What is the definition of "law" in the NT

[scottlittlefield17]

In the topic I posted on the head covering Benoni and me disagreed on what "law" was. You can find the disagreement here. I did not press him to hard because I did not want to get off topic.

Here are my ideas Benoni:
1. The Bible is considered completely inherent with all parts having equal worth.
2. Each challege of the apposing post must be answered even if it is to say that you have no answer at the moment
3. That it is understood that neither of us have hard feelings toward the other.

If have anything to add please do. If not then just state your agreement with the above and I outline my first set of arguments.

[Benoni]

Ok I ready to get started but, as I in our comments I wok afternoons.

[Benoni]

1. The Bible is considered completely inherent with all parts having equal worth.

The Bible may be considered inherant but it is full of man made errors, bias and out right lies. The Word of God is inherent.

[scottlittlefield17]

Define what you mean. Do you mean to say that to say to require obedience to that scripture would be legalism? And if so, why?

Define what you mean. Do you mean to say that to say to require obedience to that scripture would be legalism? And if so, why?

Very much so. I am not under the law; I am under grace.

First we need to define what the law is. The law that you refer to is the OT set of rules and guidelines that if kept brought salvation. Of course man could not keep it so we needed a Savior to build that bridge between man and God. So the aspect of the law bringing salvation was no longer applicable. That however did not nullify the law. Jesus said,

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.

and Paul said

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

You said you are not under the law but grace. I fully agree, it is not the law that saves us but grace. However what is grace? Lets look at it from a Biblical perspective.
Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
Graces teaches us to to live soberly righteously and godly and ZEALOUS of good works. It doesn't sound like a license to ignore the commands of scripture.

Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

You can quote verses such as

Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

It still says we should serve but we are serving in a different spirit.

[scottlittlefield17]

1. The Bible is considered completely inherent with all parts having equal worth.

The Bible may be considered inherant but it is full of man made errors, bias and out right lies. The Word of God is inherent.

If the authenticity of any part of the Bible is challenged or downplayed in an argument than I will not consent to continue the debate.

[Benoni]

1. The Bible is considered completely inherent with all parts having equal worth.

The Bible may be considered inherant but it is full of man made errors, bias and out right lies. The Word of God is inherent.

If the authenticity of any part of the Bible is challenged or downplayed in an argument than I will not consent to continue the debate.

Who are you to dictate what is truth; if this is the case have a great day. You make a statement and cannot hear any rebuttal.

One word Easter. I worship Jesus my savior not a book.

Acts 12:4 Here you have a pagan Goddess that was placed in the Bible by corrupt translators.

[scottlittlefield17]

Who are you to dictate what is truth; if this is the case have a great day. You make a statement and cannot hear any rebuttal.

One word Easter. I worship Jesus my savior not a book.

Acts 12:4 Here you have a pagan Goddess that was placed in the Bible by corrupt translators.

Ok we will continue and hope for the best. Please reply to #2.

[Benoni]

First we need to define what the law is. The law that you refer to is the OT set of rules and guidelines that if kept brought salvation. Of course man could not keep it so we needed a Savior to build that bridge between man and God. So the aspect of the law bringing salvation was no longer applicable. That however did not nullify the law. Jesus said,

Of course it did not nullify the law; but what it also did not do was make a new standard of laws; instead it made a new life with in; not the letter that killeth but the spirit that quicken (makes alive).

Take one of the commandments… Thou shall not kill. I have no reason to kill my brother; for my spirit is the spirit of Christ with in me which a spirit of love, joy peace.

At the same time I am a Police Officer and I also retired active duty Army and this is where God has placed me. I did not choose my line of work; I rather do Children’s illustrations full time which is my passion.

In the line of duty if I had to kill a terrorist, I would do so for the sake of my people I am sworn to protect and my country. Praise God with over thirty years of experience to include service in Viet Nam for 18 months this has never happened and hopeful it never will.

