Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

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Zzyzx
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Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #1

Post by Zzyzx »

Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

It is not uncommon in these threads for Christians to claim they receive (something) from a supernatural 'spirit' (supposedly a part of 'god').
The Church functions by the Holy Spirit in the individual lives of believers. Every believer has been given gifts from the Holy Spirit. It is through these gifts that the Church functions. See (1 Cor. 12-14) (Rom. 12:1-16) and (Eph. 4:4-16).

So, the believers, Christians, have the Spirit of God and the Word of God to determine and measure.
What 'gifts', exactly, have Christians received from the 'spirit'?


Christians seem to be about average in personal characteristics and abilities. If they have been 'helped' or 'benefited' in some way, what were / are they without the 'gifts' – a basket case?

If someone gets help to come up to average, they must have been well below average to start with.

It appears as though many Muslims are more committed to their religion, their rituals, their 'god' than Christians. Does this indicate that the 'holy spirit' gives Muslims more 'gifts' than Christians?
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ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #11

Post by Clownboat »

Christians are just as human as the next person.
Not according to the claim that I was addressing.
"I think Holy Spirit has led me to the truth. And I thank God for that. Other gifts are wisdom, knowledge, ability to heal and do miracles, prophecy, speaking foreign languages."
If there was no Holy Spirit, then you were never Christian.
You and I don't know if there is or was a Holy Spirit, but I assure you, I was a Christian.
I realize it sounds so 'authoritative' to say, 'former Christian'.

How it sounds to you is irrelevant. That I speak the truth is what is important.
But it is just more bs.
What a great way of not addressing my points.

If 1213's words are true, and there is a Holy Spirit, you clearly don't have access to it otherwise I believe it would have helped you with your reply.
As it stands, nah nah nah boo boo is what your reply reads like. Not very convincing if we are being honest.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU

It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco

If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #12

Post by Clownboat »

Quantrill wrote:You may speak in tongues. But it is not from the Holy Spirit.
My ability to speak in tongues comes from the same place anyone else's does. There is nothing special with my ability, nor anyone elses as far as I can tell.
So from what spirit do you get this supernatural gift?
Do you have evidence for spirits? Seems like an odd explination for things taking place in the real world.
I'm going to guess you believe in all sorts of unevidenced beings. That is your bed though and you need to sleep in it, not me. I would prefer to deal with what we know. Your mileage obviously varies.

You are a great example of how humans throughout time invented god concepts. It is unfortunate and telling IMO that none can be shown to be anything more than human imagination like I propose you are doing when you imagine spirits. People that appeal to the unknown are needed though in order to keep the local shaman employed.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU

It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco

If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #13

Post by Quantrill »

Clownboat wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:20 pm
Quantrill wrote:You may speak in tongues. But it is not from the Holy Spirit.
My ability to speak in tongues comes from the same place anyone else's does. There is nothing special with my ability, nor anyone elses as far as I can tell.
So from what spirit do you get this supernatural gift?
Do you have evidence for spirits? Seems like an odd explination for things taking place in the real world.
I'm going to guess you believe in all sorts of unevidenced beings. That is your bed though and you need to sleep in it, not me. I would prefer to deal with what we know. Your mileage obviously varies.

You are a great example of how humans throughout time invented god concepts. It is unfortunate and telling IMO that none can be shown to be anything more than human imagination like I propose you are doing when you imagine spirits. People that appeal to the unknown are needed though in order to keep the local shaman employed.
The Christians ability comes from the Holy Spirit. You are not Christian, by your own words. So, where does this ability come from?

Whatever you are calling the gift of tongues is not from God. That is by your own words. The Christians is from God.

I don't appeal to the unknown. I appeal to the known as revealed in the Bible.

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #14

Post by Quantrill »

Clownboat wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:11 pm
Not according to the claim that I was addressing.

You and I don't know if there is or was a Holy Spirit, but I assure you, I was a Christian.

How it sounds to you is irrelevant. That I speak the truth is what is important.

What a great way of not addressing my points.

If 1213's words are true, and there is a Holy Spirit, you clearly don't have access to it otherwise I believe it would have helped you with your reply.
As it stands, nah nah nah boo boo is what your reply reads like. Not very convincing if we are being honest.
That Christians have the Holy Spirit, doesn't make them not human.

