Why would God do this?

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Tommy63
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Why would God do this?

Post #1

Post by Tommy63 »

It has been a long time since I have been on here. For 17 years I have tried my best to follow what the Bible has told me to do. I have not been perfect in my walk, but I have tried to do the best I can.

For the past 2 years now I have started to question my beliefs in my religion, and have started to lose my faith in what God can do. My whole life has been one failure after another. I have never been able to be happy due to judgement, gossip, lies, and greed being placed upon me. I was told by the bible that if you knock, it would be opened for you....ask, and you shall receive....that we are God's children....and God loves us. I have read these things, but have not seen them in my life, which has caused me to question the things I have read, and been told. Here are a few of the things that are heavy on my soul now.

1. I understand that God created the heavens and the earth, and that satan was expelled from heaven. I would have to assume that satan was kick out of heaven after God created the earth and put Adam and Eve there, for how could satan have fell to earth if it was not created yet? With that being said, If God is the most powerful, why would he allowed satan to fall to earth, a place he created, and placed man upon it to live in peace and harmony, with beauty all around? God also told Adam and Eve not to eat from the tree. If God is everywhere, all the time, why would he have allowed satan to enter the garden of Eden, and why would he allow satan to persuade Eve to eat from the tree? If he expelled satan from heaven, could He not have expelled him from earth or smite him down? Man is now punished for something God allowed to happen. Why would God do this?

2. The story of Noah talks about God flooding the earth because of sin overwhelming earth. Since God allowed satan to fall to earth, and not protect his children from this evil by destroying satan, is this not God's fault for allowing the evil to grow? Why is man to blame for a seed that God allowed to be planted on this earth? Why would God do this?

3. Man has always been a sinner since the days of Eden. I know the Bible is written by man. I know that there were debates over which books would be put in the Bible. I know that Jesus is a part of God made into man that came to earth. So if Jesus is God himself as man, then why didn't Jesus write the bible? Why would God put trust in man, who has failed short of the glory because of his vanity, greed, lies, and temptations, why would God allow man to write the Bible? Why would God do this?

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #2

Post by nobspeople »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am It has been a long time since I have been on here. For 17 years I have tried my best to follow what the Bible has told me to do. I have not been perfect in my walk, but I have tried to do the best I can.

For the past 2 years now I have started to question my beliefs in my religion, and have started to lose my faith in what God can do. My whole life has been one failure after another. I have never been able to be happy due to judgement, gossip, lies, and greed being placed upon me. I was told by the bible that if you knock, it would be opened for you....ask, and you shall receive....that we are God's children....and God loves us. I have read these things, but have not seen them in my life, which has caused me to question the things I have read, and been told. Here are a few of the things that are heavy on my soul now.

1. I understand that God created the heavens and the earth, and that satan was expelled from heaven. I would have to assume that satan was kick out of heaven after God created the earth and put Adam and Eve there, for how could satan have fell to earth if it was not created yet? With that being said, If God is the most powerful, why would he allowed satan to fall to earth, a place he created, and placed man upon it to live in peace and harmony, with beauty all around? God also told Adam and Eve not to eat from the tree. If God is everywhere, all the time, why would he have allowed satan to enter the garden of Eden, and why would he allow satan to persuade Eve to eat from the tree? If he expelled satan from heaven, could He not have expelled him from earth or smite him down? Man is now punished for something God allowed to happen. Why would God do this?

2. The story of Noah talks about God flooding the earth because of sin overwhelming earth. Since God allowed satan to fall to earth, and not protect his children from this evil by destroying satan, is this not God's fault for allowing the evil to grow? Why is man to blame for a seed that God allowed to be planted on this earth? Why would God do this?

3. Man has always been a sinner since the days of Eden. I know the Bible is written by man. I know that there were debates over which books would be put in the Bible. I know that Jesus is a part of God made into man that came to earth. So if Jesus is God himself as man, then why didn't Jesus write the bible? Why would God put trust in man, who has failed short of the glory because of his vanity, greed, lies, and temptations, why would God allow man to write the Bible? Why would God do this?
Any supreme, perfect being worth's its salt wouldn't put imperfect being in charge to write his story or what he wants people to know, then use the same imperfect being to edit it and then use them again and again and again to translate it. How does this make any sense?!?
It doesn't.
Might as well go to your yard, grab the closest bug you can find, and tell them to 'write this down'. No amount of twisting, no amount of verbal gymnastics, no amount of faith in any holy spirit or 'divine inspiration' can make this make any sense whatsoever.
You'll continue to hear all kinds of excuses for this. That's all they are - excuses.
Believers make excuses for the very questions you're asking! Of course they don't know why "God does what he does". No one does. But what we CAN know is if these things make sense outside of the religion. If, someone looking from outside Christianity asks these questions, saying they 'don't make sense', but those within the religion say 'it makes sense', you have to question not only the religion but those saying it makes sense. They're biased towards protecting their way of life and their chosen lifestyle. You can't blame them - that's a very human thing to do.
Blame . Christians love to blame all the bad things of the world on people. Seven billion-plus people are to blame for thousand years' worth of sin because of what two people did?
Come on. That a supreme being would allow this to happen, then get mad about it and allow his creation to be condemned to the point where he wipes almost all of them out, then allows them to get so bad, again, that he must send his son as a sacrifice?!?
Zero logic in that. Aero compassion. And, it looks like, zero planning based on God's reactions.

