If the NT Gospel is not God’s word then Quran is not

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Goose

If the NT Gospel is not God’s word then Quran is not

Post #1

Post by Goose »

"Let the followers of the Gospel judge in accordance with what Allah has revealed therein. Evil doers are those who do not base their judgments on Allah's revelations." Sura 5:47

"Say: 'People of the Book (Christians and Jews), you stand for nothing until you observe the Torah and the Gospel and that which is revealed to you from your Lord." Sura 5:68 (Al-Maida)

"Perfected are the words of your Lord in truth and justice. None can change them. He is the Hearing, the Knowing." Sura 6:115 (AI-An'am)

Argument (A):
  • 1. If the Gospel was a revelation from God, then the Gospel is God’s word.
    2. The Gospel was a revelation from God (Sura 5:47, 5:68)
    3. Therefore, the Gospel is God’s word (via modus ponens).
    4. If God’s word cannot be changed, then the Gospel found in the New Testament is God’s word.
    5. God’s word cannot be changed (Sura 6:115)
    6. Therefore, the Gospel found in the New testament is God’s word (via modus ponens).
Argument (B):
  • 1. If the Quran is the word of God, then the Gospel was not changed.
    2. The Gospel was changed.
    3. Therefore, the Quran is not the word of God (via modus tollens).
Either the Gospel found in the NT is God’s word or the Quran is not the word of God. Which is it?

Murad
Guru
Posts: 1216
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:32 am
Location: Australia - Sydney

Post #2

Post by Murad »

Goose wrote: 1. If the Gospel was a revelation from God, then the Gospel is God’s word.
I went through this numerous times; the Gospel of Jesus; is Gods word.
Goose wrote: 2. The Gospel was a revelation from God (Sura 5:47, 5:68)
Yes it was.
Goose wrote: 3. Therefore, the Gospel is God’s word (via modus ponens).
Yes it is
Goose wrote: 4. If God’s word cannot be changed, then the Gospel found in the New Testament is God’s word.
You seem to love repeating yourself.
The Gospel "ACCORDING TO":Mark, Luke, Matthew, John; is NOT the Gospel of Jesus.
Goose wrote: 5. God’s word cannot be changed (Sura 6:115)
True; hence the Quran is perfect.
Goose wrote: 6. Therefore, the Gospel found in the New testament is God’s word (via modus ponens).
#-o


Goose wrote: 1. If the Quran is the word of God, then the Gospel was not changed.
2. The Gospel was changed.
3. Therefore, the Quran is not the word of God (via modus tollens).
#-o

I think i told you personally; three or four times; the Gospel of Jesus; was never a book.
Do the people think that they will be left to say, "We believe" without being put to the test?
We have tested those before them, for GOD must distinguish those who are truthful, and He must expose the liars.

(Quran 29:2-3)

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Why Jesus is NOT God
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Goose

Post #3

Post by Goose »

Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 1. If the Gospel was a revelation from God, then the Gospel is God’s word.
I went through this numerous times; the Gospel of Jesus; is Gods word.
So far so good.
Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 2. The Gospel was a revelation from God (Sura 5:47, 5:68)
Yes it was.
So far so good.
Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 3. Therefore, the Gospel is God’s word (via modus ponens).
Yes it is
So far so good.
Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 4. If God’s word cannot be changed, then the Gospel found in the New Testament is God’s word.
You seem to love repeating yourself.
The Gospel "ACCORDING TO":Mark, Luke, Matthew, John; is NOT the Gospel of Jesus.
Then the Gospel of Jesus was changed.
Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 5. God’s word cannot be changed (Sura 6:115)
True; hence the Quran is perfect.
Hence the Quran is false as it claims God’s word cannot be changed, but the Gospel of Jesus, which is God’s word, was changed.
Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 6. Therefore, the Gospel found in the New testament is God’s word (via modus ponens).
#-o
I can understand your frustration. The Quran is full of problems and proves itself to be false.


Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 1. If the Quran is the word of God, then the Gospel was not changed.
2. The Gospel was changed.
3. Therefore, the Quran is not the word of God (via modus tollens).
#-o

I think i told you personally; three or four times; the Gospel of Jesus; was never a book.
If the Gospel of Jesus changed from what he revealed to what was recorded in the Gospel accounts found in the New Testament then the Gospel of Jesus, which was God’s word, was changed. If the Gospel was changed the Quran is false and not the word of God.

Murad
Guru
Posts: 1216
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:32 am
Location: Australia - Sydney

Post #4

Post by Murad »

Goose wrote:
Murad wrote:
Goose wrote: 4. If God’s word cannot be changed, then the Gospel found in the New Testament is God’s word.
You seem to love repeating yourself.
The Gospel "ACCORDING TO":Mark, Luke, Matthew, John; is NOT the Gospel of Jesus.
Then the Gospel of Jesus was changed.
*MEGA FACE-PALM*


Ok; since you insist on what the Quran says; i'll give you 2 options.
1) I'll agree with you, and you can have a good-night sleep
2) You can re-read your post to see if you made any sense
Or my favourite:
3) You can accept what Islamic Theology says & always did say since the dawn of its creation regarding what it believes.
I'll even make it bold for you(to help you out):
The Gospel of Jesus, Is NOT a book
The new testament is not the Gospel of Jesus
The new testament is the Gospel according to [INSERT NAME HERE]
PERIOD(Full Stop)
Do the people think that they will be left to say, "We believe" without being put to the test?
We have tested those before them, for GOD must distinguish those who are truthful, and He must expose the liars.

(Quran 29:2-3)

----
Why Jesus is NOT God
---

Goose

Post #5

Post by Goose »

Murad wrote:Ok; since you insist on what the Quran says; i'll give you 2 options.
1) I'll agree with you, and you can have a good-night sleep
If you agree with me then you agree the Quran is false and not the word of God. Sleep tight…
Murad wrote:2) You can re-read your post to see if you made any sense
My arguments made perfect logical sense. I’m sorry you have difficulty following the logic of it.
Murad wrote:Or my favourite:
3) You can accept what Islamic Theology says & always did say since the dawn of its creation regarding what it believes.
I'll even make it bold for you(to help you out):
The Gospel of Jesus, Is NOT a book
The new testament is not the Gospel of Jesus
The new testament is the Gospel according to [INSERT NAME HERE]
PERIOD(Full Stop)
Here’s what you just don’t seem to get. You say the Gospel of Jesus is not a book. Fine. Jesus revealed the Gospel given to him by God. If the Gospel Jesus revealed was in any way, distorted, altered or changed from what Jesus delivered to what was finally recorded in the gospel accounts then the Gospel of Jesus was changed. If the Gospel of Jesus was changed the Quran is false and not the word of God. Add to this Muhammad would be a false prophet.

Murad
Guru
Posts: 1216
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:32 am
Location: Australia - Sydney

Post #6

Post by Murad »

Goose wrote:Here’s what you just don’t seem to get.
Please dazzle me.
Goose wrote: You say the Gospel of Jesus is not a book. Fine.
Great; i knew you could grasp the idea.
Goose wrote: Jesus revealed the Gospel given to him by God.
Yep.
Goose wrote: If the Gospel Jesus revealed was in any way, distorted, altered or changed from what Jesus delivered to what was finally recorded in the gospel accounts then the Gospel of Jesus was changed.
The Gospel of Jesus was a revelation of knowledge; the revelation God revealed to Jesus personally; thus this knowledge could not have been changed.

But what can happen is; anonymous authors making false quotes & assertions regarding Jesus with 'knowledge' passed down by oral tradition for decades.

To say; someone couldn't make a false Quran is totally illogical; but no-one can corrupt the Quran & its messege which was delivered by God.
Do the people think that they will be left to say, "We believe" without being put to the test?
We have tested those before them, for GOD must distinguish those who are truthful, and He must expose the liars.

(Quran 29:2-3)

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Why Jesus is NOT God
---

horiturk
Student
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:20 pm
Location: Ft. Worth Texas

Post #7

Post by horiturk »

jesus spoke for God,his disciples in their "letters" did not....they were not prophets,but disciples.case closed

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