Trials and tribulations in life.
We all have trials and tribulations in life. Some more than others. When the situation is bad, we have two options. Some people despair. They loose faith in God, when they pray, and nothing happens. This can result in divorce and suicide. Others, like Job, maintain their faith, because they are convinced beyond any doubt about God’s love for them; and know that in the end they will be with God in heaven for all eternity.
It seems easy to get out of a situation where there is too much of hurt and suffering. But running away from the situation will never bring us peace. Our only peace comes from being one with God. That is why saint like St Padre Pio and St Paul who suffered much for their faith, believed, and stayed faithful to God in the midst of their pain, suffering and persecution. Furthermore, suffering and tribulations are the best time for spiritual growth, because when they are accepted with faith in God, brings us humility which enables us to know God and grow in holiness.
How to deal with trials and tribulations
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #2.
Putting your preaching aside, what is it you wanted to debate?
.
Putting your preaching aside, what is it you wanted to debate?
.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #3From the OP:
Some of us consider religion a net pain on society, with the restricting the rights of women to control their bodies, to the restricting the rights of gays folks, to the legislating against science, just to name a few examples.
Your position here is typical of the religious zealot who has no understanding of how folks can find peace without resorting to ancient superstitions to find it. That you can't find peace any other way does not bind a good many of us to religious belief.
Speak for yourself, preacher.OP wrote: ...
Our only peace comes from being one with God.
...
Some of us consider religion a net pain on society, with the restricting the rights of women to control their bodies, to the restricting the rights of gays folks, to the legislating against science, just to name a few examples.
Your position here is typical of the religious zealot who has no understanding of how folks can find peace without resorting to ancient superstitions to find it. That you can't find peace any other way does not bind a good many of us to religious belief.
I might be Teddy Roosevelt, but I ain't.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #4For now I will assume that you are asking if we agree with you that we should maintain faith in God despite trials and tribulations. I think that God should earn our trust by being trustworthy. In other words if he wants us to put faith in him to help when the going gets tough, then he should get going on solving those difficulties. Seeing that many people including the most devout Christians suffer, I see no evidence or reason to believe that God helps those who need help. I think that God cannot help people, and that's why we need to help each other.aapatil@cox.net wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 1:33 pm Trials and tribulations in life.
We all have trials and tribulations in life. Some more than others. When the situation is bad, we have two options. Some people despair. They loose faith in God, when they pray, and nothing happens. This can result in divorce and suicide. Others, like Job, maintain their faith, because they are convinced beyond any doubt about God’s love for them; and know that in the end they will be with God in heaven for all eternity.
It seems easy to get out of a situation where there is too much of hurt and suffering. But running away from the situation will never bring us peace. Our only peace comes from being one with God. That is why saint like St Padre Pio and St Paul who suffered much for their faith, believed, and stayed faithful to God in the midst of their pain, suffering and persecution. Furthermore, suffering and tribulations are the best time for spiritual growth, because when they are accepted with faith in God, brings us humility which enables us to know God and grow in holiness.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #5I agree that peace of mind doesn't necessarily come from God, but there's no doubt that many attest to finding peace with God. I wouldn't describe them as religious zealots. As the old saying goes: "You can't argue with success." And God need not inspire misogyny or homophobia or antiscientific sentiments and ignorance. Arguably the greatest scientific genius ever, Sir Isaac Newton, was an ardent theist. God evidently didn't impede him one bit as far as science is concerned.JoeyKnothead wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 3:46 pm From the OP:
Speak for yourself, preacher.OP wrote: ...
Our only peace comes from being one with God.
...
Some of us consider religion a net pain on society, with the restricting the rights of women to control their bodies, to the restricting the rights of gays folks, to the legislating against science, just to name a few examples.
Your position here is typical of the religious zealot who has no understanding of how folks can find peace without resorting to ancient superstitions to find it. That you can't find peace any other way does not bind a good many of us to religious belief.
So frankly your harsh words tell me that if there's any zealotry here, it is your own. Atheism has a very mixed track record regarding its social impact, and the kettle should avoid calling the pot black.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #6[Replying to aapatil@cox.net in post #1]
Moderator Comment
Please post general discussion topics in the General Discussion section of the forum. New threads in the Debate section should specifically contain a topic for debate, which is missing in this OP. Also, please read the forum rules on Preaching.
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Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics..
Moderator Comment
Please post general discussion topics in the General Discussion section of the forum. New threads in the Debate section should specifically contain a topic for debate, which is missing in this OP. Also, please read the forum rules on Preaching.
______________
Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics..
In human affairs the sources of success are ever to be found in the fountains of quick resolve and swift stroke; and it seems to be a law, inflexible and inexorable, that he who will not risk cannot win.
John Paul Jones, 1779
The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read.
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John Paul Jones, 1779
The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #7And, as this is a debate site, I'd challenge folks to offer some means to confirm a god's involvement. Other'n purely as a concept.Paul of Tarsus wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 7:30 pm I agree that peace of mind doesn't necessarily come from God, but there's no doubt that many attest to finding peace with God.
Yet the Christian majority strives to ensure the rights of others are quashed in the name of a god they can't show exists.Paul of Tarsus wrote: I wouldn't describe them as religious zealots. As the old saying goes: "You can't argue with success." And God need not inspire misogyny or homophobia or antiscientific sentiments and ignorance.
That's the zealotry of which I speak.
I stand by my use of the term.
He's been dead over a dozen years now, and to try to imply he wouldn't change his mind based on the updated understanding we have now is the kind of wishful thinking religion relies upon to hold folks to the ideas and superstitions of the ancients.Paul of Tarsus wrote: Arguably the greatest scientific genius ever, Sir Isaac Newton, was an ardent theist. God evidently didn't impede him one bit as far as science is concerned.
I don't doubt many a theist considers any criticism of their unproven, unprovable claims to be "harsh".Paul of Tarsus wrote: So frankly your harsh words tell me that if there's any zealotry here, it is your own.
And the common denominator between religion and atheism is that it's humans involved in both.Paul of Tarsus wrote: Atheism has a very mixed track record regarding its social impact, and the kettle should avoid calling the pot black.
The theist can bring no confirmable evidence to bear regarding the effects of a god they can't show exists to affect anything.
I might be Teddy Roosevelt, but I ain't.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #8So, it's more of an honorary title. This is the exact same result we'd expect if there were no god/gods, at least none outside human imagination.Paul of Tarsus wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 7:17 pm I think that God cannot help people, and that's why we need to help each other.
Tcg
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I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.
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Re: How to deal with trials and tribulations
Post #10Sure. The suffering in the world would still be real if I didn't exist too. Of course, I do exist so the suffering in the world doesn't help much in proving that I or God don't exist. God, like I, may exist yet not be able to eradicate evil.Tcg wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 11:41 pmSo, it's more of an honorary title. This is the exact same result we'd expect if there were no god/gods, at least none outside human imagination.Paul of Tarsus wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 7:17 pm I think that God cannot help people, and that's why we need to help each other.