If questioning is enough to make you leave your faith, great. Do it. I did it and have NEVER been happier.
But if you want to remain in the dark, questioning item after item after item, being told constantly to 'have faith' and 'carry on with the good fight', then that's great, too.

Just do what YOU want to do, not what others tell you to do.
Continue to question everything that requires faith in lieu of facts. You may get some answers, but you'll likely be left hanging with 'have faith' mantra than anything else. If that's the life you want to live, live it.
If not, cast it aside. Either way, life won't be perfect. But, from my experience, once you are released form the shackles of the modern Christian God, and all the 'do gooders' and the 'doom day sayers' that accompany this religion, you will see it's not as bad as they made it seem.
And if, like me, you've found a new path, which doesn't have all the answers either, but doesn't pretend to have them nor does it threaten eternal death with disobedience (or simply not being able to accept the unacceptable), you will be much happier.
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Why would God do this?

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Post by Miles »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am It has been a long time since I have been on here. For 17 years I have tried my best to follow what the Bible has told me to do. I have not been perfect in my walk, but I have tried to do the best I can.

For the past 2 years now I have started to question my beliefs in my religion, and have started to lose my faith in what God can do. My whole life has been one failure after another. I have never been able to be happy due to judgement, gossip, lies, and greed being placed upon me. I was told by the bible that if you knock, it would be opened for you....ask, and you shall receive....that we are God's children....and God loves us. I have read these things, but have not seen them in my life, which has caused me to question the things I have read, and been told. Here are a few of the things that are heavy on my soul now.

1. I understand that God created the heavens and the earth, and that satan was expelled from heaven. I would have to assume that satan was kick out of heaven after God created the earth and put Adam and Eve there, for how could satan have fell to earth if it was not created yet? With that being said, If God is the most powerful, why would he allowed satan to fall to earth, a place he created, and placed man upon it to live in peace and harmony, with beauty all around? God also told Adam and Eve not to eat from the tree. If God is everywhere, all the time, why would he have allowed satan to enter the garden of Eden, and why would he allow satan to persuade Eve to eat from the tree? If he expelled satan from heaven, could He not have expelled him from earth or smite him down? Man is now punished for something God allowed to happen. Why would God do this?

2. The story of Noah talks about God flooding the earth because of sin overwhelming earth. Since God allowed satan to fall to earth, and not protect his children from this evil by destroying satan, is this not God's fault for allowing the evil to grow? Why is man to blame for a seed that God allowed to be planted on this earth? Why would God do this?

3. Man has always been a sinner since the days of Eden. I know the Bible is written by man. I know that there were debates over which books would be put in the Bible. I know that Jesus is a part of God made into man that came to earth. So if Jesus is God himself as man, then why didn't Jesus write the bible? Why would God put trust in man, who has failed short of the glory because of his vanity, greed, lies, and temptations, why would God allow man to write the Bible? Why would God do this?
All very good questions. As a former Christian turned atheist for failing to resolve very similar questions, I understand your dilemma; How does one reconcile what you're told with reason and reality. I won't prod you toward abandoning Christianity or a belief in the existence of god, but offer you the comfort that you're far from being alone, and am willing to answer whatever questions you may have regarding your predicament



.

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #4

Post by Overcomer »

Tommy63 wrote:
For the past 2 years now I have started to question my beliefs in my religion, and have started to lose my faith in what God can do. My whole life has been one failure after another. I have never been able to be happy due to judgement, gossip, lies, and greed being placed upon me. I was told by the bible that if you knock, it would be opened for you....ask, and you shall receive....that we are God's children....and God loves us. I have read these things, but have not seen them in my life, which has caused me to question the things I have read, and been told. Here are a few of the things that are heavy on my soul now.
I am truly sorry that you have endured so many troubles in life and been treated so poorly, Tommy, but here's the thing:

At no point has God ever promised any of us a rose garden. He has never said that, if you follow him, your life will be problem-free and you'll be happy all of the time. In fact, Jesus tells us just the opposite. He says that, in this life, we will have many trials (John 16:33). At some point, he will return and eradicate sin and evil once and for all. But, in the meantime, we live in a fallen world where bad things happen to everybody, Christian or non-Christian. And while God doesn't promise to take all of our problems away from us, he does promise that he will help us through them (Matt. 11:28-30).

