Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

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nobspeople
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Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #1

Post by nobspeople »

Intelligent design doesn't mean, literally, perfect design. But that idea flies out the window (and lands in a steaming pile) when one says the ID was done by a being that's all knowing and all capable (even though the bible may not use those terms, specifically, the idea is there based on the words used).

One would expect said ID to then be flawless, if this was the being's intent.
But any ID we see around us, isn't perfect. Some would say that's 'man's fault' due to original sin. That's an excuse, in all honestly: how can imperfect being thwart (damage, harm, etc) a perfect being's plan?!? It's not possible.

Unless... the perfect being wanted it to be able to be thwarted by these imperfect beings.

Examples of ID not so 'I':
The human eye - plenty of eyes on the planet are better than human eyes: from raptors to squid to shrimp
The human throat - what 'I' creator would make the throat to contain the air AND food passage so close together that can cause choking? Not so 'I' it seems
Testicles - one theory says that animals that jump a lot have external testicles to protect those cells from abdominal pressure, while animals that don't need this protection have internal testicles - why not have all internal testicles? Same question when it comes to 'heat tolerance'.
The fact that evolution has come up with a method to have a body good enough to not cause death before reproduction, too much of the time, versus being created by an infallible creator (aka God).

Some are changing the INTELLIGENT Design to UNDESIRABLE Design, but still shows the makings of ID, which is yet another excuse to justify a POV.

Why do you think ID isn't very 'I'?
Or, why do you think ID is very 'I'?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #11

Post by nobspeople »

1213 wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 10:25 am
nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 8:40 am ...
Rhinos have eyes, but poor eyesight.
Ostriches have feathers but can't fly.
Both of these examples are logical and purposeful, but not very intelligent.
1) Why they are not intelligent?
2) Why should they be something different (intelligent reason)?

3) I would like to hear also, why in evolution point of view the situation is that, if it is a poor condition. If it is bad for the animal, shouldn’t evolution have made it different?
1) One reason is that it's a waste of energy to create and maintain something that's only 'half baked'. In the case of the human throat, for example, how smart is it to design something that can choke you when you're trying to eat? It's not, It's rather stupid.
2) Not sure what you're asking exactly
3) Thinking of an 'end result' is a human concept. Evolution is about change over time, not about a 'wham bam than ya' ma'am' change.
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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #12

Post by brunumb »

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 10:58 am
1213 wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 10:25 am 3) I would like to hear also, why in evolution point of view the situation is that, if it is a poor condition. If it is bad for the animal, shouldn’t evolution have made it different?
3) Thinking of an 'end result' is a human concept. Evolution is about change over time, not about a 'wham bam than ya' ma'am' change.
Evolution is not purposeful and has no direction. The main driving force is the environment. An organism that has evolved to thrive in warm, wet conditions may struggle to survive if conditions change to hot and dry. Given enough time, populations of the organism with modifications that increase their ability to survive may appear and take over. We are currently seeing species becoming endangered and even extinct as a result of relatively rapid changes to their environment from both natural sources and human involvement.
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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #13

Post by 1213 »

nobspeople wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 10:58 am 1) One reason is that it's a waste of energy to create and maintain something that's only 'half baked'. In the case of the human throat, for example, how smart is it to design something that can choke you when you're trying to eat? It's not, It's rather stupid...
“Half baked” is interesting opinion, I don’t think it is the true fact. But, it is true, you could choke. However, that is not because of the design, but because of bad use. You could choke in any case, if you have some system to breath. I think current human throat is good design. And often multipurpose systems are considered good systems. If air would be delivered in some other way, I think it would cause more problems than benefits and it would be stupid system for human.

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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #14

Post by Diagoras »

1213 wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 4:56 pmYes, but, if something works logically and purposefully, I think it is intelligently created.
Would you say that if something works in an illogical way, then it wasn’t intelligently created?

If so, then such an example would have to lead to one of two conclusions: either God created some things rather illogically, or - some things were created by someone other than God.

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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #15

Post by William »

I think the design is intelligent and also see that one can create something which operates perfectly if the intention was to have things within it have imperfections.

Are there intelligent reasons for wanting to create such a specific type of reality experience?

One I can think of immediately is that one wishes to have the critters within it, learn and create things through that learning. So if everything was perfect in the sense that the OP is suggesting, then we could not have to eat or reproduce etc.

I think intelligence enjoys a challenge as it gives meaning where otherwise there may not be any - so situations [like the Universe and Earth in the Universe] are created for that experience. To be born without having any clue as to why you were meant to be born - you give your own life meaning in the process of that 'imperfect' situation you find yourself within...

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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #16

Post by brunumb »

1213 wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 12:23 pm If air would be delivered in some other way, I think it would cause more problems than benefits and it would be stupid system for human.
Could you please elaborate on what you see as those problems and precisely why the system would be stupid for humans. Keep in mind that the alternative should be intelligently designed.
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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #17

Post by 1213 »

brunumb wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:01 pm
1213 wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 12:23 pm If air would be delivered in some other way, I think it would cause more problems than benefits and it would be stupid system for human.
Could you please elaborate on what you see as those problems and precisely why the system would be stupid for humans. Keep in mind that the alternative should be intelligently designed.
Current system is quite well protected. If you swallow something, it most probably goes to stomach, not to lungs. If there would be direct inlet, it would be more vulnerable.

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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #18

Post by 1213 »

Diagoras wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 7:33 pm
1213 wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 4:56 pmYes, but, if something works logically and purposefully, I think it is intelligently created.
Would you say that if something works in an illogical way, then it wasn’t intelligently created?
Maybe, if there also would be no good purpose for it. But, I really try to avoid saying so, because it is possible that I just don’t understand things well enough. It is possible that there is higher intelligence than me.

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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #19

Post by brunumb »

1213 wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:57 pm
brunumb wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:01 pm
1213 wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 12:23 pm If air would be delivered in some other way, I think it would cause more problems than benefits and it would be stupid system for human.
Could you please elaborate on what you see as those problems and precisely why the system would be stupid for humans. Keep in mind that the alternative should be intelligently designed.
Current system is quite well protected. If you swallow something, it most probably goes to stomach, not to lungs. If there would be direct inlet, it would be more vulnerable.
You keep making unsupported claims as if you are just plucking excuse out of the air.
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Re: Intelligent design not so intelligent... why?

Post #20

Post by 1213 »

brunumb wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:01 pm
1213 wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 4:57 pm
brunumb wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:01 pm
1213 wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 12:23 pm If air would be delivered in some other way, I think it would cause more problems than benefits and it would be stupid system for human.
Could you please elaborate on what you see as those problems and precisely why the system would be stupid for humans. Keep in mind that the alternative should be intelligently designed.
Current system is quite well protected. If you swallow something, it most probably goes to stomach, not to lungs. If there would be direct inlet, it would be more vulnerable.
You keep making unsupported claims as if you are just plucking excuse out of the air.
Please tell, what part in my claim you don’t think is true?

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