Homosexuality by our genes compared to the Bible

[TheGreatDebate]

Is homosexuality something you are born with? Well I am not aware of any studies but if I had to guess I would say it probably has a part in it.

Now people use that to defend homosexuality from the Bible, but is it really a good defense?

According to numerous studies, children of criminals are born with a genetic tendency to be criminals as well. Including studies of adopted children that were born to criminals growing up in another law-abiding household.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB1 ... 2892520530

Also it is well established that Native Americans are born with a tendency to be predisposed to alcoholism. Much more so than other races.

http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/arh301/3-4.htm

So using the same logic, we should allow the children of criminals to walk free and Native Americans who drink and drive free as well. But wait, that sounds ridiculous right?

[99percentatheism]

How does a "homosexual," a person "born that way," to desire same gender sexual behavior . . . that, say, is born into a village or town where there are no other "gay" children, how do they find their sexual partners without coercing and/or seducing non homosexual people into having sexual intercourse with them?

They could go somewhere else and find other gay people. There is no seducing or coercing of straight people. "Gay recruiting" is a lie.

I disagree as is obvious. And there are Lesbian, Gay and Queer studies that can lead to a degree in the academic fields are there not?

My real life experiences say otherwise in response to your opinion. Going to certain kinds of parties was a virtual mine field of watching what I drank and why. Even you should agree that, even if it were a crush . . . there is no way to tell, nor hardly a way to protect yourself from, what someone of the same gender is plotting for you sexually. How can one tell?

And you seem to be forgetting the term: "Turned out." And unfortunately, there weren't many appropriate links for me to use in showing what I mean. But I am guessing that you are very much aware of what I mean. Or at least can gain some knowledge easily with just a touch a study.

Recruiting? I'd say that that has been a very successful venture for the LGBT pride movement in many western lands. How many pride parades are there now going on around the globe? Even you, in another thread, said there is nothing wrong with homosexual behavior? No harm at all right?

Maybe an honest dialog about reality will help us all?

[Danmark]

How does a "homosexual," a person "born that way," to desire same gender sexual behavior . . . that, say, is born into a village or town where there are no other "gay" children, how do they find their sexual partners without coercing and/or seducing non homosexual people into having sexual intercourse with them?

They could go somewhere else and find other gay people. There is no seducing or coercing of straight people. "Gay recruiting" is a lie.

I disagree as is obvious. And there are Lesbian, Gay and Queer studies that can lead to a degree in the academic fields are there not?

My real life experiences say otherwise in response to your opinion. Going to certain kinds of parties was a virtual mine field of watching what I drank and why. Even you should agree that, even if it were a crush . . . there is no way to tell, nor hardly a way to protect yourself from, what someone of the same gender is plotting for you sexually. How can one tell?

And you seem to be forgetting the term: "Turned out." And unfortunately, there weren't many appropriate links for me to use in showing what I mean.

Maybe you couldn't find 'appropriate links' because you are dead wrong.

You've sighted a personal example to support your argument, so your personal response is fair game.

99%:

Going to certain kinds of parties was a virtual mine field of watching what I drank and why. . . . there is no way to tell, nor hardly a way to protect yourself from, what someone of the same gender is plotting for you sexually.

This speaks volumes. What are you afraid of? If some one were attracted to you, how are you being threatened? What is it you need 'protection' from? People of the opposite gender have their 'sexual plots.' As long as violence is not proposed, just say 'no.' Women do this all the time. They simply decline the invitation.

Most heterosexual men I know, including myself have been approached, by both men and women. A simple 'I'm not interested' has always sufficed. What's the basis for fear? I can certainly understand a physically or emotionally weak person being afraid of an overbearing advance, but unless you are talking about criminal behavior, I find the projected fear a man claims to have about an offer for a sexual dalliance laughable in the extreme. I've never quoted Nancy Reagan before, but, you can "Just say 'no.'"

[Danmark]

Recruiting? I'd say that that has been a very successful venture for the LGBT pride movement in many western lands. How many pride parades are there now going on around the globe?

You claim gays are 'recruiting.' If by this you mean that gays are trying to 'recruit' heterosexuals to become gay, prove your claim or withdraw it.

To prove this claim you will have to show that a significant number of gays knowingly try to convert a self proclaimed heterosexual to 'the gay.' You'll also have to show how this differs from a heterosexual trying to seduce another heterosexual who has declined the first advance.

[Zzyzx]

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Although I don't usually frequent this sub-forum, reports of some posts as uncivil called it to my attention. The reports were cleared by others, so I can respond as a debater not a moderator.

