Sex Before Marriage is NOT a sin in the bible!!

Debating issues regarding sexuality

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revjoel2013
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Sex Before Marriage is NOT a sin in the bible!!

Post #1

Post by revjoel2013 »

I study the bible and found that premarital sex is not a sin in the bible. This sin is created by Church doctrine. The early church twisted the word fornication to mean sex before marriage. The word fornication actually means having sex with a pagan temple prostitute. The early church fathers redefine the word fornication to mean all sex outside of marriage. This is how the doctrine that premarital sex is a sin started.

Why Should Christians Engage in Premarital Sex / Sex Before Marriage!!!

http://youtu.be/4lSv9kPIx0Q

What does fornication mean in the Bible; Latin Greek and Hebrew or

http://youtu.be/UVAI2TTOcgM[/img]

YahDough
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Re: Sex Before Marriage is NOT a sin in the bible!!

Post #11

Post by YahDough »

DanieltheDragon wrote:
YahDough wrote:
DanieltheDragon wrote:
YahDough wrote: [Replying to post 1 by revjoel2013]

Trying to redefine the truth of God's laws for self-justification (or any other reason) is fools business. I'm reminded of the verse in the Bible about people with "itching ears."

2Tm:4:3: For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Or even worse, people who turn God's grace into a licence to sin.

Jude:1:4: For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
Christians will always be stuck redefining the bible that's just the nature of trying to interpret bronze age theology in the modern era what the OP was doing was not redefining but rather trying to clarify what the bible actually says vs what is being taught.
Trying to justify acts of sin does not "clarify" God's message of salvation. It confuses it. To compromise God's grace with private interpretations of what God teaches us through the Holy Ghost is wrong. There is nothing "bronze age" about right versus wrong in the eyes of God.

Heb:13:8: Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
The OP is not justifying anything though. the op is asking where the concept of sex before marriage theology comes from.
I hate to break it to you (mostly because you probably won't understand and I'm wasting my time) but all unsanctified sex is sin. God intended intercourse to be the consummation of a marriage and experienced within the confines of a marriage. Fornication and adultery are ways to get around marriage. Both are wrong. And none of this "fornication only means sex with temple prostitutes" malarky. Fornication includes all sexual relations between a man and woman outside of marriage. Have you looked it up in a dictionary?

1Cor:6:9: Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
The OP could not find a vaild source for it and therefore could not justify said belief in this theological constraint.
The OP wanted to redefine fornication and adultery for his own purposes. His blanket statement fails.
If you would like to clarify it for the OP go for it. Show him where the bible spells it out. If you cant spell it out with the bible you are just using your own or others private interpretations.
How about the man who got handed over to the devil for the destruction of the flesh for having sex with his dad's wife? He had sex with her before marriage. ! Cor. 5:1-6

1: It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
2: And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
3: For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
4: In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
5: To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

DanieltheDragon
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Post #12

Post by DanieltheDragon »

i1 Cor. 5:1-6 talks about fornicating with your fathers wife. This has nothing to do with sex before marriage. Also it doesn't really address incest either as polygamy was fairly common at this point. It has more to do with a violation of property rights really. It specifically is addressing violating your fathers property not pre-marital sex.

Also key point at the end even if you defile your fathers property as long as your accuser is allowed to damage your flesh your spirit can still be saved.

so again your "proof" does not specifically address pre-maritial sex.

I hate to break it to you but you are not wasting your time I think there is a lot you can still learn from this discussion. What other proofs do you have?


p.s. I looked at the greek and the Satan should be lower cased in your translation as the operative word in the original text is satana which simply means the adversary. the Hebrew version of this word means prosecuter the greek is not used as a proper noun so a capital Satan is incorrect here as it is not a name but a pro-noun referring to the offended party.

YahDough
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Post #13

Post by YahDough »

DanieltheDragon wrote: i1 Cor. 5:1-6 talks about fornicating with your fathers wife. This has nothing to do with sex before marriage. Also it doesn't really address incest either as polygamy was fairly common at this point. It has more to do with a violation of property rights really. It specifically is addressing violating your fathers property not pre-marital sex.

Also key point at the end even if you defile your fathers property as long as your accuser is allowed to damage your flesh your spirit can still be saved.

so again your "proof" does not specifically address pre-maritial sex.

I hate to break it to you but you are not wasting your time I think there is a lot you can still learn from this discussion. What other proofs do you have?


p.s. I looked at the greek and the Satan should be lower cased in your translation as the operative word in the original text is satana which simply means the adversary. the Hebrew version of this word means prosecuter the greek is not used as a proper noun so a capital Satan is incorrect here as it is not a name but a pro-noun referring to the offended party.
You divert the issue by changing the subject and changing the conditions of the blanket top post. You lose.
Fornication is a sin. Fornication is sexual relations outside of marriage.

