Who created the Universe?

[aapatil@cox.net]

God is love. Love is bond which hold together people by seeking the good of others. Love results in harmony and peace. The universe is made of matter in the form of solid, liquid and gases. The tiniest particle of matter is an atom. It is held together by bonds to form visible matter. Without bonds it will not exist. Atom is made of tinier particles called electrons, neutrons, and protons. Electrons are almost massless. Neutron and protons are made of tinier particles which in turn are made of almost massless particle that are held together by bonds. Even life processes exist, because of chemical reaction, which in turn occur because of bonds. Furthermore, the universe, and the heavenly bodies in it are kept in perfect harmony by bonds. The structure of a cell with a nucleus at its center and organelle around it, a planetary system with the sun at its center and planets around it, and the nucleus of an atom with particles around it have similar structural pattern. It is therefore the same bond that brought them into existence which governs everything that exists. If the bond (who is God), let go of matter it will disappear, as it does in the black holes. On the other hand, if God wills it, matter will come into existence. Therefore, newer universes are continually being created. Furthermore, in charged particles there is polarity, of positive and negative; each complementing the other to produce action (in the case of a motor) and light (in the case of a bulb. In living entities there exist polarity in form of sexes- male and female, with one complementing the other to procreate new entities. These facts show us that a single force (the bond of love) is the creator of everything that exist. Therefore, if we are in sync with God by accepting love as our life, we will always exist and be in harmony with each other. On the other hand, if we reject love, our spirit will be dead and in the total darkness of the black holes which are totally devoid of light and in total disarray.
The fullness of God’s love is seen in Jesus, who accepted death on cross to heal those who betrayed and killed him. The message of the cross is: “I will not give up on you my friend irrespective of how badly you treat me or betray me. The more you hurt me, the more I will love you”. I will give up everything, including my own life (on the cross) to bring you back to God. He, therefore, is the bond of love for the whole human race.

[Miles]

Who created the Universe?

Your prejudice, and mistakes concerning science aside, the proper question here should be "What created the universe?" Before assuming a "who," a category of "what," you have to establish the "who" by answering the question of "what." Why? Because my "who," the Flying Spaghetti Monster, may be the true "who."




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[unknown soldier]

[Replying to aapatil@cox.net in post #1]

I don't know what created the universe. It couldn't be a "who" because there were no "whos" 13.6 billions years ago. It could not have been any gods because people made up gods far too late for them to create universes.

[Willum]

Conservation of mass, matter and energy tells us nothing was ever created nor destroyed.
It is neither necessary to have a creator, nor is it possible.
No creation, no creator.

[The Tanager]

The conversation of mass, matter, and energy concerns closed systems. In a closed system mass, matter, and energy remains constant. This tells us nothing of whether the closed system was created or not. It also tells us nothing of whether something could "open" the system up and add mass, matter, and energy to it.

[George1950]

Are supposed to treat this in a scientific or religious way?

[Willum]

[Replying to The Tanager in post #5]

Ummm... so?
I’ll leave it to you to show any reason why the universe isn’t a closed system.
In fact, even if it is not a closed system, I’ll leave it to you to show that matter in any system can be created.
Or destroyed.

You see, open and closed systems apply to observed systems, not fantasies. If a system is artificially kept at a constant temperature using outside energy, it is not closed, but still thermodynamically relevant.

Conservation is STILL not violated, the energy and mass came from someplace not involving magic fairies.

Do go on. We’ll be waiting for your Nobel.

The fact is, based on what we observe, there is no logical reason to propose creation.
EXCEPT so that some magic fairy can be responsible for creation.

That is unacceptable to the logical.

[Hawkins]

Are supposed to treat this in a scientific or religious way?

Again, more often people don't know what they are talking about.

Science relies on its falsifiability to work. Not falsifiable = if it's true science can't tell, if it's false science can't tell either.

The origin of universe is actually a history, not a science. It's never falsifiable as it's not repeatable (to humans). That is, science already admit that it is out of its capability to confirm such a truth. If the big bang theory is a truth, science can't tell. If it's a falsehood, science can't tell either.

A more fundamental way for humans to know a truth is by means of testimony. That is, an info is flowing from someone witnessed the process. The Bible account is from someone who was there, that is, God is there to pass the info to humans (who can't be there). The nature of testimony is, it can convey a truth, it can also convey a lie (nothing in between), you thus need faith to accept or reject.

To sum up,
Science - it already gave up to begin with, because the origin of universe as a piece of unrepeatable history cannot be falsifiable scientifically. It is out of the scope of science to confirm such a truth (or falsehood). Human scientists are only trying their best under limits (say, CERN is always trying to do a small scale big bang to see what can be found).

Testimony - it either conveys a truth from someone witnessed at the point of occurrence, or it carries a lie. You need faith to believe which is which.

What atheists failed to realize is that, everything around you is about testimonies, not science. You don't need to prove anything or evidence anything in your life time to get to all kinds of truths. All you need is a computer or a cell phone with Internet connected. Only the few scientists have the evidence or proof through the using of expensive and rare equipment. You have no access to evidence or proof whatsoever. All you have is faith in their works and testimonies. So don't sound as if you have any proof of anything!

I said it many times, what possibly leads you to hell is your delusion (that you think that you have the evidence of anything but you don't, because you take this reality mistakenly).

[Willum]

[Replying to Hawkins in post #8]

Whereas religion relies on word of mouth that fairytales might be real.
That’s all I got really.

Logical, deductible reasons for things being without a god.
Vs no reasons for any god existing, except to justify a god’s existing.

[Clownboat]

Are supposed to treat this in a scientific or religious way?

Again, more often people don't know what they are talking about.

Science relies on its falsifiability to work. Not falsifiable = if it's true science can't tell, if it's false science can't tell either.

The origin of universe is actually a history, not a science. It's never falsifiable as it's not repeatable (to humans). That is, science already admit that it is out of its capability to confirm such a truth. If the big bang theory is a truth, science can't tell. If it's a falsehood, science can't tell either.

A more fundamental way for humans to know a truth is by means of testimony. That is, an info is flowing from someone witnessed the process. The Bible account is from someone who was there, that is, God is there to pass the info to humans (who can't be there). The nature of testimony is, it can convey a truth, it can also convey a lie (nothing in between), you thus need faith to accept or reject.

To sum up,
Science - it already gave up to begin with, because the origin of universe as a piece of unrepeatable history cannot be falsifiable scientifically. It is out of the scope of science to confirm such a truth (or falsehood). Human scientists are only trying their best under limits (say, CERN is always trying to do a small scale big bang to see what can be found).

Testimony - it either conveys a truth from someone witnessed at the point of occurrence, or it carries a lie. You need faith to believe which is which.

What atheists failed to realize is that, everything around you is about testimonies, not science. You don't need to prove anything or evidence anything in your life time to get to all kinds of truths. All you need is a computer or a cell phone with Internet connected. Only the few scientists have the evidence or proof through the using of expensive and rare equipment. You have no access to evidence or proof whatsoever. All you have is faith in their works and testimonies. So don't sound as if you have any proof of anything!

I said it many times, what possibly leads you to hell is your delusion (that you think that you have the evidence of anything but you don't, because you take this reality mistakenly).

What a great argument!

I now believe and understand that Allah was the One True God that created the universe as I have heard the testimony of Muslims.
Thank you for showing me how to arrive at the Truth.
Perhaps I'll see you at the mosque!