Is God always justified in his actions?

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nobspeople
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Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #1

Post by nobspeople »

Of course this is based on personal opinion (some of you may not like that), but is all of God's more 'negative' decisions made in the bible justified? I'm sure all Christians would say YES, while non-Christians may be mixed in their responses.

For those that say YES, God's more 'negative' actions (drowning most of the life on the planet, drowning Pharoah and his army when they crossed after Moses (God likes to drown, it seems - weird), killing of Egypt's first born, allowing Job to be tortured to prove a point when he already knew how faithful he was, etc), are you saying YES because he is God and can do no wrong (in other words, you question his motives based on your understanding but stand behind him nonetheless) or do you believe, 100%, he was right in his actions?
Can you provide reference as to why and how he was 100% justified?
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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #81

Post by JehovahsWitness »

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:41 am
You're good at providing scriptures to prove your point, as we all know.
Thank you, I try.

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:41 am
That, to me, is a biblically provided fact.

Oh-kaaay. Strange way of putting it but ...ok.

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:41 am
Can you provide scriptures showing God is 'all knowing' or not?
Why should I? it wasn't my point it was yours.

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:41 am
1 John 3:20, for example

Nice scripture. Did you have a point to make with it? If so do you feel inclined to share the point you feel this scripture supports in words?




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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #82

Post by nobspeople »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:46 am
nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:41 am That, to me, is a biblically provided fact. Can you provide scriptures showing God is 'all knowing' or not? Which means more than 'No it is not'
Ok but you didn't answer the question. What is a "biblically provided fact" ? A fact is usually something a thing that is known or proved to be true. So are you if it says something in the bible it is "proved to be true".


Please clarify,





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Yes I did
See here:
"...scriptures to prove your point... That, to me, is a biblically provided fact. Can you provide scriptures showing God is 'all knowing' or not?"
Also here:
"Is there any biblical text in the entire bible describing God as all knowing?"

The answer is YES, the bible does indicate God knows all.
1 John 3:20
If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.
Also, Acts 15:18 Known to God from eternity are all his works
Romans 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are his judgments and his ways past finding out
Psalm 147:5 Great is our Lord, and abundant in power; his understanding is beyond measure
Job 37:16 Do you know the balance of the clouds, those wondrous works of him who is perfect in knowledge
And many more.

The bible says God is all knowing. This means, without any doubt (unless you want to challenge what the bible indicates) that God knows everything. Everything includes past, present and future. What everyone thinks, thought, will think; what people said, are saying, will say; who was born, is being born, will be born; who died, is dying and will die; when they died or will die; the list is literally endless as GOD KNOWS EVERYTHING.

One can argue semantics of 'know' or 'knowledge' but it would be futile, as The Borg say, as God knows everything. This means, he knew what people will do, say and think.
I suppose one can justify their God in these actions - they can justify anything to save face. But to many, what God allowed to happen to people, is terrible and totally unnecessary, unbecoming of a supreme being that wants, or as some teach, demand, worship.

But thanks for your input.
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #83

Post by JehovahsWitness »

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:00 am
1 John 3:20
If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.

Also, Acts 15:18 Known to God from eternity are all his world

Romans 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are his judgments and his ways past finding out

Psalm 147:5 Great is our Lord, and abundant in power; his understanding is beyond measure

Job 37:16 Do you know the balance of the clouds, those wondrous works of him who is perfect in knowledge
And many more.

The bible says God is all knowing.

I dont ses the words "all knowing" anywhere in the passages you quoted. Is that perhaps you adding words to scripture?
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http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #84

Post by nobspeople »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:07 am
nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:00 am
1 John 3:20
If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.

Also, Acts 15:18 Known to God from eternity are all his world

Romans 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are his judgments and his ways past finding out

Psalm 147:5 Great is our Lord, and abundant in power; his understanding is beyond measure

Job 37:16 Do you know the balance of the clouds, those wondrous works of him who is perfect in knowledge
And many more.

The bible says God is all knowing.

