Recovering Christians

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Cathar1950
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Recovering Christians

Post #1

Post by Cathar1950 »

Recovering Christians.
I don’t know where I am going with this but I thought I would run it by my fellow former Christians and see what you think and what if any might be a good topic along these lines.

Former Christians or recovering Christians, do you really ever get over it?

It is like a recovering addict or alcoholic, it is a lifetime battle. It has affected you and shaped your mind. Even after you break the habit it still haunts you with patterns of thought and behaviors that can act as triggers any time. If you are an alcoholic, can you control it or do you have to avoid it? The medical establishment as loosely defines an alcoholic; “you are an alcoholic if you have problems and you drink”. I think it has something to do with insurance. It seems that might be true of a Christian “if you have problems and are a Christian you’re an addict”(concept and wording needs work). You would think that with the claims Christians often make about God, the world and redemption they should not have problems otherwise what would make their existence any different that non-Christians with no claims? If Christ defeated the powers then what is going on? Is this just imaginary?

I remember as I was working on a therapy license that many of the addicts had issues and problems that were not being addressed by “just say no” or quitting.
Like many believers they keep their problems even after they quit their substance addiction.
Only they seem to be in denial about it or so disassociated that they can’t see them.

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Post #11

Post by Cathar1950 »

Skepticologist I couldn't discribe some of my same experiences better then your example.
I don't think I managed to cross the line into Fundamentalism, Holiness or Pentecostle mindsets but I have lifetime affilations such as friends and family. Between hardcore Baptists and Reorganized latterday saints I started asking questions early and a skeptical mind does help keep you sane and I can't say that for everyone else that doesn't try to maintain a good sh*t detecter.
I just like to keep it honest and have fun.

Andre_5772
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Re: Recovering Christians

Post #12

Post by Andre_5772 »

Cathar1950 wrote: It is like a recovering addict or alcoholic, it is a lifetime battle. It has affected you and shaped your mind. Even after you break the habit it still haunts you with patterns of thought and behaviors that can act as triggers any time.
This is very much the case for me. I only realized for myself lately that Christianity flat out didn't make sense to me, although for a long time I had identified as agnostic with the secret hope that one day I would figure out how to reconcile Christianity with the experiences in my life. I miss the rituals, and being a member of a community of people who strive to live positive values. It was also reassuring to feel like I was really "in the know," because I was a member of the "one true church." What a load of crap, but soothing crap nonetheless.

I am hoping I can eventually make peace with myself as one of those godless heathen I used to fear so much.

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Re: Recovering Christians

Post #13

Post by graphicsguy »

Cathar1950 wrote:Former Christians or recovering Christians, do you really ever get over it?

You would think that with the claims Christians often make about God, the world and redemption they should not have problems otherwise what would make their existence any different that non-Christians with no claims?

If Christ defeated the powers then what is going on? Is this just imaginary?
Cathar, your questions scare me because I keep wondering how long I'm going to wonder about these things. How long am I going to flip flop between Atheist/Agnostic/Believer? Not that I'm doing serious flip-flopping right now, but being able to see the arguments from multiple sides can get very confusing from time to time.

Especially when all you've done is surround yourself with Christians throughout your life. They simply do not generally understand what it is that you're going through. They think you're backsliding or you're just wanting to make excuses to "sin" or you're just not being thankful for what's happened in your life or any number of other things.

You make a non-Christian friend and they tell you to "be careful". They think you're being attacked by Satan when you wonder if God even exists.

You tell them you found a solution to your problems outside of "Christian teaching" and they think the world is just leading you away.

And you're so torn up because your family thinks all those things about you too.

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Re: Recovering Christians

Post #14

Post by Cathar1950 »

graphicsguy wrote:
Cathar1950 wrote:Former Christians or recovering Christians, do you really ever get over it?

You would think that with the claims Christians often make about God, the world and redemption they should not have problems otherwise what would make their existence any different that non-Christians with no claims?

If Christ defeated the powers then what is going on? Is this just imaginary?
Cathar, your questions scare me because I keep wondering how long I'm going to wonder about these things. How long am I going to flip flop between Atheist/Agnostic/Believer? Not that I'm doing serious flip-flopping right now, but being able to see the arguments from multiple sides can get very confusing from time to time.

