The story of Lot tells us that a couple of angels visited Lot and that a gay mob demanded they be brought out so they could have their way with them. Lot then did the absolutely atrocious act of offering up his daughters to them to protect the angels.
The question I have about this story and I can never get a straight answer is why would angels need to be protected anyway? Angels are spiritual beings and even if they somehow manifested in human bodies I still don't see what harm could possibly befall them.
So why did these angels need to be protected from the angry gay mob?
Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
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Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #1Society and its morals evolve and will continue to evolve. The bible however remains the same and just requires more and more apologetics and claims of "metaphors" and "symbolism" to justify it.
Prayer is like rubbing an old bottle and hoping that a genie will pop out and grant you three wishes.
There is much about this world that is mind boggling and impressive, but I see no need whatsoever to put it down to magical super powered beings.
Check out my website: Recker's World
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #11Seriously? This is a debate question? It's pretty obvious in the story the angels as visiting incognito, and that Lot thought they were normal humans.OnceConvinced wrote: The story of Lot tells us that a couple of angels visited Lot and that a gay mob demanded they be brought out so they could have their way with them...
The question I have about this story and I can never get a straight answer is why would angels need to be protected anyway? Angels are spiritual beings and even if they somehow manifested in human bodies I still don't see what harm could possibly befall them.
So why did these angels need to be protected from the angry gay mob?
The response to the refugee crisis has been troubling, exposing... just how impoverished our moral and political discourse actually is. For the difficult tasks of patient deliberation and discriminating political wisdom, a cult of sentimental humanitarianism--Neoliberalism's good cop to its bad cop of foreign military interventionism--substitutes the self-congratulatory ease of kneejerk emotional judgments, assuming that the 'right'...is immediately apparent from some instinctive apprehension of the 'good'. -AR
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Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #12[Replying to post 10 by Paprika]
If he thought they were normal humans, (of divine beauty, suspiciously) why didn't he let them be; it all becomes a little paradoxical, unless, someone, including the author perhaps, knew the ending.
If he thought they were normal humans, (of divine beauty, suspiciously) why didn't he let them be; it all becomes a little paradoxical, unless, someone, including the author perhaps, knew the ending.
I will never understand how someone who claims to know the ultimate truth, of God, believes they deserve respect, when they cannot distinguish it from a fairy-tale.
You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.
To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight
You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.
To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #13Hospitality.Willum wrote: [Replying to post 10 by Paprika]
If he thought they were normal humans, (of divine beauty, suspiciously) why didn't he let them be
The two angels came to Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gate of Sodom. When Lot saw them, he rose to meet them and bowed himself with his face to the earth and said, “My lords, please turn aside to your servant's house and spend the night and wash your feet. Then you may rise up early and go on your way.� They said, “No; we will spend the night in the town square.� But he pressed them strongly; so they turned aside to him and entered his house. And he made them a feast and baked unleavened bread, and they ate.
The response to the refugee crisis has been troubling, exposing... just how impoverished our moral and political discourse actually is. For the difficult tasks of patient deliberation and discriminating political wisdom, a cult of sentimental humanitarianism--Neoliberalism's good cop to its bad cop of foreign military interventionism--substitutes the self-congratulatory ease of kneejerk emotional judgments, assuming that the 'right'...is immediately apparent from some instinctive apprehension of the 'good'. -AR
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #14How is telling a mob to rape your daughters hospitality? Would you be this hospitable if a guest stayed at your place? If a mob showed up, would you ask them to rather rape your children than your guests?Paprika wrote:Hospitality.Willum wrote: [Replying to post 10 by Paprika]
If he thought they were normal humans, (of divine beauty, suspiciously) why didn't he let them be
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #15Defending one's guests is hospitality. Again, a little homework will dispel ignorance:Justin108 wrote:How is telling a mob to rape your daughters hospitality?Paprika wrote:Hospitality.Willum wrote: [Replying to post 10 by Paprika]
If he thought they were normal humans, (of divine beauty, suspiciously) why didn't he let them be
"In response to the mob, Lot acts like a virtuous host: he steps outside the house and places himself between the visitors and the mob (19:6). Lot's second desperate attempt to safeguard his strangers, offering his two virgin daughters to the Sodomites for sexual pleasure, is morally repugnant but further demonstrates Lot's resolve to fulfill the hospitality protocols at any cost (19:6-8). In fact, he begs the men to cease from their wickedness since the strangers "have come under the shelter of my roof"
The response to the refugee crisis has been troubling, exposing... just how impoverished our moral and political discourse actually is. For the difficult tasks of patient deliberation and discriminating political wisdom, a cult of sentimental humanitarianism--Neoliberalism's good cop to its bad cop of foreign military interventionism--substitutes the self-congratulatory ease of kneejerk emotional judgments, assuming that the 'right'...is immediately apparent from some instinctive apprehension of the 'good'. -AR
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Post #16
But they might have turned straight people from other cities into homosexuals! You know what these gays are like. Always trying to trick people into becoming like them.Zzyzx wrote: .
