One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God?

[Zzyzx]

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One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God?

Thanks to Brunumb for mentioning 'compelling reason to believe' in a current thread.

Do Christians have compelling reason to believe the God tales? There MUST be something more than 'This book says so', or 'My preacher says so', or 'I want to go to heaven after I die', or 'Everyone I know believes' – isn't there?

I venture a guess that there is not a compelling reason to be offered for believing in the Bible God. Prove me wrong – state the reason. (Kindly differentiate between a compelling reason and a personal preference or wishful thinking).

[Realworldjack]

[Replying to post 1 by Zzyzx]

You see, I think this is the problem. We have those on both sides of the equation, who seem to be under the impression that it is all so simple, with easy answers, and therefore, they can ask questions like, "One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God", as if it would be that simple?

This seems to fail to take into consideration that there is indeed reasons (plural) to believe, because we have facts, and evidence in support of the claims, otherwise there would be nothing to debate. Moreover, this sort of question also seems to fail to take into consideration that this debate has been raging for almost 2000 years now, with neither side being able to demonstrate their case. It would also be a fact that, there are very well educated, and intelligent folks on both sides of the equation.

Of course, there are many folks who were at one time a Christian, who have become convinced Christianity is false, but it would also be a fact that there have been many well educated, and intelligent folk, who were at one time very much opposed to Christianity, some of who were out to demonstrate Christianity to be false, who became convinced Christianity would indeed be true, through the investigation of the facts, and evidence in order to demonstrate it to be false.

Now, I do not mention any of these things, in order to demonstrate the case one way, or the other, and it is also not any sort of reason to believe. Rather, it should surely demonstrate that one will not be able to give "One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God" since it is far more complex than this.

In other words, this sort of question seems to demonstrate one who is under the impression that it would be all so simple, when the fact of the matter would be, this very one has devoted a good many years of their life attempting to demonstrate there would be no good reasons to believe these claims, and has in all these years, failed to demonstrate the case.

[Thomas123]

One compelling reason?

Yahweh worship works!

It has been used with sucess!

It commands proven long term loyalty.

It is well developed ( Yahweh Worship)

It allows for personal development

It is needed today.

Are any of these considered compelling or do you want to declare them personal?

Are you looking for" generally compelling"?

If so, then just do a statistical, head count, imho

From Opening Post:... venture a guess that there is not a compelling reason to be offered for believing in the Bible God .usual problem with a shared God, put me down for this. OT and Gospels only and only after editing.

[marco]

Now, I do not mention any of these things, in order to demonstrate the case one way, or the other, and it is also not any sort of reason to believe. Rather, it should surely demonstrate that one will not be able to give "One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God" since it is far more complex than this.

In other words, this sort of question seems to demonstrate one who is under the impression that it would be all so simple, when the fact of the matter would be, this very one has devoted a good many years of their life attempting to demonstrate there would be no good reasons to believe these claims, and has in all these years, failed to demonstrate the case.

So why avoid complexity? Is it hard to put into words the complex reasons for accepting Yahweh?

The case against isn't hard to make. Yahweh seems the obvious creation of warrior men, keen to have a brute as their god. That this savage requires a man to murder his son is evidence enough for rejecting him. That he decides a family should be spared from his rage and then kills the wife for her natural curiosity is another good reason for rejection. Then he murders schoolboys who are laughing at some self-appointed prophet. And he issues instructions that suckling babies be slaughtered. No need to go on. Yahweh is easily dismissed.

The question is: How on earth can anyone accept him? Can there be any reason, compelling or not? Of course we can hide behind the answer: "It is awfully hard to explain." One can well understand that. For hard read impossible.

[marco]

One compelling reason?

Yahweh worship works!

It has been used with sucess!

It commands proven long term loyalty.

May I differ? Yahweh worship tells parents that a gay son is a sinful son. A hard consequence of this is that some sinful sons have committed suicide, due to parental rejection, for the parents "loved" Yahweh more than their son.

Some of the decrees, when acted on, have been a success in getting people murdered. "Suffer not a witch to live."

Long term loyalty is the kind of thing that caused Abraham to journey with his boy to kill him. If that is what loyalty does, then Yahweh is no success story.

Yahweh seems to work best when we ignore what has been decreed. Instead of murdering infants of enemies, we respect them.

[William]

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One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God?

Thanks to Brunumb for mentioning 'compelling reason to believe' in a current thread.

Do Christians have compelling reason to believe the God tales? There MUST be something more than 'This book says so', or 'My preacher says so', or 'I want to go to heaven after I die', or 'Everyone I know believes' – isn't there?

I venture a guess that there is not a compelling reason to be offered for believing in the Bible God. Prove me wrong – state the reason. (Kindly differentiate between a compelling reason and a personal preference or wishful thinking).

To first address your bracketed request;

A 'compelling reason' will be different for me than for you or someone else. In that, we all have only our self in which to reflect the world off of, and my compelling reason - primarily a recognition that we exist within a creation - does not necessarily mean it will be of interest to others...something I have observed often enough.

This is because what constitutes 'compelling' is different for each individual.

Therefore, the request to provide compelling reason is something of an erroneous one.

I think I am being reasonable in my reasoning here.

[Charles]

I venture a guess that there is not a compelling reason to be offered for believing in the Bible God. Prove me wrong – state the reason. (Kindly differentiate between a compelling reason and a personal preference or wishful thinking).

