Who holds the responsibility?

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nobspeople
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Who holds the responsibility?

Post #1

Post by nobspeople »

There are discussion here (and elsewhere) about cultural significance of certain things and what words meant in the days of Jesus verses now. And, from what I can see, they are legitimate discussions that will further enhance one's understanding of things being discussed.

That said, if there are enough cultural differences in 'Jesus's days' to what words spoken meant then compared to now, whose responsibility is it to communicate that information?

I mean, if 'cheating' means something different then than it does now (be it from the word's definition and its changes or the cultural influences of the time), is it the reader's chore to research that or those that edited the bible for current distribution?

And why?
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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #2

Post by 1213 »

nobspeople wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:23 pm ...That said, if there are enough cultural differences in 'Jesus's days' to what words spoken meant then compared to now, whose responsibility is it to communicate that information?

I mean, if 'cheating' means something different then than it does now (be it from the word's definition and its changes or the cultural influences of the time), is it the reader's chore to research that or those that edited the bible for current distribution?
I think it is readers responsibility to try to understand it as the original teller meant it to be understood. If it is difficult, God has promised to give wisdom/understanding for those who think they do not understand and ask God to help. Luckily, context also helps in this case if some word has been twisted.

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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #3

Post by nobspeople »

1213 wrote: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:46 pm
nobspeople wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:23 pm ...That said, if there are enough cultural differences in 'Jesus's days' to what words spoken meant then compared to now, whose responsibility is it to communicate that information?

I mean, if 'cheating' means something different then than it does now (be it from the word's definition and its changes or the cultural influences of the time), is it the reader's chore to research that or those that edited the bible for current distribution?
I think it is readers responsibility to try to understand it as the original teller meant it to be understood. If it is difficult, God has promised to give wisdom/understanding for those who think they do not understand and ask God to help. Luckily, context also helps in this case if some word has been twisted.
I think the readers, mostly, do try to understand it, rather to accept it or denounce it as fiction.
I also think it's God's responsibility to make things that may have been understood different (culturally or linguistically) understandable to today's people, be that by correct translations and edits or by direct contact. Seems you may think the same way.
If so, how then do you explain all the incorrect understandings of the same texts or stories by brothers and sisters of Christ? Surely, it could be said 'the Devil is causing such discourse'. Which could be true, I suppose (most anything is possible). But then again, God's allowing that to happen.
How to you justify this happening, if God is, indeed, working to make it understandable? Surely it doesn't 'take time' to come to a complete understanding, as people are dying all the time during this 'transition of understanding' phase.
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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #4

Post by William »

This, on the assumption that God is interested in supporting religious script...Some think that God does not use the bible [or religious script in general] in order for God to be understood by the individual. Some think that confusion [things which cause confusion] is not the medium in which The Creator engages with the individual. Rather, some experience clarity directly related to their particular part in the storyline of life on Earth. Religious books might hint [or even tell it plainly] that this clarity is how The Creator interacts with the individual - not through the individual trying to understand/interpret ancient ambiguous writing from books claimed to be holy/inspired by The Creator.

Until one has clear evidence that the Bible is indeed inspired by The Creator, stick with the clarity of ones individual relationship with said Creator - if indeed one has such a relationship...

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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #5

Post by 1213 »

nobspeople wrote: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:54 pm ...If so, how then do you explain all the incorrect understandings of the same texts or stories by brothers and sisters of Christ?...
By what I see, the reason is that some people don’t want to hear the direct message and make for example own interpretations that please them. I don’t think there is really any problem in the message.

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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #6

Post by Tcg »

1213 wrote: Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:54 pm
nobspeople wrote: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:54 pm ...If so, how then do you explain all the incorrect understandings of the same texts or stories by brothers and sisters of Christ?...
By what I see, the reason is that some people don’t want to hear the direct message and make for example own interpretations that please them. I don’t think there is really any problem in the message.
A quick visit to the Theology, Doctrine, and Dogma subforum reveals that the message is not clear. There are a number of threads that consist of a perpetual discussion of whether or not Jesus is God. All involved are using the Bible as the source of their claims and yet consensus is never met. It's not uncommon to see the same with determining how one attains eternal life. Perpetual arguments and nothing in the Bible resolves them. If the message were clear, this would not be the case. Clearly there is a problem with the message.


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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #7

Post by 1213 »

Tcg wrote: Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:12 pm ...A quick visit to the Theology, Doctrine, and Dogma subforum reveals that the message is not clear. There are a number of threads that consist of a perpetual discussion of whether or not Jesus is God. All involved are using the Bible as the source of their claims and yet consensus is never met. It's not uncommon to see the same with determining how one attains eternal life. Perpetual arguments and nothing in the Bible resolves them. If the message were clear, this would not be the case. Clearly there is a problem with the message...
By what I know, the problem is really that people take just few scriptures to support their idea and ignore the rest. That is how it is possible to form a problem. If they would read and accept it all the problem would vanish, because Bible explains well what it says. Unfortunately, it seems many don’t really want to hear what is said in the Bible.

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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #8

Post by nobspeople »

1213 wrote: Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:54 pm
nobspeople wrote: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:54 pm ...If so, how then do you explain all the incorrect understandings of the same texts or stories by brothers and sisters of Christ?...
By what I see, the reason is that some people don’t want to hear the direct message and make for example own interpretations that please them. I don’t think there is really any problem in the message.
Of course you don't. And the people that believe and disagree with you don't see a problem with the message as they understand it. That doesn't mean there's not a problem with the message.
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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #9

Post by William »

1213 wrote: Sun Mar 28, 2021 3:41 am
Tcg wrote: Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:12 pm ...A quick visit to the Theology, Doctrine, and Dogma subforum reveals that the message is not clear. There are a number of threads that consist of a perpetual discussion of whether or not Jesus is God. All involved are using the Bible as the source of their claims and yet consensus is never met. It's not uncommon to see the same with determining how one attains eternal life. Perpetual arguments and nothing in the Bible resolves them. If the message were clear, this would not be the case. Clearly there is a problem with the message...
By what I know, the problem is really that people take just few scriptures to support their idea and ignore the rest. That is how it is possible to form a problem. If they would read and accept it all the problem would vanish, because Bible explains well what it says. Unfortunately, it seems many don’t really want to hear what is said in the Bible.
And then there is the one true Scotsman fallacy where this claim most likely leads. One has to realize that 'the problem' according to those Christians who disagree with other Christians is not because the other Christians don't "read and accept it all" but because the Bible itself needs to be interpreted.

The problem therefore must be the Bible itself.

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Re: Who holds the responsibility?

Post #10

Post by 1213 »

William wrote: Mon Mar 29, 2021 11:17 pm ...One has to realize that 'the problem' according to those Christians who disagree with other Christians is not because the other Christians don't "read and accept it all" but because the Bible itself needs to be interpreted.
Why it must be interpreted? Why it is not enough to let the Bible explain what it really means?

Should I also begin to interpret your sayings the same way people interpret the Bible?

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