But if it did Hid blood would cover me.

Have you ever turn the other cheek in His name. What an awesome blessing. Here is an example of Jesus law, turn the other cheek, what awesome spiritual power and experience no Law of Moses could ever touch.

I do not see God as a brute power I see Him as a balance God controller of all things especially good and evil (that is why we are here to overcome, to grow and mature), yes evil is not objects of substance like matter, but neither is God He is a spirit and good and evil are spiritual matters.

Give you an example, I as a parent made some serious mistakes raising one of my sons, he is now an adult, but about five years ago he would not speak to me, the anger of his difficult teen years and young adult years had taken hold and he hated his father. We talked but it was shallow and superficial and we needed a healing both of us.

One day I came home and my dog was not any where to be found, I saw something that proved my son had been there and he hated that dog; boy did I get angry, So I went to his apartment and accused him of the evil deed in my mind and when directly home.

Five minutes later he appeared at my door started yelling at me and the anger in him escalated; that is when the dog appeared from the basement.

He started hitting me. I knew I was totally wrong so I let him hit me over and over, I said to the Lord with in me, turn the other cheek as he struck me over and over I would just stand up and let him strike me over and over again and again. Finally his emotions bust and from that day on I have my son back.

The love in my family is so overwhelming. This is the way God works, I never rebuked Satan for this anger; I yielded to God. You want to see in the dark turn the light on, these are spiritual issues.

We both showed evil, anger, and all the negative fruits as Galatians 5;16 points out. So the solution to this anger was turning the other cheek; yield to the fruits of the spirit.

You see God was in control of all the evil in my household as well as the whole earth. I hear Christians say they are not carnal, but let me tell you something there was a lot of carnality in all of us, some try to cover it up with their religion or self-righteousness.

This is not a narrow vision of sovereignty; it is an understanding of whom and what God is how God works with in us. Turn the other cheek is not solid matter; it is a powerful spiritual force that the world laughs at as well as many Christians, but when used transforms lives.

Evil and all her negative sisters are a spiritual issue that’s power has touch the lives of all humanity sense the fall of Adam and God is the master over all this deep seated Adamic senses and out of the ground God made to grow the tree of good and evil. Jesus controlled all evil in His walk to the point He was in complete control of all the issues of the to the cross and its final out come, for He is the Alpha and the Omega and all the Greek letters in between.

[Benoni]

You said you are not under the law but grace. I fully agree, it is not the law that saves us but grace. However what is grace? Lets look at it from a Biblical perspective.

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
Graces teaches us to to live soberly righteously and godly and ZEALOUS of good works. It doesn't sound like a license to ignore the commands of scripture

I have one commandment and that is to love God and love my fellow man as my self. There is nothing in any of these verse that go against what God’s spirit has shown me; but I do not follow the law and commandments of scripture as if I have this AWESOME Bible holding me to its laws, WHAT BONDAGE...God’s Word is life not law, not commandments. His commandments are written on my heart so why do I need a another law book.

There is far too much legalism in Babylon, to include condemnation and far too little grace and fruit of the spirit.

2 Corinthians 3

1Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?

2Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:

3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
4And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:

5Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

6Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

7But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

8How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

9For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

10For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

12Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

13And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

14But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

15But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

17Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

18But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.


This chapter was not written to natural Israel; it was written to us.

[scottlittlefield17]

I have one commandment and that is to love God and love my fellow man as my self.

Really, you have ONE commandment? Last i checked that was the GREATEST commandment not the only one. If Jesus didn't mean it why did he say to turn the other cheek? To love your enemies WITHOUT any exceptions. Why are all those things in the Bible? Why are the lists of sins
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
and that is not he only such list. There is one in Revelation and one in Romans. It says in Revelation that the people in such sins WILL NOT got to heaven. Jesus says if you love me you will obey me. He also says that those who don't love him don't inherit the kingdom of heaven. So if you don't obey him you don't go to heaven.