Should Paul curse people?

[marco]

Here is Paul speaking with menace:

Galatians 1: 8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse! 9 As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God's curse! 10 Am I now trying to win the approval of human beings, or of God.


It seems to me he's obviously trying to win over people, not God, though that might be a secondary motive.

Does Paul have the right to call down curses on people who don't go along with his version of things?

Paul later informs his listeners that he got his message from Jesus. Is his word sufficient? And why?

[showme]

Here is Paul speaking with menace:

Galatians 1: 8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse! 9 As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God's curse! 10 Am I now trying to win the approval of human beings, or of God.


It seems to me he's obviously trying to win over people, not God, though that might be a secondary motive.

Does Paul have the right to call down curses on people who don't go along with his version of things?

Paul later informs his listeners that he got his message from Jesus. Is his word sufficient? And why?[/quote]

If someone self witnesses, that witness is "not true" (John 5:31) & (Dt 19:15) And while the false prophet Paul curses the angels, the angels will apparently at the "end of the age", "gather" him and his followers up, and toss them into the "furnace of fire" (Matthew 13:39-41).

[Tcg]

[Replying to post 1 by marco]

It always confuses me when folks are surprised when a follower of Jesus curses others. In spite of Jesus' admonition to love your enemies, he didn't hesitate to curse the Pharisees with the seven woes of Matthew 23.

In one he asks how they will escape hell. His implication of course is that they won't.

I suppose we could whitewash that by claiming that it is loving to send bad people to hell. I'm not sure how that makes sense given that it isn't my argument, but I've seen it made.

This is child's play however compared to Revelation. Jesus' first action after his post resurrection temporary retirement, is to start a full scale war against the nations, you know, his enemies.

I suppose if we had enough White-Out, we could modify the gospels into a story that reveals a loving Jesus. Once we get to Revelation, it'd be faster to simply use a paper cutter and slice that entire book out.

I don't have the motivation needed to alter the complete Jesus story to turn him into a lover of enemies. I've read the whole thing and know that he isn't. Paul's words shouldn't surprise in light of this fact. A chip off the old block as they say.

[marco]

No, Paul shouldn't be cursing people who disagree with him ESPECIALLY when he himself preached a "different Gospel" than did Jesus.

Paul is a pillar of Christianity. How many pillars can fell before the entire system collapses? I agree that placing a curse on others is wrong. His "anathema sit", the curse of excommunication became a useful weapon for the Church, and such dark thinking may have heralded the Inquisition.

Paul may well have been the protypical heretic.

One has to be in - in order to go out. Was he ever in? Paul's aim was to introduce Pauline ritual. He may have been the prototypical inquisitor, of course.

[marco]

Whoever it was who wrote the delightful piece quoted, has all the charismatic Christian charm of "God Hates Fags" placard wavers.

We're never sure when Paul is Paul or an impersonator. The curses issued here are very like the bitterest brand of Christianity. It is confusing that love is his word - his love he gives us, and this in the currency of men is debased into hatred. It is strange how the written diametrically opposes what we see in practice. Jesus said LOVE people and Christians burned people. Islam is a religion of peace. Where?

[marco]

Christians - including Paul - should not be cursing anyone. Christians should be listening to Christ.

Hello Tam, nice to hear from you. I agree that Paul should not invite others to hate or curse their neighbours. It opposes the principal message Christ gave.


The problem many would have is that when we pick and choose Bible writers we are lost. Christ comes through to us via the writing of scribes. I am not sure we can attempt to go directly to Christ and forget the very agents who brought him to us. Without them Christ is not even a name. All we can do is have our favourite authors, And Paul would not be among them. Go well.

[marco]

He is saying that the Judaizers (the so-called Jerusalem pillars and their supporters who he is having bitter disagreements with) should not just cut off their foreskins but go the whole way and castrate themselves! There's a nice Christian response for you.