A compelling reason is one that would make a believer out of anyone who saw it such as if we saw HIM create the physical universe ex nihilo before us or introduced HIMself to us unmistakably.

The problem is not that HE can't give (hasn't given) anyone a compelling reason to believe in HIS existence but that those who have committed to a rejection of HIS deity can always rationalize and suppress their memory of the truth because they love sin more as described in Rom 1.

[Zzyzx]

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A 'compelling reason' will be different for me than for you or someone else.

NO – really? You are asked to present your compelling reason – not someone else's.

Not everyone will regard your reason as compelling (as you may be aware – and concerned). In fact, some may regard the reason you present to be far LESS than compelling (as you are likely aware).

When asked why did you cross the street, one can avoid answering the question by saying,“I won't tell you because you will laugh�

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In that, we all have only our self in which to reflect the world off of, and my compelling reason - primarily a recognition that we exist within a creation - does not necessarily mean it will be of interest to others...something I have observed often enough.

Here in debate we are (supposedly) attempting to communicate with others – hopefully with some degree of sincerity and integrity.

This is because what constitutes 'compelling' is different for each individual.

Many of us disagree regarding various topics. Is that reason to avoid the subject?

Shall we communicate ONLY with those with whom we know in advance will agree with us? Perhaps Holy Huddle would be a more comfortable environment?

Therefore, the request to provide compelling reason is something of an erroneous one.

I might duck the question if I realized that my reasons were far from compelling – and were likely to be considered silly.

“I crossed the street because an invisible pink elephant was chasing me� might be an example. I would know (unless completely delusional) that readers would likely regard my reason as indicating some mental problems on my part (and/or a lack of sincerity).

I think I am being reasonable in my reasoning here.

Perhaps that is as reasonable as it gets when one does not wish to answer a question.

[Realworldjack]

Now, I do not mention any of these things, in order to demonstrate the case one way, or the other, and it is also not any sort of reason to believe. Rather, it should surely demonstrate that one will not be able to give "One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God" since it is far more complex than this.

In other words, this sort of question seems to demonstrate one who is under the impression that it would be all so simple, when the fact of the matter would be, this very one has devoted a good many years of their life attempting to demonstrate there would be no good reasons to believe these claims, and has in all these years, failed to demonstrate the case.

So why avoid complexity? Is it hard to put into words the complex reasons for accepting Yahweh?

The case against isn't hard to make. Yahweh seems the obvious creation of warrior men, keen to have a brute as their god. That this savage requires a man to murder his son is evidence enough for rejecting him. That he decides a family should be spared from his rage and then kills the wife for her natural curiosity is another good reason for rejection. Then he murders schoolboys who are laughing at some self-appointed prophet. And he issues instructions that suckling babies be slaughtered. No need to go on. Yahweh is easily dismissed.

The question is: How on earth can anyone accept him? Can there be any reason, compelling or not? Of course we can hide behind the answer: "It is awfully hard to explain." One can well understand that. For hard read impossible.

And above, is a perfect example of one who is under the impression that it is all so simple. In other words, one can simply throw a few "sound bites" out there, and come to some sort of opinion, which has not been demonstrated in the least, accept in the mind of the one who holds the opinion.

As I have already stated, I have no problem with folks such as yourself, who want to stop right there, and go on to dismiss the claims as being false. The problem comes in, when these very same folks want to insist that I have no reason to believe the claims, when they have not in any way whatsoever demonstrated this to be the case, and I can assure you that throwing out a few little "sound bites" as above, does not demonstrate the case.

But again, here is the fact of the matter. We have facts, and evidence surrounding the claims in the NT. Otherwise, there would be nothing here to debate. Therefore, there is a reason we have these facts, and evidence. Some look at these facts, and evidence, and come to the opinion the claims would be false, while others look at these same exact facts, and evidence, and come to the opinion the claims would be true.

But again, I have no problem with those who simply want to go with a few sound bites, and dismiss the claims as being false based on such things. However, since it is a fact that there are reasons we have these facts, and evidence surrounding these claims, there are others of us who would like to go through all that would have to be involved in order for the claims to be false, as opposed to what all would have to be involved in order for the claims to be true, and I will assure you that we do not have the time, or the space to work through all these issues in a single post.

This certainly demonstrates the difference between those who do not mind doing the work of actually taking the time to think through all these things, as opposed to those who are under the impression that there are easy answers, and it does not take a whole lot of thought to come to an opinion.

One thing is certain though, no matter if one holds the opinion the claims in the NT would be true, or false, neither side has been able to demonstrate their case. Some of us understand this, and accept it, while there seem to be others who are under the impression that their opinion, is the better opinion, which would still simply be an opinion, or they are under the impression that their opinion, would somehow equal fact.

[Elijah John]

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One compelling reason to believe in the Christian God?

Thanks to Brunumb for mentioning 'compelling reason to believe' in a current thread.

Do Christians have compelling reason to believe the God tales? There MUST be something more than 'This book says so', or 'My preacher says so', or 'I want to go to heaven after I die', or 'Everyone I know believes' – isn't there?

I venture a guess that there is not a compelling reason to be offered for believing in the Bible God. Prove me wrong – state the reason. (Kindly differentiate between a compelling reason and a personal preference or wishful thinking).

Experience. We've tasted, and seen that YHVH is indeed, good. How can one argue with that?

Oh taste and see that Yahweh is good.
Blessed is the man who takes refuge in him.

Psalm 34.8

Many of us have found this verse to be true. Sometimes there is no way to prove it other than to try it.