I dont ses the words "all knowing" anywhere in the passages you quoted. Is that perhaps you adding words to scripture?
Well, then you're here for no reason.
Thanks, though; it's been entertaining. :P
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #85

Post by brunumb »

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:00 am One can argue semantics of 'know' or 'knowledge' but it would be futile, ......
That is a common tactic used by Christian apologists to avoid giving any direct answers that they feel might ultimately compromise their position. Good luck.
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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #86

Post by JoeyKnothead »

From Post 83:
JehovahsWitness wrote: I dont ses the words "all knowing" anywhere in the passages you quoted. Is that perhaps you adding words to scripture?
Good googly moogly...
https://biblehub.com/1_john/3-20.htm wrote: New International Version
If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.

New Living Translation
Even if we feel guilty, God is greater than our feelings, and he knows everything.

English Standard Version
for whenever our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and he knows everything.

Berean Study Bible
Even if our hearts condemn us, God is greater than our hearts, and He knows all things.

Berean Literal Bible
that if our heart should condemn us, that God is greater than our heart, and He knows all things.

King James Bible
For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

New King James Version
For if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things.

New American Standard Bible
that if our heart condemns us, that God is greater than our heart, and He knows all things.

NASB 1995
in whatever our heart condemns us; for God is greater than our heart and knows all things.

NASB 1977
in whatever our heart condemns us; for God is greater than our heart, and knows all things.

Amplified Bible
whenever our heart convicts us [in guilt]; for God is greater than our heart and He knows all things [nothing is hidden from Him because we are in His hands].

Christian Standard Bible
whenever our hearts condemn us; for God is greater than our hearts, and he knows all things.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
even if our conscience condemns us, that God is greater than our conscience, and He knows all things.

American Standard Version
because if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
For if our heart condemns us, how much greater is God than our heart? And he knows all things.

Contemporary English Version
But even if we don't feel at ease, God is greater than our feelings, and he knows everything.

Douay-Rheims Bible
For if our heart reprehend us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

English Revised Version
whereinsoever our heart condemn us; because God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

Good News Translation
If our conscience condemns us, we know that God is greater than our conscience and that he knows everything.

GOD'S WORD Translation
Whenever our conscience condemns us, we will be reassured that God is greater than our conscience and knows everything.

International Standard Version
If our hearts condemn us, God is greater than our hearts and knows everything.

Literal Standard Version
because if our heart may condemn—because greater is God than our heart, and He knows all things.

NET Bible
that if our conscience condemns us, that God is greater than our conscience and knows all things.

New Heart English Bible because if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things.

Weymouth New Testament
in whatever matters our hearts condemn us--because God is greater than our hearts and knows everything.

World English Bible
because if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things.

Young's Literal Translation
because if our heart may condemn -- because greater is God than our heart, and He doth know all things.
All them bibles agree to what that passage says or means - just for 1 John 3:20 - all those bibles say God's him a big fat know-it-all.

I think the reasonable and rational conclusion to be drawn here, is that someone's done come along and ripped that page out of JehovahsWitness' bible.
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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #87

Post by brunumb »

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #87]

That's all very well JoeyKnothead, but it never actually says all knowing. ;)

Sorry, I just had to join in with the ridiculous word games. It's so handy being able to offer different translations that really mean the same thing but can be conveniently used as a refutation of a claim. I think that's how shonky new religious sects actually get started.
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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #88

Post by Tcg »

brunumb wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:59 am [Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #87]

That's all very well JoeyKnothead, but it never actually says all knowing. ;)

Sorry, I just had to join in with the ridiculous word games. It's so handy being able to offer different translations that really mean the same thing but can be conveniently used as a refutation of a claim. I think that's how shonky new religious sects actually get started.
Indeed. Just how can "he knows all things" be considered equivalent to "all knowing." After all in one the word "all" is in the middle of the phrase and in the other it is at the beginning of the phrase. "All" can't possibly mean all unless it is in the beginning of the phrase. We all know that... err... I mean... all of us know that.


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Re: Is God always justified in his actions?

Post #89

Post by JoeyKnothead »

brunumb wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:59 am [Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #87]

That's all very well JoeyKnothead, but it never actually says all knowing. ;)

Sorry, I just had to join in with the ridiculous word games. It's so handy being able to offer different translations that really mean the same thing but can be conveniently used as a refutation of a claim. I think that's how shonky new religious sects actually get started.
Ah, like when the pretty thing asks if I took out the trash and I tell her "yes", only I'm referring to when I took it out two weeks ago.

It does seem so many theists' arguments are slipperier'n a greased up sow.
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