How does a "homosexual," a person "born that way," to desire same gender sexual behavior . . . that, say, is born into a village or town where there are no other "gay" children, how do they find their sexual partners without coercing and/or seducing non homosexual people into having sexual intercourse with them?

They could go somewhere else and find other gay people. There is no seducing or coercing of straight people. "Gay recruiting" is a lie.

I disagree as is obvious. And there are Lesbian, Gay and Queer studies that can lead to a degree in the academic fields are there not?

There are many wide-ranging academic degrees. So what?

Does existence of a degree require or necessitate seducing or coercing anyone?

My real life experiences say otherwise in response to your opinion. Going to certain kinds of parties was a virtual mine field of watching what I drank and why.

Perhaps one should be selective in choosing what parties to attend – and should always be careful about how much they drink.

Are you saying that you were seduced while intoxicated at parties (or that you feared being seduced)?

Even you should agree that, even if it were a crush . . . there is no way to tell, nor hardly a way to protect yourself from, what someone of the same gender is plotting for you sexually.

"Protect yourself?" Protection is only required in the event of force OR perhaps stupidity / gullibility.

If one is approached by ANY person of ANY gender with suggestions that are not appealing they are entitled to decline (politely or otherwise).

I suspect that those who are most "afraid" of being approached are those who realize they are susceptible to what is proposed.

How can one tell?

Does one need advance notice in order to decline an inviation?

And you seem to be forgetting the term: "Turned out." And unfortunately, there weren't many appropriate links for me to use in showing what I mean. But I am guessing that you are very much aware of what I mean. Or at least can gain some knowledge easily with just a touch a study.

The term "turned out" is often used in prostitution to mean "to engage or be subjected to unusual sexual activities" it is also used in other contexts to indicate engagement in various sexual (or other) activities.

One can be "turned out" (or "in') to BDSM, for instance – when they are introduced to the concept and find it appealing.

Recruiting? I'd say that that has been a very successful venture for the LGBT pride movement in many western lands.

Can you cite studies and statistics (not just personal opinions or conjectures) to verify that recruitment by LGBT has been "successful?" What is the percentage increase in LGBT in the US or world population due to recruitment? Statistics, data, verification?

How many pride parades are there now going on around the globe?

What importance do parades have in relation to recruitment (or inducement, or coercion)?

Even you, in another thread, said there is nothing wrong with homosexual behavior?

Who is it that determines what is "right" or "wrong" in ANYONE'S sexual behavior?

No harm at all right?

I maintain there is no harm in homosexual behavior between consulting adults of either gender. What others do in their bedroom is NOT my business (or yours).

Maybe an honest dialog about reality will help us all?

When and where would you like to start?

Can you accept that in reality somewhere between two percent and ten percent of the US population is homosexual or bisexual by personal preference and orientation?

[Zzyzx]

.

It is worthy of note that many very vocal and adamant homophobes have turned out to be homosexuals in denial or "in the closet" who were later exposed, often amid scandals and publicity.

Homophobes are a group of people who have a negative feeling towards homosexuality, but new research claims that people who express hatred of gays are secretly more likely to be attracted to the same sex.

Researchers from the University of Rochester, the University of Essex and the University of California in Santa Barbara have discovered that homophobes are actually attracted to the same sex but they do not admit it because they grew up with authoritarian parents who forbade such desires. They found this when they conducted a series of psychology studies.

The researchers assert that people who define themselves as straight and who hate homosexuality are often attracted to the same sex. They believe that homosexual people remind them of similar tendencies within themselves.

"Individuals who identify as straight but in psychological tests show a strong attraction to the same sex may be threatened by gays and lesbians because homosexuals remind them of similar tendencies within themselves," said Netta Weinstein, a lecturer at the University of Essex, in a statement.

The article continues at: http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/homophobes-sam ... ple-325417

Of course the research does not indicate that ALL people who exhibit homophobic characteristics are secretly homosexual – but does indicate that it is LIKELY that homophobes are homosexual. They may have other reasons to hate or fear homosexuals.

[99percentatheism]

Danmark

How does a "homosexual," a person "born that way," to desire same gender sexual behavior . . . that, say, is born into a village or town where there are no other "gay" children, how do they find their sexual partners without coercing and/or seducing non homosexual people into having sexual intercourse with them?

They could go somewhere else and find other gay people. There is no seducing or coercing of straight people. "Gay recruiting" is a lie.

I disagree as is obvious. And there are Lesbian, Gay and Queer studies that can lead to a degree in the academic fields are there not?