If inhabitants were exclusively homosexual a wise god would realize that it need not do anything to depopulate a city -- simply wait one generation.
Society and its morals evolve and will continue to evolve. The bible however remains the same and just requires more and more apologetics and claims of "metaphors" and "symbolism" to justify it.
Prayer is like rubbing an old bottle and hoping that a genie will pop out and grant you three wishes.
There is much about this world that is mind boggling and impressive, but I see no need whatsoever to put it down to magical super powered beings.
Check out my website: Recker's World
- OnceConvinced
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Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #17Judging by Lot's lack of shock and amazement at what the angels did to the mob, I'd say there is reason to believe he DID know they were angels.Paprika wrote:Seriously? This is a debate question? It's pretty obvious in the story the angels as visiting incognito, and that Lot thought they were normal humans.OnceConvinced wrote: The story of Lot tells us that a couple of angels visited Lot and that a gay mob demanded they be brought out so they could have their way with them...
The question I have about this story and I can never get a straight answer is why would angels need to be protected anyway? Angels are spiritual beings and even if they somehow manifested in human bodies I still don't see what harm could possibly befall them.
So why did these angels need to be protected from the angry gay mob?
But looking at the story again I would say that it is highly possible he just saw them as humans. However the tale does not tell us that for certain.
Society and its morals evolve and will continue to evolve. The bible however remains the same and just requires more and more apologetics and claims of "metaphors" and "symbolism" to justify it.
Prayer is like rubbing an old bottle and hoping that a genie will pop out and grant you three wishes.
There is much about this world that is mind boggling and impressive, but I see no need whatsoever to put it down to magical super powered beings.
Check out my website: Recker's World
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #18And how do you arrive at this reading? Is it going to be something along the lines of 'absence of evidence is the evidence of absence'?OnceConvinced wrote:
Judging by Lot's lack of shock and amazement at what the angels did to the mob
The response to the refugee crisis has been troubling, exposing... just how impoverished our moral and political discourse actually is. For the difficult tasks of patient deliberation and discriminating political wisdom, a cult of sentimental humanitarianism--Neoliberalism's good cop to its bad cop of foreign military interventionism--substitutes the self-congratulatory ease of kneejerk emotional judgments, assuming that the 'right'...is immediately apparent from some instinctive apprehension of the 'good'. -AR
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #19Why does he value hospitality over his responsibility to protect his own family?Paprika wrote: Defending one's guests is hospitality. Again, a little homework will dispel ignorance:
"In response to the mob, Lot acts like a virtuous host: he steps outside the house and places himself between the visitors and the mob (19:6). Lot's second desperate attempt to safeguard his strangers, offering his two virgin daughters to the Sodomites for sexual pleasure, is morally repugnant but further demonstrates Lot's resolve to fulfill the hospitality protocols at any cost (19:6-8). In fact, he begs the men to cease from their wickedness since the strangers "have come under the shelter of my roof"
Re: Why would angels need protecting from a raging mob?
Post #20That is a great question. Remind me to ask that on the Last Day.Justin108 wrote:
Why does he value hospitality over his responsibility to protect his own family?
The response to the refugee crisis has been troubling, exposing... just how impoverished our moral and political discourse actually is. For the difficult tasks of patient deliberation and discriminating political wisdom, a cult of sentimental humanitarianism--Neoliberalism's good cop to its bad cop of foreign military interventionism--substitutes the self-congratulatory ease of kneejerk emotional judgments, assuming that the 'right'...is immediately apparent from some instinctive apprehension of the 'good'. -AR