Especially when all you've done is surround yourself with Christians throughout your life. They simply do not generally understand what it is that you're going through. They think you're backsliding or you're just wanting to make excuses to "sin" or you're just not being thankful for what's happened in your life or any number of other things.

You make a non-Christian friend and they tell you to "be careful". They think you're being attacked by Satan when you wonder if God even exists.

You tell them you found a solution to your problems outside of "Christian teaching" and they think the world is just leading you away.

And you're so torn up because your family thinks all those things about you too.
Being raised in a Christian family it becomes part of your value system just like potty training.
Many in Our country is under the illusion we are a Christian nation as many founding fathers were Christian and Masons they had a much different view of both God and Christianity as well as the bible then the Christians of today that make up our culture and nation. Let us not forget the power of the media and marketing.

graphicsguy
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Re: Recovering Christians

Post #15

Post by graphicsguy »

Cathar1950 wrote:Being raised in a Christian family it becomes part of your value system just like potty training.
Yes it does...and when those core beliefs literally get ripped away from you it kind of feels empty and lonely.

My counsellor did say something to me last month that helped. I told him I had no core beliefs and he asked me about some of my moral convictions. So I explained that I could still see the value in living honorably and not simply going out and running rampant.

He said, "well, that's a core belief. Belief is not limited to faith, it is simply related to how you wish to live your life." Well, that's paraphrased into how I understood it, but I found it very comforting at the time that I didn't HAVE to resolve my faith in God right away.

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Post #16

Post by Skepticologist »

I've become convinced over the years that people believe in religion for no better reason than that they want to. Their motivation may be a desire to fit in with family or friends who are adherents to a particular religion, or to become more congruent with the beliefs of a potential or actual mate, or desparation at finding insufficient answers to the "meaning of life", or the feelings of inclusiveness and support offered only to those who purport acceptance of a certain set of beliefs, or any number of other reasons.

And I contend that no sane person living in the modern age, with even a perfunctory understanding of science, embraces religion purely on the basis of logic and reason. After all, that's why becoming a "believer" in any of the world's religions requires a "leap of faith" which, necessarily requires an abandonment, or at least a significant redefinition, of logic and reason.

I think your counselor is pretty sharp. He or she appears to understand that, in the absence of religion, humans will adopt a code of ethics or "moral behavior" based simply on deductive reasoning applied to their shared experiences. To wit: making it OK to kill one another for any reason will eventually lead to the extermination of the species; practicing polygamy after committing to monogamy will threaten the family unit that is essential for rearing our young; and so on, through the other eight religously-sanctioned Ten Commandments. It's not about religion, it's about the perpetuation of the species, stupid!

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Re: Recovering Christians

Post #17

Post by ShadowRishi »

Cathar1950 wrote:Recovering Christians.
I don’t know where I am going with this but I thought I would run it by my fellow former Christians and see what you think and what if any might be a good topic along these lines.

Former Christians or recovering Christians, do you really ever get over it?

It is like a recovering addict or alcoholic, it is a lifetime battle. It has affected you and shaped your mind. Even after you break the habit it still haunts you with patterns of thought and behaviors that can act as triggers any time. If you are an alcoholic, can you control it or do you have to avoid it? The medical establishment as loosely defines an alcoholic; “you are an alcoholic if you have problems and you drink”. I think it has something to do with insurance. It seems that might be true of a Christian “if you have problems and are a Christian you’re an addict”(concept and wording needs work). You would think that with the claims Christians often make about God, the world and redemption they should not have problems otherwise what would make their existence any different that non-Christians with no claims? If Christ defeated the powers then what is going on? Is this just imaginary?

I remember as I was working on a therapy license that many of the addicts had issues and problems that were not being addressed by “just say no” or quitting.
Like many believers they keep their problems even after they quit their substance addiction.
Only they seem to be in denial about it or so disassociated that they can’t see them.
I found that even though I went to church twice every week, got involved with all sorts of Jesus stuffs, I verbally purported Christian values, I hated homosexuals, I memorized whole sections of the Bible, and I tried to act as good as I could according to the Christian faith.


And yet, the whole while, even as a Christian, it all felt vein. I couldn't actually feel God, except for when I did things that made sense to me. I tried to get myself saved by asking for God's forgiveness, and yet at the end of the day, none of it felt real. None of it I could feel. I denied that I was feeling this; I figured that after all of it, how could God choose to send me to hell if I did everything to the best of my ability according to his laws?


