Why Doesn't Anyone Know What A God Is?

[DavidLeon]

Debate Question: What is a god? Why is it that no one seems to understand the simple concept of god anymore? Hopefully what I will do here is demonstrate why no one seems to know what a god is by demonstrating what exactly a god is. Hopefully.

[DavidLeon]

Interesting statement.
However the body of knowledge of atheists certainly spans what theists' do, so that is a very unfair comment.
I am also not an atheist.

The body of knowledge of atheists depends upon theism to an extent but more accurately is simply a lack of belief or disbelief in God or gods. Put simply gods including the Christian God. You have stated that as your position. Correct?

But here we are, instead of pointing out the tiniest fact that can identify or distinguish what are supposed to be the most profound things in the cosmos; God or gods - from imaginary, you make a statement about those who do not believe.

God is a simple word that means anyone or anything venerated. If a god is supposed to be the most profound thing in the cosmos, fine, but if it's supposed to be a phallic symbol, that is a representation of the male sex organ, worshiped for thousands of years in fertility religions, prayed to, sacrificed children to, adopted by apostate Christianity then it is a god.

You can't argue with that. It's fact. That you obstinately persist in ignorance of this fact isn't my problem. It's yours.

A god doesn't have to fit the mold of the Abrahamic faith commonly known in the West. God isn't the only god nor is God a paradigm for divinity. God is simply one of a million gods. The one I showed you a photograph of; the cross, is a god that does exist. Literally. If you have to reject the simple dictionary definition of gods in order to maintain your ideology it may reflect a problem with your reasoning.

You should have an easy task.

It was easy. But convincing you isn't part of it. That is entirely up to you. Your wrong. Some people don't take that so well.

In another thought:
The fact that all these god are imaginary also ELEGANTLY explains why 'no knows what a god is.'

Ooo, Elegance! Ignorance isn't elegant.

Those who knew or thought they knew (like paranoid schizophrenics from history - example, those who disappear into the wilderness with a chisel) it came from their imagination, and as such, the imagination of many people as that imagination intersects something that does not exist.

If the paranoid schizophrenics imagine they are George Washington that doesn't mean Washington never existed.

Why gods SHOULD be as variable as unicorns, dragons, wights, fairies, elves, and son of a gun, they are.

Yeah. Anything imagined is a god because you need to believe that gods are only imagined. Ideological possession.

Why gods can be as variable as dreams!
And that explains elegantly why no one knows what a god is.

Cool, huh?

No. Weak and inaccurate.

[DavidLeon]

All gods exist in the imaginations of human beings. Some, like Zeus, are worthy of their creators. Others, like Jehovah, are complete numpties not worthy of the title. Whatever their strengths and weaknesses, it is reassuring to know that none of them exist in reality.

This is what fascinates me about atheists. Unbelievers if you wish. All gods exist in the imaginations of humans is wrong, but even if it wasn't, so what? We imagined we could fly. We imagine there may be extraterrestrial aliens and string theory. What is your problem with the imagination?

Then you have to go on and insult this imaginary being. Isn't that interesting? It's like a little child on a playground who insults another child's parent. Are they angry at the parent or the child? Who are they trying to hurt, harass, or insult?

You say they don't exist in reality, but I've demonstrated they do. You may be referring to specific gods, but how can you ascertain whether they exist in reality or not? Because the history of people who have misrepresented them? Those are the people you are trying to hurt, harass or insult?

Because they can vote against your political party? Political parties are also a product of our imagination. The religious represent, to you, a threat to your world view. Against everything you think . . . holy. Maybe not a good word. Right would be a better word. But how do you know what is right and what is wrong? You decide that. From imaginationland!

If the Christians shared your world view and with their numbers voted in all things you thought were right and struck down all things you thought were wrong would you be here criticizing their beliefs?

Interesting, huh?

[Clownboat]

This is what fascinates me about atheists. Unbelievers if you wish. All gods exist in the imaginations of humans is wrong,

Readers, I believe we have identified the motive for the desire to have the term god, be obfuscated in to being meaningless.

When the word god has no meaning (or more accurately can mean just about anything) they can feel that their belief in said god is protected from scrutiny, here specifically the scrutiny that all god concepts we know of today cannot be shown to be anything more than the imagination of humans.

When a stick in the ground, toilet seat or money can all be considered to be gods, then clearly not all gods are human imagination. When gods mean what societies think:
God
noun
1.
(in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
...then claims about them being human imagination is able to be observed.
Thus motive to obfuscate...