My real life experiences say otherwise in response to your opinion. Going to certain kinds of parties was a virtual mine field of watching what I drank and why. Even you should agree that, even if it were a crush . . . there is no way to tell, nor hardly a way to protect yourself from, what someone of the same gender is plotting for you sexually. How can one tell?

And you seem to be forgetting the term: "Turned out." And unfortunately, there weren't many appropriate links for me to use in showing what I mean.

Maybe you couldn't find 'appropriate links' because you are dead wrong.

http://townhall.com/columnists/michelle ... /page/full

You've sighted a personal example to support your argument, so your personal response is fair game.

"Fair game." What a fascinating label you chose.

99%:

Going to certain kinds of parties was a virtual mine field of watching what I drank and why. . . . there is no way to tell, nor hardly a way to protect yourself from, what someone of the same gender is plotting for you sexually.

This speaks volumes. What are you afraid of? If some one were attracted to you, how are you being threatened? What is it you need 'protection' from? People of the opposite gender have their 'sexual plots.' As long as violence is not proposed, just say 'no.' Women do this all the time. They simply decline the invitation.

People of the same gender can hide in plain sight. Literally.

Most heterosexual men I know, including myself have been approached, by both men and women. A simple 'I'm not interested' has always sufficed. What's the basis for fear?

Not when you are drugged and or threatened or coerced. Or pressured for other reasons.

I can certainly understand a physically or emotionally weak person being afraid of an overbearing advance, but unless you are talking about criminal behavior, I find the projected fear a man claims to have about an offer for a sexual dalliance laughable in the extreme. I've never quoted Nancy Reagan before, but, you can "Just say 'no.'"

And be called a homophobe, intolerant and hateful?

[99percentatheism]

.

It is worthy of note that many very vocal and adamant homophobes have turned out to be homosexuals in denial or "in the closet" who were later exposed, often amid scandals and publicity.

Homophobes are a group of people who have a negative feeling towards homosexuality, but new research claims that people who express hatred of gays are secretly more likely to be attracted to the same sex.

Researchers from the University of Rochester, the University of Essex and the University of California in Santa Barbara have discovered that homophobes are actually attracted to the same sex but they do not admit it because they grew up with authoritarian parents who forbade such desires. They found this when they conducted a series of psychology studies.

The researchers assert that people who define themselves as straight and who hate homosexuality are often attracted to the same sex. They believe that homosexual people remind them of similar tendencies within themselves.

"Individuals who identify as straight but in psychological tests show a strong attraction to the same sex may be threatened by gays and lesbians because homosexuals remind them of similar tendencies within themselves," said Netta Weinstein, a lecturer at the University of Essex, in a statement.

The article continues at: http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/homophobes-sam ... ple-325417

Of course the research does not indicate that ALL people who exhibit homophobic characteristics are secretly homosexual – but does indicate that it is LIKELY that homophobes are homosexual. They may have other reasons to hate or fear homosexuals.

So then people that "hate" pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers, to name only a few kinds of people that exhibit behavior that "others" find repulsive, repugnant and unacceptable . . . they are actually, maybe, really: pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers?

Interesting. Then of course Doctors are actually secretly desiring to be ill people?

[Haven]

So then people that "hate" pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers, to name only a few kinds of people that exhibit behavior that "others" find repulsive, repugnant and unacceptable . . . they are actually, maybe, really: pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers?

Interesting. Then of course Doctors are actually secretly desiring to be ill people?

Are you seriously comparing homosexuality to pedophilia, murder, terrorism, and serial murder?

[Zzyzx]

.

So then people that "hate" pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers, to name only a few kinds of people that exhibit behavior that "others" find repulsive, repugnant and unacceptable . . . they are actually, maybe, really: pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers?

Interesting. Then of course Doctors are actually secretly desiring to be ill people?

Since the article cited says nothing about any of those things and neither does my post, WHERE does all that about pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers and doctors come from? A fertile imagination?

"Protest too much" comes to mind.

[Danmark]

So then people that "hate" pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers, to name only a few kinds of people that exhibit behavior that "others" find repulsive, repugnant and unacceptable . . . they are actually, maybe, really: pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, serial killers?

Interesting. Then of course Doctors are actually secretly desiring to be ill people?

Where in Christianity is it written that we should "hate" the sinner, rather than the sin?

I hate the behavior of self righteous hypocrites. I find them repulsive, repugnant and unacceptable. To me they are one step below "pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, and serial killers" because I think they have more choice in how they behave, than do "pedophiles, murderers, terrorists, and serial killers."

Your claim about doctors wanting to be sick follows a logic I am happy to say I do not follow.