You Are No Longer You!

[POI]

If God selects you into His Kingdom of Heaven, you are no longer you. Why?

1) You will no longer sin in Heaven, as Heaven is a sinless environment. Hence, you must have a portion of your freewill stripped from you (in some capacity).
2) You will not mourn for any of your loved ones, which do not also make it into Heaven; as Heaven has no mourning, as it is Heaven after all.

Which begs a follow up question....

Whoever God chooses, He must change, in preparation for such a divine space/arena. Humans are deemed perpetual sinners. Thus, if God must change all, for whom He elects, why not just allow ALL into Heaven?

[JehovahsWitness]

The only way the claims stated here would be "relevant factual information" is if one considered an Ad Populum argument valid.

An argument ad populum is presented to affirm a position is TRUE because it it popular; however the question under discussion was not about whether the contents of the bible were true or not but whether there are any "reasons to believe" a particular supposition (in this case whether Jesus has sinned and has been expulsed from heaven).

So, we have no reason to believe that Jesus is still in heaven.

Of course seeing a reason somewhere is highly subjective (what one man sees as a reason to believe may be seen by another as pure lunacy) but that millions of people hold the contents of the bible as their reason for belief and openly testify to such, is a statement of fact. One cannot claim there is no reason when millions point to their reason. Whether the bible is true or said reason for believing are valid is another discussion; one on which I made no comment.


JW

[nobspeople]

would say there's no change needed. At least how you describe it. You see, humanity was perfect before the fall. The fall changed humanity into what it is today. So the change you describe isn't needed - the only change was 'back to the way it was before'. At least that's my best guess with what christians would counter.
Another tact I've heard is that, somehow, God will create a way for you to 'be yourself' while not wanting to or thinking about sinning. It must be nice to be able to claim something can do anything - even the things you don't yet know about or understand!

Just so I’m clear, are you suggesting that there is no free will in Heaven or that there is free will but there will be an absence of opportunity to sin? Obviously, Adam and Eve lived “back [the] way it was before” and still had the ability to commit the most severe sin in human history; so is heaven the Garden minus the Tree?

That question is best left to those that made the claim as it was something I was told, not something I believe to be accurate. But to me, it would see there is no free will - at least to come effect.

[TRANSPONDER]

The only way the claims stated here would be "relevant factual information" is if one considered an Ad Populum argument valid.

An argument ad populum is presented to affirm a position is TRUE because it it popular; however the question under discussion was not about whether the contents of the bible were true or not but whether there are any "reasons to believe" a particular supposition (in this case whether Jesus has sinned and has been expulsed from heaven).

So, we have no reason to believe that Jesus is still in heaven.

Of course seeing a reason somewhere is highly subjective (what one man sees as a reason to believe may be seen by another as pure lunacy) but that millions of people hold the contents of the bible as their reason for belief and openly testify to such, is a statement of fact. One cannot claim there is no reason when millions point to their reason. Whether the bible is true or said reason for believing are valid is another discussion; one on which I made no comment.


JW

"...millions of people hold the contents of the bible as their reason for belief and openly testify to such, is a statement of fact. One cannot claim there is no reason when millions point to their reason.."

Now, that is an 'ad populum' argument. Millions of people believe the Quran, Bhagavad gita or Tripitaka. That has no bearing on reasons to believe that any of them are true. And of course there is a great difference for people having reasons to believe and people having Good reasons to believe.

[1213]

...
Personally I'll opt for oblivion,...

Many atheists say so. Does it then mean that hell is actually ok, just what the people want and not a problem?

[TRANSPONDER]

it means that (from what I've seen) like me, atheists do not credit hellthreat. We expect nothing after we die and we are ok with that. Yo may have seen a post or two of mine where I argue that the promise of heaven isn't anything to credit, either..