If you never had the Holy Spirit, you were not Christian. (Rom. 8:9) "But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."

That is the problem...you don't speak the truth. As I just showed.

Quite fitting I believe.

Quantrill

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #15

Post by bluegreenearth »

Quantrill wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:45 pmThat Christians have the Holy Spirit, doesn't make them not human.

If you never had the Holy Spirit, you were not Christian. (Rom. 8:9) "But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."

That is the problem...you don't speak the truth. As I just showed.

Quite fitting I believe.

Quantrill
I think it is an interesting and remarkable coincidence that only the Christians from one particular denomination of Christianity consistently manage to have their interpretation of the scriptures confirmed as TRUE by the Holy Spirit while the remaining heretical Christians from the other denominations consistently manage to mistakenly believe the Holy Spirit has confirmed their equally plausible but ultimately incorrect interpretations. I wonder why you never hear about the Holy Spirit confirming a portion of one Christian denomination's Biblical interpretation and confirming a different portion of another Christian denomination's Biblical interpretation given the improbability of any one Christian denomination never making a mistake in at least some portion of their interpretation? I wonder how an objective and unbiased outsider could distinguish between the Christians who actually had the Holy Spirit guide them to a TRUE interpretation of the scriptures and the Christians who mistakenly believe the Holy Spirit has guided them to a TRUE interpretation? It would certainly help if the Holy Spirit could impart that TRUE knowledge to everyone and not just the Christians from one particular denomination of Christianity. Do you have any insight here or is that privileged information?

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #16

Post by otseng »

Quantrill wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:45 pm That is the problem...you don't speak the truth.
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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #17

Post by Quantrill »

bluegreenearth wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 3:39 pm
Quantrill wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:45 pmThat Christians have the Holy Spirit, doesn't make them not human.

If you never had the Holy Spirit, you were not Christian. (Rom. 8:9) "But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."

That is the problem...you don't speak the truth. As I just showed.

Quite fitting I believe.

Quantrill
I think it is an interesting and remarkable coincidence that only the Christians from one particular denomination of Christianity consistently manage to have their interpretation of the scriptures confirmed as TRUE by the Holy Spirit while the remaining heretical Christians from the other denominations consistently manage to mistakenly believe the Holy Spirit has confirmed their equally plausible but ultimately incorrect interpretations. I wonder why you never hear about the Holy Spirit confirming a portion of one Christian denomination's Biblical interpretation and confirming a different portion of another Christian denomination's Biblical interpretation given the improbability of any one Christian denomination never making a mistake in at least some portion of their interpretation? I wonder how an objective and unbiased outsider could distinguish between the Christians who actually had the Holy Spirit guide them to a TRUE interpretation of the scriptures and the Christians who mistakenly believe the Holy Spirit has guided them to a TRUE interpretation? It would certainly help if the Holy Spirit could impart that TRUE knowledge to everyone and not just the Christians from one particular denomination of Christianity. Do you have any insight here or is that privileged information?
Nice speech. Yet you ignore (Rom. 8:9).

You said you speak in tongues now and you are not Christian. That means it is not by the Holy Spirit that you speak in tongues. So by what spirit do you speak in tongues?

And if you never had the Holy Spirit, then you were never Christian. Again, (Rom. 8:9).

Why are you concerned with knowledge being imparted by God in the Bible, when you are not Christian?

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #18

Post by bluegreenearth »

[Replying to Quantrill in post #17]

You are confusing me with another forum member. I never claimed to speak in tongues.

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #19

Post by Quantrill »

bluegreenearth wrote: Thu Jul 09, 2020 7:31 pm [Replying to Quantrill in post #17]

You are confusing me with another forum member. I never claimed to speak in tongues.
Sorry. My mistake. But my question is still to you. Why are you concerned about who the Holy Spirit imparts knowledge to if you are not Christian?

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Re: Gifts from the 'Holy Spirit'?

Post #20

Post by bluegreenearth »

Quantrill wrote: Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:31 amSorry. My mistake. But my question is still to you. Why are you concerned about who the Holy Spirit imparts knowledge to if you are not Christian?
I'm concerned about finding logical answers to critical thinking questions. Do you not share that concern?

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