As for the "ask and ye shall receive" passage, read that verse in context. It is talking specifically about God giving people the Holy Spirit, NOT asking for anything and everything we want and expecting to get it. God will not give us everything we want because, quite frankly, some of the things we want would actually be bad for us. He sees the whole picture. We only see a bit of it. He's the one who knows better than we do.

Tommy wrote:
With that being said, If God is the most powerful, why would he allowed satan to fall to earth, a place he created, and placed man upon it to live in peace and harmony, with beauty all around? God also told Adam and Eve not to eat from the tree. If God is everywhere, all the time, why would he have allowed satan to enter the garden of Eden, and why would he allow satan to persuade Eve to eat from the tree? If he expelled satan from heaven, could He not have expelled him from earth or smite him down? Man is now punished for something God allowed to happen. Why would God do this?
God created us to be in a loving relationship with him. True love has to be given freely, not coerced. Being made in God's image, we have the same free will that he has and the ability to make choices. If you are going to give someone the choice to love you, then you have to give them the option to NOT love you as well. And that's the choice that God gave Adam and Eve. They doubted his love for them and so they chose NOT to love and trust and follow him.

What you have articulated is the problem of evil. But we must consider this: It is perfectly reasonable that God could have very good reasons for doing things the way he did that we are not aware of and that are morally justifiable.

Tommy wrote:
.
The story of Noah talks about God flooding the earth because of sin overwhelming earth. Since God allowed satan to fall to earth, and not protect his children from this evil by destroying satan, is this not God's fault for allowing the evil to grow? Why is man to blame for a seed that God allowed to be planted on this earth? Why would God do this?
God is not responsible for our bad choices. Would you prefer that he made us automatons who had no ability to think or the freedom to make choices? Would you prefer to be a robot, programmed for everything?

There would be less evil in the world right now if everyone committed themselves to life lived according to God's righteousness, but there are so many people fighting him instead of working with him. I encourage you NOT to join their ranks because it is the worst decision you could make.

Here's the thing:

There are only two camps in this world -- God's and the devil's. You can choose to be in God's or you can end up in the devil's by default. There are no other choices, no other camps to belong to.

Tommy wrote:
I know that Jesus is a part of God made into man that came to earth. So if Jesus is God himself as man, then why didn't Jesus write the bible? Why would God put trust in man, who has failed short of the glory because of his vanity, greed, lies, and temptations, why would God allow man to write the Bible? Why would God do this?
Jesus is NOT just a part of God. He IS God and came to earth as God Incarnate. He's the second person of the Trinity, the Trinity being one God who exists in three persons -- God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit.

It really doesn't matter whether Jesus wrote the Bible or not. The people who wrote Scripture did so under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. Yes, the individual personalities and styles of the writers come through, but the information is from God.

As to why he did it this way, I can only say that God always involves man in everything he does. He isn't an autocrat. He doesn't force people, but he invites people to be part of what he is doing in this world. He has always operated this way and he always will.

As for being a failure, I can only say this:

It may seem that we have failed in the world's eyes if we have not achieved what the world says is success: money, possessions, power, prestige, the so-called "good life" that people chase after. But it is more important to be successful in God's eyes. That means living life in Christ with Christ in you, listening to his guidance, following his wise counsel, blessing others in his name out of love for him and for them, being all he wants you to be, drawing on the power of the Holy Spirit to walk through this life.

That last thing is key: I used to think that I had to try to be good to please God. I realized that I was trying to be good in my own power and it just wasn't working. But when I realized that the Holy Spirit would gladly give me the understanding, the strength, the wisdom, etc. to start making better choices, allowing him to change me from the inside out, then I finally stopped trying and just settled into the Lord and his plan for me. No Christians are perfect, but we can grow more and more like Christ if we work with the Holy Spirit to make that happen.

I hope I have written something to encourage you. Just don't walk away from God. Keep asking your questions. Keep searching for answers. Keep talking to the Lord and asking for clarity, understanding, wisdom, etc. He will be glad to respond to such pleas.

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #5

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am 1. ...If God is the most powerful, why would he allowed satan to fall to earth...?
Satan has been allowed to exist and tempt mankind to settle the issue of universal Sovereignty.

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am 2. ...Man is now punished for something God allowed to happen. Why would God do this?

Man isn't being punished, man is suffering the consequences. Why? See above.

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am

2. ... is this not God's fault for allowing the evil to grow?
No.



