reason that we all have had a premortal experience and existence. This is clearly supported by scriptural evidence.

I also fully agree with onewithhim's response on this topic.

Kind regards,
RW
Well, Jesus was a very special person, the first thing of Jehovah's creation, which He, Jehovah, created all by Himself. Jesus was the only archangel, and learned everything possible from Jehovah for eons. I have to say, just because Jesus had an existence before coming to the earth, that doesn't necessarily mean that all humans had a pre-existence. Jesus remembered his existence before coming here, probably at his baptism, and we don't remember anything. People who claim to remember are deluding themselves, just like people who have out-of-body experiences and see a bright light, when they are on an operating table or such like. Most of us don't (those who are not deluded) have anything to remember.......we started our existence at conception.

What is your scriptural evidence for pre-mortal existence?

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by onewithhim »

Miles wrote: Tue Oct 05, 2021 11:03 pm
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 05, 2021 6:52 am [Replying to Eloi in post #1]

The scriptures certainly do teach that Jesus pre-existed in heaven.
Does it say anything about his purpose back then? Or, for that matter, the purpose of the holy spirit?


.
Jesus' purpose was to have a close relationship with our Creator, Jehovah, and to learn all the things that Jehovah wanted to teach His Son. Jesus, the only archangel, worked with his Father and formed the whole universe with Him. This took many billions of years, I'm sure. So he was busy in his pre-earth existence. The Holy Spirit is simply Jehovah's expression of power with which He accomplishes whatever He wishes to do.

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by onewithhim »

myth-one.com wrote: Thu Oct 07, 2021 10:38 am
Eloi wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 11:46 amDoes the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?
The Word is a God.

Jesus was a man.
==================================

God existed always.

A man exists from conception or birth depending on who you ask.
==================================

God will never die.

The maximum lifetime of a man is presently around 120 years.
==================================
Eloi wrote: Sun Oct 03, 2021 11:46 amWhat did Jesus himself say about his past, before he was born?
Before He was born, the man Jesus did not exist.

When Jesus talks about "His existence" prior to His physical birth, He has to be referring to the Word.

The Word was made flesh as the man Jesus Christ for thirty-three years.

During that short period of time, they both existed separately.
No.....Jesus being the Word meant that he was always Jehovah's spokesman. It was he who spoke to Moses out of the burning bush, and who followed and lead the Israelites out of Egypt in the clouds of either fire or non-fire, and other times that God wanted representation on the earth. The "Word" was Jesus, and he came to the earth from heaven, as he said a few times, to explain, or, represent his Father (John 3:13; John 1:18). Why would he say he was "sent" if he did not have a pre-earth existence? (John 3:16; Isaiah 61:1,2; Luke 4:17-21; John 4:34)

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Re: Does the Scriptures teach about Jesus' pre-existence?

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Post by myth-one.com »

onewithhim wrote: Thu Oct 07, 2021 11:56 am Jesus being the Word meant that he was always Jehovah's spokesman.
So Jesus was a man in the beginning, and is a man at present, in the Kingdom of God?

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