Gal.5
19: Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20: Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21: Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

DanieltheDragon
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Post #14

Post by DanieltheDragon »

I am not diverting the issue you brought up the last verse about sexual relations with your fathers mother. which was all you proved in the last verse.

You really need to read the greek and Hebrew though to get a more accurate translation.

the word fornication in your translation comes from

aselgeia: licentiousness, wantonness
Original Word: ἀσέλγεια, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: aselgeia
Phonetic Spelling: (as-elg'-i-a)
Short Definition: wantonness, lewdness
Definition: (outrageous conduct, conduct shocking to public decency, a wanton violence), wantonness, lewdness.


and

akatharsia: uncleanness
Original Word: ἀκαθα�σία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: akatharsia
Phonetic Spelling: (ak-ath-ar-see'-ah)
Short Definition: uncleanness, impurity
Definition: uncleanness, impurity.

neither of which mean what you are trying to imply you are using your own personal interpretation of the text to suit your needs whilst I am taking it at face value. again I am using evidence to support my case please give me another verse to establish your assertion.

Declaring that you win means nothing in a debate as we are both of differing opinion. You only win when you convince me which you have not sufficiently done.

YahDough
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Post #15

Post by YahDough »

DanieltheDragon wrote: I am not diverting the issue you brought up the last verse about sexual relations with your fathers mother. which was all you proved in the last verse.
You really need to read the greek and Hebrew though to get a more accurate translation.

You need to read a dictionary in context with the Bible message to understand the overall meaning. "Fornication" is best defined as having sexual activities (uncleanness and intercourse) outside of marriage.
...again I am using evidence to support my case please give me another verse to establish your assertion.
You make this easy. Here's 25 verses

Mat:5:32: But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

Mt:15:19: For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

Mt:19:9: And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

Mk:7:21: For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,

Jn:8:41: Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.

Acts:15:20: But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

Acts:15:29: That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

Acts:21:25: As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.

Rom:1:29: Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

1Cor:5:1: It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.

1Cor:5:9: I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:

1Cor:5:10: Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.

1Cor:5:11: But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

1Cor:6:9: Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

1Cor:6:13: Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.

1Cor:6:18: Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.

1Cor:7:2: Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.

1Cor:10:8: Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.

2Cor:12:21: And lest, when I come again, my God will humble me among you, and that I shall bewail many which have sinned already, and have not repented of the uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness which they have committed.

Gal:5:19: Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

Eph:5:3: But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;

Col:3:5: Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

1Thes:4:3: For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:

Heb:12:16: Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.

Jude:1:7: Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

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Post #16

Post by mitty »

Wootah wrote: Hi revjoel2013,

Since Jesus defines adultery as looking at another person lustfully as a sin then it seems fairly simply to understand that sex before marriage would be a sin.
So what is the biblical definition of marriage?

A biblical marriage is simply a personal agreement between two people only and does not require a marriage celebrant or a legally signed marriage contract or any of the other wedding hoo ha. The notion of sex before marriage is therefore a nonsensical oxymoron, and that any long-term relationship is a marriage. The more pertinent question concerns Jesus' statement that divorcees who remarry continuously commit adultery. Is this one of the main reasons that Jesus said that there was no one in heaven (John 3:13), and that divorcees should remain celibate, or even that divorcees should cut off their genitals and throw them away (Matt 5:29-30) in order to avoid automatically committing adultery and being executed and then tossed into a lake of fire?
Last edited by mitty on Wed Jul 03, 2013 6:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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bluethread
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Post #17

Post by bluethread »

So, what is a mamzer? Deut. 23:2 "A bastard(mamzer) shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD."

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Post #18

Post by mitty »

bluethread wrote: So, what is a mamzer? Deut. 23:2 "A bastard(mamzer) shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD."
My guess would be a person born from an adulterous relationship, since pre-marital sex can't happen according to a biblical definition of marriage.

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Post #19

Post by tryme »

[Replying to Wootah]


All you will ever find in this topic is people saying g “implied� “suggested�, when the Bible doesn’t “suggest� nursery is wrong, is clearly states it. So maybe you’re just adding words to the Bible that just aren’t there or you’ve blindly bought the lie that most other Christians have… Point me to a verse that explicitly says it is a sin, not “implies�.

tryme
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Post #20

Post by tryme »

[Replying to Wootah]


Also, Adultery refers only to people who are married… It says nothing about unmarried or premarital

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