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SATAN THE DEVIL , RESPONSIBILITY and ... HUMAN SUFFERING
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Romans 14:8

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #6

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am 3......why didn't Jesus write the bible?

He didnt need to.

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am ...why would God allow man to write the Bible?

Because he wanted their input.


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BIBLICAL INERRANCY , COMPILATION and ... AUTHORSHIP & TRANSMISSION
NOTE All posts I write represent my personal faith based beliefs as one of Jehovah's Witnesses
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Romans 14:8

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #7

Post by Purple Knight »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 amwhy would he allowed satan to fall to earth, a place he created, and placed man upon it to live in peace and harmony, with beauty all around?
There may not have been anywhere else for Lucifer the Light to "fall" to. In my understanding, there is a barrier between Heaven and Earth (I believe it is called the firmament) and there are no other barriers. Anything that is out of Heaven is on our side of the firmament.
Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 amallowing the evil to grow
People have to have choices. Good doesn't mean anything if people aren't allowed to choose evil. I don't believe in God but I do believe in this.

I want to be good, as in, actually good. Not as in, I want to live in a universe where I know some god will smush me like a bug if I chose evil.

I've come to the conclusion that this is not achievable for me, but if it's achievable for others, and if it was given intentionally, the magnitude of that gift is greater than anything else that can be imagined.

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #8

Post by JehovahsWitness »

nobspeople wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 1:35 pm
Any supreme, perfect being worth's its salt wouldn't put imperfect being in charge to write his story ...

It is a presumption that he did. According to scripture God has always "been in charge" of his written word. ( 2 Tim 3:16 ; 1 Peter 1:25 )






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Romans 14:8

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #9

Post by bjs1 »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am 1. I understand that God created the heavens and the earth, and that satan was expelled from heaven. I would have to assume that satan was kick out of heaven after God created the earth and put Adam and Eve there, for how could satan have fell to earth if it was not created yet? With that being said, If God is the most powerful, why would he allowed satan to fall to earth, a place he created, and placed man upon it to live in peace and harmony, with beauty all around? God also told Adam and Eve not to eat from the tree. If God is everywhere, all the time, why would he have allowed satan to enter the garden of Eden, and why would he allow satan to persuade Eve to eat from the tree? If he expelled satan from heaven, could He not have expelled him from earth or smite him down? Man is now punished for something God allowed to happen. Why would God do this?
I liked Augustine’s take on this. He argued that God did not allow Satan into the Garden to tempt Adam and Eve to sin, but rather Satan was allowed in to reveal the sin that was already there. Adam and Eve were already rebellious and self-centered in their own hearts. Satan was a tool God used to reveal that truth.

Obviously a sin must exist in the heart before comes to fruition through actions. I have to desire evil, even if it is just for a split second, before I can act in an evil way. It is that inner desire that God is more concerned with. Keeping all the external laws does not make a person good at heart, and our God is always concerned with the heart.

Adam and Eve’s hearts had already allowed corruption to sneak God. God used Satan to reveal that corruption in order to give Adam and Eve the opportunity to repent of it – though they chose not to repent.

I think this also goes a long way towards answering your second question.

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am 3. Man has always been a sinner since the days of Eden. I know the Bible is written by man. I know that there were debates over which books would be put in the Bible. I know that Jesus is a part of God made into man that came to earth. So if Jesus is God himself as man, then why didn't Jesus write the bible? Why would God put trust in man, who has failed short of the glory because of his vanity, greed, lies, and temptations, why would God allow man to write the Bible? Why would God do this?
Traditionally, Christianity has insisted that God the Holy Spirit inspired the Bible. God worked with people in the individual styles and through the process of writing the Bible, but ultimately God worked it out so that the words He desired were the ones that made it into the scriptures and the books God desires were the ones chosen for the Bible. It is the Authorship of the God the Holy Spirit, not the human authorship, that makes the Bible trustworthy.


Since you are struggling, I suggest that you talk to someone in person. Talk to your pastor. Talk to a Christian friend. Talk to a parent. The impersonal internet is not the way to deal with such struggles. I know that the pandemic limits personal interaction. However, talk to someone on the phone and make plans to speak in person once that becomes an option again. I enjoy a debate cite like this, but I recognize that you are unlikely to find your answer here.

My last thought is this: Our faith is all about grace. I am glad that you seek to obey the Lord, but always remember that it is the grace of God and not your own efforts that produce a holy life and ultimate salvation.
Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.
-Charles Darwin

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Re: Why would God do this?

Post #10

Post by brunumb »

Tommy63 wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 11:59 am Why would God do this?
You will get a truckload of rationalisations and rhetoric Tommy63, but if you simply take God right out of the picture everything will become perfectly clear. Keep safe.
George Orwell:: “The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”
Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.

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