Dangerous Christianity

Argue for and against Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

nobspeople
Prodigy
Posts: 3187
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:32 am
Has thanked: 1510 times
Been thanked: 824 times

Dangerous Christianity

Post #1

Post by nobspeople »

Some churches around the country were defying COVID related safety demands (Grace community church in Sun Valley springs to mind).
Some claim Christianity is not good for the mind of young, impressionable minds
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog ... m-children
Some churches teach blind faith, but less faith in God and more faith in the church leaders (Jonestown, Guyana)
Many churches teach "God needs you to give me your money" (Creflo Dollar is notorious for this) even during times of unemployment, people on fixed incomes and so on.

It must be said, not all Christian churches are guilty of these types of atrocities. And YES, most any religion could fit this bill. But this isn't an 'any religion' section of the forum, now is it?
But the fact remains: a belief system that's as influential as Christianity, can, in the right (wrong?) hands become something to be feared - rallied against even.

Or is it all part of God's great plan, and we should do little to nothing about it?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

nobspeople
Prodigy
Posts: 3187
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:32 am
Has thanked: 1510 times
Been thanked: 824 times

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #11

Post by nobspeople »

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #9]
I am Jehovahs Witneses: I take it (correct me if I am wrong) you are not saying ALL Jehovahs Witneses are "dangerous or toxic" or suggesting our official teachings can thus be described.


I try NEVER to paint with such a large brush. I've said numerous times on this site (and elsewhere), there are bad apples in every bunch (or something very similar to that). That said, I've not met a JW I fully liked or trusted. Does that mean ALL of them I don't like or trust? No. Does that mean I'd trust or like one simply because they're a JW? Absolutely not. Does that mean the next JW I meet, I treat them with trepidation. 250%.

While I find some of the things JWs do in regards to their religion honorable, I think, like any cult (defined as a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object; which can and does include all religions by definition), they can be dangerous. I base that on the few I know personally and what I've read on and about them - typically from others that were once JWs.
CONCLUSION True Christianity can be identified as being as it reflect the teachings and standards as established by Christ and first century Christians.
Agree.
"I like your Christ, but not your Christianity." MAHATMA GANDHI
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 21073
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 790 times
Been thanked: 1114 times
Contact:

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #12

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Difflugia wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 10:19 am
For one thing, the organization officially discourages higher education, denigrating education as merely a path to "high-paying and prestigious jobs" in contrast to the more praiseworthy desire to serve the organization.

We don't serve "the organisation" we serve God. If you view nuns, Buddhist monks and others who dedicate their lives to God as dangerous and toxic so be it; I do not.

I have no problem with those who devote their lives entirely to spiritual pursuits and those who do do well to learn what tolerance means. There are other ways to live but in the pursuit if material things, so excuse me for admiring those that step out of the rat race.



JW
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

User avatar
Difflugia
Prodigy
Posts: 3017
Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:25 am
Location: Michigan
Has thanked: 3247 times
Been thanked: 1997 times

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #13

Post by Difflugia »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 5:20 pmWe don't serve "the organisation" we serve God. If you view nuns, Buddhist monks and others who dedicate their lives to God as dangerous and toxic so be it; I do not.
I suspect you realize that's not what I said. I don't consider those talked out of their educations as dangerous and toxic, but the organization doing the talking. Your accusation that I'm blaming the victim is a straw man.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 5:20 pmI have no problem with those who devote their lives entirely to spiritual pursuits and those who do do well to learn what tolerance means. There are other ways to live but in the pursuit if material things, so excuse me for admiring those that step out of the rat race.
Admiration for those giving up an education as a voluntary sacrifice is fine (even if wrongheaded), but that's not how The Watchtower is presenting it. The Watchtower misuses Paul's words to imply that young people are being un-Christian by exercising a "personal preference" for an education.

Admire that if you want, but it's as toxic as any other emotionally manipulative abuse.

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 21073
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 790 times
Been thanked: 1114 times
Contact:

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #14

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Difflugia wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 5:59 pm
Admiration for those giving up an education as a voluntary sacrifice is fine (even if wrongheaded), but that's not how The Watchtower is presenting it.
Double standard much?

Our lives and communities are centered on God, what's wrong with that? If the Amish do it they are quaint; if Jehovahs Witnesses do the same they are "dangerous". If a nun says she is married to Jesus we make a movie about it, if a Jehovahs Witness said the same we would be hauled off for mental evaluation. If monk shaves his head sits in a loincloth and takes vow of poverty we call him a holy man, if a Jehovahs Witness did the same thing we'd call him a victim.

If the secular authorities make little children stand every morning and put their hands on their hearts, to recite the same words over and over again, we call it Patriotism, if a Jehovah's Witnesses did that it would be called brain washing.

Image

The reality is, there is no abuse or manipulation with JWs, there is education and choice. We are all free to make our life choices and any literature which educates as to alternative lifestyles is simply enlightening people as to that choice.

Why should a life dedicated to Goldman and Saks be viewed as superior to a life dedicated to the kingdom of God ?
Alternative lifestyles are not automatically "toxic and dangerous" just because it is a minority view. Everyone says "money doesn't mean happiness" so why is it "toxic and dangerous" to teach it?





JW



RELATED POSTS

Do Jehovahs Witnesses demonize education?
viewtopic.php?p=1015904#p1015904

Are Jehovahs Witnesses brainwashed victims ? [this post]
viewtopic.php?p=1029514#p1029514
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

User avatar
Aetixintro
Site Supporter
Posts: 918
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 3:18 am
Location: Metropolitan-Oslo, Norway, Europe
Has thanked: 431 times
Been thanked: 27 times
Contact:

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #15

Post by Aetixintro »

[Replying to nobspeople in post #1]

No, Christianity, truly, isn't dangerous! To be with God, one must adhere to sound morality or one loses the God inside of oneself.