And that was Christianity for me. Shallow; based only on self-denial, self-hatred, self-misunderstanding, and guilt because I couldn't change it.


So when I started reading American Transcendentalist literature in the start of my Sophomore year, life began making a lot more sense. I embraced my mind, my conscience, and my ability to reason. I rejected Christianity, finally, in its whole in July of 2005.



For the longest time I just hated Christians and thought them to be horrible, ignorant, deluded fools. But then I started noticing how many people were just like me. Living a lie because we fed into the crap that our church sold us; but even worse are the people who don't even obey a single word of the Bible, but still claim it inspires them. And you know, the notion of God does inspire people. Sometimes for ill, sometimes for good. However, inspiration is no reason for assuming the existence of such an entity. Do not Hindus feel Vishnu just as Muslims feel Allah? God gives people power, and I cannot begrudge people that. Life without motivation is not worth living. But I think that people can lose the focus --which is, as Joseph Campbell would argue, is their own existence-- they begin hurting others and have serious problems with life.


"An unexamined life is not worth living." --Socrates

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Post #18

Post by AlexMapleoir »

The Persnickety Platypus wrote:My story is almost the exact opposite.


After my time as a Christian I began to realize that I was never actually religious at all; rather, I was in perpetual denial (To please my mother? To resist admiting intellectual fault? I really don't know). When the walls of my faith came crashing down one day, it felt kind of like I was experiencing my true self for the first time.

So liberating. I have been happier ever since.
Aye, similar for me.

Although I did find myself having "withdrawal" so to speak.

Actually, I found so much around me I didnt know was there before, or that I was just used to.

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Post #19

Post by Cathar1950 »

There is still something to be said for myth and ritual.
Where would our culture be without Zeus, most likely there would have been more Odin.

Our stories enrich our cultures and life much like art.

river
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Re: Recovering Christians

Post #20

Post by river »

graphicsguy wrote:
Cathar1950 wrote:Former Christians or recovering Christians, do you really ever get over it?

You would think that with the claims Christians often make about God, the world and redemption they should not have problems otherwise what would make their existence any different that non-Christians with no claims?

If Christ defeated the powers then what is going on? Is this just imaginary?
Cathar, your questions scare me because I keep wondering how long I'm going to wonder about these things. How long am I going to flip flop between Atheist/Agnostic/Believer? Not that I'm doing serious flip-flopping right now, but being able to see the arguments from multiple sides can get very confusing from time to time.

Especially when all you've done is surround yourself with Christians throughout your life. They simply do not generally understand what it is that you're going through. They think you're backsliding or you're just wanting to make excuses to "sin" or you're just not being thankful for what's happened in your life or any number of other things.

You make a non-Christian friend and they tell you to "be careful". They think you're being attacked by Satan when you wonder if God even exists.

You tell them you found a solution to your problems outside of "Christian teaching" and they think the world is just leading you away.

And you're so torn up because your family thinks all those things about you too.
I hear ya. I stopped calling my mother because every time I talk to her I have to count to ten and recenter myself. She is an ordained evangelist. I know I can't be angry at her and my sister for not being the mother and sister I need them to be. They are not and probably never will be. But I am still responsible for my own peace of mind.

My family was indoctrinated in a Word of Faith ministry and for the last thirty years my mother has blamed me for not allowing God to heal my disabilities (I am legally blind and hard of hearing).

I walked away from Christianity about five or six years ago and of course she thinks I am deceived and on my way to hell. At first I would have recurring dreams about being left in the rapture. The last one was really bizarre. I saw the saints marching into Heaven and as I drew closer I realized they were all Chinese. I wondered if I could just slip in line and go into Heaven unnoticed.

When I woke I gave my subconscious mind orders to never do that to me again. I will not be frightened into believing something I know is not true. Except for one or two relapses my mind has obeyed orders.

Like so many of you I sometimes miss the music and atmosphere of the Church but one thing keeps me away and vetoes any notions about going back: the Bible. If it weren't for the Bible I would probably still be a Christian. Like many of you I've found stuff in that book that makes it impossible to think of it as the word of the Creator of the universe. And I find it absolutely intolerable to be trapped in a congregation for two or three hours while some preacher bludgeons me over the head with what I've come to realize are lies.

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