Yes, once love gets going there's no stopping it. He may be illustrating what Jesus warned against: false prophets. If the fruit are clearly bad, as here, you know the tree is bad. But as Shakespeare tells us in the Merchant of Venice - the Devil can cite Scripture for his purpose, so it is hard to tell who the false prophets are: Joseph Smith, John Nelson Darby, George Fox, Charles Taze Russell... or dozens of well-meaning others. They all quote Scripture for their purpose.

[William]

[Replying to post 1 by marco]

Galatians 1:
8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse! 9 As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let them be under God's curse! 10 Am I now trying to win the approval of human beings, or of God.

Likely the question asked in 10, is rhetorical? Preaches often ask such tactic over their followers, not for the purpose of extracting an answer, but to reinforce the idea that the preacher is correct.

Apparently 'an angel from heaven' 'preached a gospel' to Paul on his way to kill more Jesus freaks only the 'angel' claimed to be Jesus himself, so 'no need to question' applies. A story to gain the listening ear and careless heart of the gullible...

Not sure what 'being under God's curse' means...except obviously in context is has to mean 'if you don't believe what I tell you, don't blame me when the proverbial hits the fan' - a fear-tactic to encourage the follower not to question the followed.

"Do not listen to the competition!"

Needless to say, Paul won the day and the rest is a dark history - perhaps a curse even, wrought not from any God at all, but just through the fearful foolishness of followers of the fashionable.

Using Paul's own metaphor, his teaching is the mothers milk and the meat is to be obtained elsewhere.

[showme]

Christians - including Paul - should not be cursing anyone. Christians should be listening to Christ.

Hello Tam, nice to hear from you. I agree that Paul should not invite others to hate or curse their neighbours. It opposes the principal message Christ gave.


The problem many would have is that when we pick and choose Bible writers we are lost. Christ comes through to us via the writing of scribes. I am not sure we can attempt to go directly to Christ and forget the very agents who brought him to us. Without them Christ is not even a name. All we can do is have our favourite authors, And Paul would not be among them. Go well.

The Scripture writers Yeshua chose, were those of the OT. (John 10:35) Yeshua came to be a light to opening the meaning of the O.T. Scripture. The NT is a product of Rome, the beast, and her Roman church, a harlot daughter of Babylon.

[Overcomer]

Paul is pointing out that, unless people accept the gospel of Jesus Christ, they will end up under God's curse. Given that people's salvation is at stake, he doesn't mince words. If they turn away from God's gift of eternal life, they will be lost.

The people in Galatia who were perverting the gospel were claiming to be Christians. They represent the worst and most dangerous kind of deceiver as they mix just a bit of truth with the lies to make what they're saying look plausible. This is as true today as it was back then.

[marco]

The Scripture writers Yeshua chose, were those of the OT. (John 10:35) Yeshua came to be a light to opening the meaning of the O.T. Scripture. The NT is a product of Rome, the beast, and her Roman church, a harlot daughter of Babylon.

The NT gives us the terms beast and harlot of Babylon, so you are both applauding and condemning.

Paul is pointing out that, unless people accept the gospel of Jesus Christ, they will end up under God's curse. Given that people's salvation is at stake, he doesn't mince words. If they turn away from God's gift of eternal life, they will be lost.

Well if he intended to do and say this he failed. Instead he cursed those who opposed what he proposed. Hell is another country.

The people in Galatia who were perverting the gospel were claiming to be Christians. They represent the worst and most dangerous kind of deceiver as they mix just a bit of truth with the lies to make what they're saying look plausible. This is as true today as it was back then.

I think the mix of truth and lie is essentially the stuff of all faiths, though the lies may not be deliberate. There are elements of truth in each of the Christian divisions, with none holding perfection. I am not aware that Galatians had an unparalleled appetite for deceit. Paul, a human, is not above deceit himself - especially self-deceit. His cursing people who did not echo his own words is quite certainly wrong.