It's the immoral who abuse and torture children as well as all the rest. They commit so much evil that it threatens the very morality among the best of us.

To say that if one ignores a flu with mortality rate of 3.5, the whole religion is outright dangerous, is to take it too far! Not all Christians are ignoring the Covid-19 flu.

Mortality of Covid-19: https://ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid.
I'm cool! :) - Stronger Religion every day! Also by "mathematical Religion", the eternal forms, God closing the door on corrupt humanity, possibly!

User avatar
Difflugia
Prodigy
Posts: 3017
Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:25 am
Location: Michigan
Has thanked: 3247 times
Been thanked: 1997 times

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #16

Post by Difflugia »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmDouble standard much?
No.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmOur lives and communities are centered on God, what's wrong with that?
I haven't suggested that. That's a straw man and non sequitur.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmIf the Amish do it they are quaint; if Jehovahs Witnesses do the same they are "dangerous".
The Amish are more abusive and dangerous than Jehovah's Witnesses.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmIf a nun says she is married to Jesus we make a movie about it, if a Jehovahs Witness said the same we would be hauled off for mental evaluation. If monk shaves his head sits in a loincloth and takes vow of poverty we call him a holy man, if a Jehovahs Witness did the same thing we'd call him a victim.
If the nun and monk are told as children that they're selfish to choose something other than becoming a nun or monk, then they're just as victimized as the Witness.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmIf the secular authorities make little children stand every morning and put their hands on their hearts, to recite the same words over and over again, we call it Patriotism, if a Jehovah's Witnesses did that it would be called brain washing.
Exactly. We just saw what that kind of unenlightened jingoism gets us.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmThe reality is, there is no abuse or manipulation with JWs, there is education and choice.
You mean like educating someone to believe that if they go to college, he or she doesn't love God?
The apostle John made much the same point when he warned that if anyone loves the things in the world—“the desire of the flesh and the desire of the eyes and the showy display of one’s means of life”—then “the love of the Father is not in him.” (1 John 2:15, 16) This means that we need to examine our heart constantly to see if it is being enticed by worldly entertainment, associations, and styles of dress and grooming. Or the love of the world might involve efforts to attain “great things,” such as through the pursuit of higher education. —The Watchtower, June 2016
Maybe you can look through the search results for "higher education" at the JW online library and find an article that doesn't try to instill guilt and fear about an education.

It's almost like the slave thinks that educated members are somehow bad for the organization, but that can't be right, can it?
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmWe are all free to make our life choices and any literature which educates as to alternative lifestyles is simply enlightening people as to that choice.
"You don't love God enough if you go to college." That's certainly enlightening, but not in the way you mean.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmWhy should a life dedicated to Goldman and Saks be viewed as superior to a life dedicated to the kingdom of God ?
I'll let you in on a little secret: getting an education doesn't limit your choice of career path. In fact, it kind of does the opposite.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmAlternative lifestyles are not automatically "toxic and dangerous" just because it is a minority view.
That's not why it's toxic. That's a straw man.
JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 6:17 pmEveryone says "money doesn't mean happiness" so why is it "toxic and dangerous" to teach it?
A straw man again? You can do better than that. The claim that I actually made, that you have yet to actually address, it that it's toxic to teach children that getting an education means they don't love God.

User avatar
JehovahsWitness
Savant
Posts: 21073
Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
Has thanked: 790 times
Been thanked: 1114 times
Contact:

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #17

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Aetixintro wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 7:30 pmNot all Christians are ignoring the Covid-19 flu.

Mortality of Covid-19: https://ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid.

I dont know of many people, Christian or non Christian that do that. In any case, all Jehovah's Witnesses services in affected areas have been held online since March 2020 and our leadership has signalled this will continue for the forseable future.



JW



FURTHER : Jehovahs Witneses Covid update VIDEOS
https://www.jw.org/en/library/videos/#e ... 78_1_VIDEO
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

nobspeople
Prodigy
Posts: 3187
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:32 am
Has thanked: 1510 times
Been thanked: 824 times

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #18

Post by nobspeople »

[Replying to Aetixintro in post #16]
No, Christianity, truly, isn't dangerous! To be with God, one must adhere to sound morality or one loses the God inside of oneself.
Then why, do you think, God allows these people to do things in his name? A look through history will see people killed in God's name by (at least some) people representing God.

Christianity is, at least in part, the people that make it up (without people there is no Christianity). Some people are dangerous, including those in Christianity. Therefore, doesn't that make Christianity, somewhat, dangerous? Sure maybe some of the concepts espoused therein isn't dangerous, but if Christianity allows evil to be taught, isn't it some way culpable?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

User avatar
tam
Savant
Posts: 6443
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:59 pm
Has thanked: 353 times
Been thanked: 324 times
Contact:

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #19

Post by tam »

Peace to you,

[Replying to nobspeople in post #19]

Doing something in God's name, and claiming to do something in God's name, are two different things.

Christ even warned us ahead of time that there would be false prophets and false christs who would claim to come in His name and who would deceive and mislead many. We are not to listen to them. (see Matt 24:4, 5, 24-27; 7:15)




Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

User avatar
brunumb
Savant
Posts: 5993
Joined: Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:20 am
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 6607 times
Been thanked: 3209 times

Re: Dangerous Christianity

Post #20

Post by brunumb »

tam wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:17 pm Doing something in God's name, and claiming to do something in God's name, are two different things.
Please explain how those two are in fact different in any meaningful way.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.

Post Reply