Good reason

[nobspeople]

In a different thread (listed below), when discussing, in part, if the bible is true, TRANSPONDER said " It is a well known argument that asserting what is in the Bible is true because it is in the Bible is a fallacy. A Lawyer would know that a witness statement is not going to be accepted as true just because he or she has said it. Nor of course rejected without good reason."

The above bolded section caused me to think (not claiming this is TRANSPNDER's assertion): is there good reason to think the bible isn't true?

For discussion: Is there good reason (define what is 'good reason' to you) to think the bible is or is not true*?

*TRUE here being used as 'legitimate, real word of God which was written by men, inspired by God' - this would assume everything written in it is true and agreed upon by God - in other words, nothing written is personal opinion of the writer.



Reference viewtopic.php?f=8&t=38540&start=10

[brunumb]

Jesus died for the sins of mankind, and by accepting him as Lord and savior, your sins are forgiven and you are saved.

Great fantasy fiction. Probably the equivalent of Marvel comic book stuff back in the day.

[brunumb]

We are having this conversation because the good ole "you just don't understand evolution" bit is the typical go-to line by evolutionists, and they can't resist appealing to it.

When it's the truth what else is there to say? Some people just can't handle the truth and have to stick their head in the sand.

[brunumb]

The ToE is, today, the best explanation for the data, the voluminous volume of voluminous data, we currently possess.

No it isn't. No it isn't. No it isn't.



If I can't see it happening, it can't happen.

[We_Are_VENOM]

Jesus died for the sins of mankind, and by accepting him as Lord and savior, your sins are forgiven and you are saved.

Great fantasy fiction. Probably the equivalent of Marvel comic book stuff back in the day.

No surprise you feel that way, because again..


1 Corin 1:18

"For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God."

[We_Are_VENOM]

We are having this conversation because the good ole "you just don't understand evolution" bit is the typical go-to line by evolutionists, and they can't resist appealing to it.

When it's the truth what else is there to say? Some people just can't handle the truth and have to stick their head in the sand.

The truth? I can handle the truth and accept it. You cant seem to handle and accept the truth.

And the truth is..

Jesus answered, "I am the way, the truth, and the life (John 14:6).

Now, get out there and find you some truth.

[We_Are_VENOM]

We understand that you have been presenting a Faith -based denialist position. The fact is that you don't understand evolution and won't even when we explain.

"You just don't understand evolution".

In others words..

"We (evolutionists) are so smart, while you (person who doesn't believe in evolution) are so dumb."

I mean, you guys' mind is so superior to mines, I don't even know how I got this far in the conversation.

*shrugs*.

For example, nobody decides that evolution has to work towards a particular end, Small (micro) advantages pile up and the advantage is pushed to its' limit.

The evidence shows that process takes time, and how much time. The evidence shows that it happens. to equate science, based on verified evidence, with religion, based on a case which is losing verified evidence (or at least gaps for God) all the time, is to take two different methods of processing data and pretend they are the same.

Hey we all have our beliefs, don't we.

[We_Are_VENOM]

Surely you've been on this site long enough to realize truth can't be put to that claim.

Not long enough, apparently. Who knows, if I live to be a couple hundred million years and the forum is still up and running strong, I may de-convert.

I mean, given enough time, anything can happen.

Please present confirmatory data to support this contention, but keep in mind, this section of the site doesn't consider the bible authoritative .

I dont need to use the Bible, I just simply go by my human intuition which is based upon my lifelong experiences of how the natural world works.

That, followed by what i view as insufficient evidence for the theory.

Plenty fair. Do you maybe have a better explanation for the data?

Sure. Intelligent Design.

The risk here is in the observer thinking we've got us a faulty ability to understand the data, and concludings therefrom.

I buy the third round, get that happy high, and buy the next eight, flirt with the waitress, who's boyfriend is the bartender, get in a fight history indicates I lose, end up spending the night in jail yet again, til pretty thing bonds me out, and the only thing I can do to get her to leave me be is to eat me a plate of them dang little green peas. I'm never drinking with y'all ever again these next few days while pretty thing's mad

There is always that one guy in the squad smh.

[benchwarmer]

"You just don't understand evolution".

In others words..

"We (evolutionists) are so smart, while you (person who doesn't believe in evolution) are so dumb."

I doesn't seem to matter how many times we tell you, but this is NOT it!!

It is NOT about who is smart or dumb. It is completely about representing the information correctly. We (most of us anyways) welcome opposing views and information. What doesn't fly is misrepresentation.

When you are told and shown that a theory says X and you keep repeating that is says Y, can you blame people for calling you out? It does not help your case at all.

I have far more respect for the opponent who clearly represents my position, and then provides a counter position that does not depend on misrepresentation of my position. i.e. if your case is strong, then just provide the support for it.

If you have data that does not fit in the ToE, just present it and explain how it doesn't fit. Only that will be a valid counter argument.

Honestly, I think you understand perfectly what evolution is all about, it's just that it doesn't comport with your faith so you must find a way to try and tear it down. Your current method is not convincing. I don't think you are dumb, just wrong and unwilling to at least engage the actual theory rather than what seems easier to defeat - a strawman of your own choosing.

[DrNoGods]

[Replying to We_Are_VENOM in post #222]

Christianity in decline = more room in heaven for me.

Does heaven have a square foot limit? Or does this depend on one's flavor of religion? I believe JWs put the target number of humans in heaven at 144,000. That would at least allow an estimate of the minimum space needed for them all to live heavenly lives. But what about other flavors of religion? My protestant upbringing gave no limit on the number of people who could occupy heaven ... literally any human that ever lived (since Christianity was invented anyway) could end up there by following the right rules. This would make it a very large place if it were occupied by physical bodies. Or is heaven just a place for souls which need no physical space?

If heaven is a physical space ... where is it, and how big is it?

[We_Are_VENOM]

Does heaven have a square foot limit?

Check Revelations for dimensions.

Or does this depend on one's flavor of religion? I believe JWs put the target number of humans in heaven at 144,000.

JWs and correct Biblical doctrine are always in conflict.

That would at least allow an estimate of the minimum space needed for them all to live heavenly lives. But what about other flavors of religion? My protestant upbringing gave no limit on the number of people who could occupy heaven ... literally any human that ever lived (since Christianity was invented anyway) could end up there by following the right rules. This would make it a very large place if it were occupied by physical bodies. Or is heaven just a place for souls which need no physical space?

If heaven is a physical space ... where is it, and how big is it?

Wow. You took what I said to places it didn't even have to go.