Making the debate question awfully ironic from where I sit:
"Why is it that no one seems to understand the simple concept of god anymore?"

[Willum]

[Replying to DavidLeon in post #51]

The body of knowledge of atheists depends upon theism to an extent but more accurately is simply a lack of belief or disbelief in God or gods. Put simply gods including the Christian God. You have stated that as your position. Correct?

No, belief and knowledge are not the same, nor are they necessarily related. I see no reason for you to try to make that segue-way.

If a god is supposed to be the most profound thing in the cosmos, fine, but if it's supposed to be a phallic symbol, that is a representation of the male sex organ, wor...

Your pregnant "If..." is music to my argument. If, you are basically saying, if god exists of some description, then god exists. Allowing you to define it as mustard jelly if you like. I will bypass this specious argument, and not argue with you about gods that are ordinary items. I don't know if you think you are being funny by stating someone worships a phallic device or not, but I am not amused.
I will agree with you, if you want to call a god a rock, that is fine as your opinion. I will call it a rock. Sorry.

But let us return to your pregnant "if," and its counter, you are saying IF God/gods exist, then they exist.
I am saying SINCE gods/God can not be distinguished from the imaginary, they do not exist - outside the imagination. You may imagine things are gods as a compliment to this generalization.
I am waiting to be shown otherwise.
And to repeat, I do not find you or anyone else worshiping a phallic symbol to be evidence of a god.

A god doesn't have to fit the mold of the Abrahamic faith commonly known in the West.

That has been my argument from the start. They are all imaginary, or as you would say it, physical object imagined as gods.

It was easy. But convincing you isn't part of it. That is entirely up to you. Your wrong.

My wrong what?
You're wrong. SMH.

Ooo, Elegance! Ignorance isn't elegant.

You are making another claim without substantiation.

If the paranoid schizophrenics imagine they are George Washington that doesn't mean Washington never existed.

Excellent point, and if God spoke to the multitudes, you would have one. Instead he only spoke to madman.

Yeah. Anything imagined is a god because you need to believe that gods are only imagined. Ideological possession.

A personal opinion about me is not acceptable. I don't need to believe it - there is no evidence to counter it. Or you would have presented some.
Wouldn't you?

No. Weak and inaccurate.

Another unfounded and unsubstantiated claim.

[Replying to Clownboat in post #53]
Well said, I can't believe I missed it.

[DavidLeon]

This is what fascinates me about atheists. Unbelievers if you wish. All gods exist in the imaginations of humans is wrong,

Readers, I believe we have identified the motive for the desire to have the term god, be obfuscated in to being meaningless.

When the word god has no meaning (or more accurately can mean just about anything) they can feel that their belief in said god is protected from scrutiny, here specifically the scrutiny that all god concepts we know of today cannot be shown to be anything more than the imagination of humans.

When a stick in the ground, toilet seat or money can all be considered to be gods, then clearly not all gods are human imagination. When gods mean what societies think:
God
noun
1.
(in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
...then claims about them being human imagination is able to be observed.
Thus motive to obfuscate...

Making the debate question awfully ironic from where I sit:
"Why is it that no one seems to understand the simple concept of god anymore?"

Nothing has changed. If your position is that the Christian god, commonly stylized as God, is a product of imagination nothing has changed. I haven't obfuscated anything. Now, I'm going to do what I always do at this point. I'm going to ask a question to anyone reading this. Typically this question is completely ignored.

The question is, what is a god?

[Willum]

[Replying to DavidLeon in post #55]

The question is, what is a god?

A god is an imaginary being (or an object with imaginary properties, to split hairs) venerated by a culture.

Please show otherwise.

[DavidLeon]

No, belief and knowledge are not the same, nor are they necessarily related. I see no reason for you to try to make that segue-way.

All right, then, you don't know if all gods that have ever been known to man are products of the human imagination, correct?

Your pregnant "If..." is music to my argument. If, you are basically saying, if god exists of some description, then god exists. Allowing you to define it as mustard jelly if you like. I will bypass this specious argument, and not argue with you about gods that are ordinary items. I don't know if you think you are being funny by stating someone worships a phallic device or not, but I am not amused.
I will agree with you, if you want to call a god a rock, that is fine as your opinion. I will call it a rock. Sorry.

What is a god?

But let us return to your pregnant "if," and its counter, you are saying IF God/gods exist, then they exist.

No, I said if specific gods that exist are presented as possessing certain characteristics it doesn't imply that all gods share in those specific characteristics. Exactly what I said was: "God is a simple word that means anyone or anything venerated. If a god is supposed to be the most profound thing in the cosmos, fine, but if it's supposed to be a phallic symbol, that is a representation of the male sex organ, worshiped for thousands of years in fertility religions, prayed to, sacrificed children to, adopted by apostate Christianity then it is a god."

I am saying SINCE gods/God can not be distinguished from the imaginary, they do not exist - outside the imagination.

Which you isn't accurate and you can't substantiate. Just because I can point to gods that do, in fact, exist or have, in fact, existed, doesn't mean all gods exist. I can name mortal men that are products of the imagination but that doesn't mean all men don't exist. The word god is used like a title, like King. Just because men are kings doesn't mean all men are kings, or just because a young boy can be made king doesn't mean all kings have to be young boys.

A god is anything or anyone that is venerated. The Hebrew root word meaning, simply, "mighty."

Okay, how is a simple stick or stone mighty? Because it is imagined that the stick or stone can, if appeased, bring good fortune, crops, no famine, no floods etc.

BUT

Just because they are only attributed might that is imagined doesn't mean that all gods are products of the imagination.

I am waiting to be shown otherwise.

Really? Why? Why are you waiting to be shown otherwise? I've been showing you otherwise for two days now, how long you gonna' wait?

And to repeat, I do not find you or anyone else worshiping a phallic symbol to be evidence of a god.

Why not? Doesn't it fit your description of a god?

My wrong what?

Explanation. Sorry. Typographical error. Your explanation is wrong.

You're wrong. SMH.

No. I can't say you're wrong. It's against the rules. Your explanation is wrong.

Excellent point, and if God spoke to the multitudes, you would have one.
Instead he only spoke to madman.

In all, as you say, cultures? Just one madman?

Yeah. Anything imagined is a god because you need to believe that gods are only imagined. Ideological possession.

A personal opinion about me is not acceptable. I don't need to believe it - there is no evidence to counter it. Or you would have presented some.

Wouldn't you?

I have. You reject them based entirely on your own definition. Your definition is wrong.

Is it an opinion or an observation? Opinion is allowed just not authoritative. What other explanation is there?

No. Weak and inaccurate.

Another unfounded and unsubstantiated claim.

[Laughs]

[DavidLeon]

[Replying to DavidLeon in post #55]

The question is, what is a god?

A god is an imaginary being (or an object with imaginary properties, to split hairs) venerated by a culture.

Please show otherwise.

No, you show why you think a god is only possibly an imaginary being (or an object with imaginary properties, to split hairs) venerated by a culture.

How do you draw that conclusion?

[Willum]

[Replying to DavidLeon in post #58]

Because there is no evidence, proof, quantification or anything anyone has been able to show that would distinguish God, gods or objects of that description as being distinguishable from imaginary, myth, fairytale or psychological phenomenon.

Do you know of anything?

[Clownboat]

[Replying to DavidLeon in post #55]

The question is, what is a god?

A god is an imaginary being (or an object with imaginary properties, to split hairs) venerated by a culture.

Please show otherwise.

No, you show why you think a god is only possibly an imaginary being (or an object with imaginary properties, to split hairs) venerated by a culture.

How do you draw that conclusion?

This has been presented to you numerous times now:
https://www.google.com/search?q=god+def ... e&ie=UTF-8
God
noun
1.
(in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
2.
(in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.

I found this definition online. Do you find it wanting?
Is there a need to include verbage so that anything can be considered a god? If so, please make your case as to why more needs to be included.
I could see 'likening' something to a god, like money, but if we are being honest, money doesn't create universes, nor is it a source of moral authority or is it a supreme being. Nor is it an actual god concept, unlike you know what, all the other actual god concepts available to us.

You claim that there is confusion about the word god, but if we are being truthful here, you are the common denominator. Society does not struggle with this word like you would like them to. Therefore my presented motive for the desire to obfuscate the word does seem spot on.

Post 53: "When the word god has no meaning (or more accurately can mean just about anything) they can feel that their belief in said god is protected from scrutiny, here specifically the scrutiny that all god concepts we know of today cannot be shown to be anything more than the imagination of humans."