Let's assume the God of the Bible exists. Taking aside that he has named himself God, why is he God?
What makes an entity God?
And if this entity exists, why worship him?
Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Moderator: Moderators
- Purple Knight
- Prodigy
- Posts: 3514
- Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:00 pm
- Has thanked: 1139 times
- Been thanked: 733 times
- Mithrae
- Prodigy
- Posts: 4304
- Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 7:33 am
- Location: Australia
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 190 times
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #31Just wanted to say thanks for posting that video - after watching a few dozen of their videos I can safely say it's one of the best channels I've found in many moons. Anyone who hasn't checked out the link yet, or looked but didn't like the alien hypothesizing, highly recommended to have a look at some of their other contentDiagoras wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 7:50 pm A god demonstrating omnipotence (or even 'power disproportionately greater than I could imagine') to me would quite likely see me attributing reverent honour to them. However, there's another way of looking at an omnipotent creator when you consider the Kardashev Scale.
- The Nice Centurion
- Sage
- Posts: 950
- Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2022 12:47 pm
- Has thanked: 19 times
- Been thanked: 98 times
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #32The god of the Bible is not the god of mainsteam christianity!Purple Knight wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 3:08 pm Let's assume the God of the Bible exists. Taking aside that he has named himself God, why is he God?
As stated several times in this forum, the Bible (OT) preaches a badly hidden polytheistic view, with the main character god grasping for stars, while living in constant fear of iron. (Therefore Iron Man could punch him with more ease than he punches the Melter or the Living Laser!)
So the god of the bible existing wouldnt be "God",but one bad mooded fearful god among many other gods.
Questions obsolete after I gave my above answer!Purple Knight wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 3:08 pm What makes an entity God?
And if this entity exists, why worship him?
“If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. But if you drown a man in a fish pond, he will never have to go hungry again”
"Only Experts in Reformed Egyptian should be allowed to critique the Book of Mormon"
"Joseph Smith can't possibly have been a deceiver.
For if he had been, the Angel Moroni never would have taken the risk of enthrusting him with the Golden Plates"
"Only Experts in Reformed Egyptian should be allowed to critique the Book of Mormon"
"Joseph Smith can't possibly have been a deceiver.
For if he had been, the Angel Moroni never would have taken the risk of enthrusting him with the Golden Plates"
- JehovahsWitness
- Savant
- Posts: 21142
- Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
- Has thanked: 794 times
- Been thanked: 1129 times
- Contact:
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #33The Creator of life has the right to be worshipped as such; if he proved to be despicable but left us a choice then I'd refrain. If He left us no choice.... the question is redundant.Purple Knight wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:08 pmSo if Lucifer was omnipotent and created the universe instead, you'd worship him instead?JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 5:32 pm The Hebrew Word "God" means "powerful one" ; if there is an omnipotent creator, He is God by definition of his omnipotence. Its like calling a black cat a black cat ... if its black and its a cat then it become less an appellation so much as a statement of fact.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
- JehovahsWitness
- Savant
- Posts: 21142
- Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
- Has thanked: 794 times
- Been thanked: 1129 times
- Contact:
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #34JAH is just a shorterned form of the name (JAH)ovah ... the name of God in the bible. Whether people are referring to the God identified by both terms in the bible... depends on what they believe about Him.
* the letter "J" ...is a 15th century English invention)
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
- JehovahsWitness
- Savant
- Posts: 21142
- Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
- Has thanked: 794 times
- Been thanked: 1129 times
- Contact:
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #35Evil is the total lack of goodness not the total lack of intelligence. It would indeed be counterproductive to be cruel to those you want on your side, so he isnt; at least while it suits his purpose not to be.Purple Knight wrote: ↑Mon Oct 04, 2021 4:12 pm
Good is pure. Evil is inherently impure. If the Devil was always cruel, he couldn't lead a rebellion as his underlings would quickly grow to hate someone who was always cruel to them. He couldn't tempt people with things that provided pleasure, faced with a restriction that he never be nice to anyone for any reason.
Satan can lead a rebellion by pretending to be good and appealing to the selfish desires of others. He is not interested in love (because love is the very antithesis of what he is) but he knows its power and goes for the closest thing, infatuation. Satan can inspire infatuation and awe by his power, intelligence and beauty and like any cult leader, this leads to loyalty beyond reason which is good enough for him.2 CORINTHIANS 11:13-15
For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness
Purple Knight wrote: ↑Mon Oct 04, 2021 4:12 pm He couldn't tempt people with things that provided pleasure...
Biblically, this is about as false a statement as could ever be uttered.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
- Willum
- Savant
- Posts: 9017
- Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
- Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
- Has thanked: 35 times
- Been thanked: 82 times
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #36[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #2]
Fact check.
Kindly show a reference that Hebrew for god is powerful one.
When you do that, be prepared for me to show you the actual word, and background.
Fact check.
Kindly show a reference that Hebrew for god is powerful one.
When you do that, be prepared for me to show you the actual word, and background.
I will never understand how someone who claims to know the ultimate truth, of God, believes they deserve respect, when they cannot distinguish it from a fairy-tale.
You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.
To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight
You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.
To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight
- JehovahsWitness
- Savant
- Posts: 21142
- Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
- Has thanked: 794 times
- Been thanked: 1129 times
- Contact:
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #37I am of course, like most of the other participants in this thread, presenting facts according to the biblical narrative since the OP requested comment on the assumption of the above.Willum wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 3:24 pm [Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #2]
Fact check.
Kindly show a reference that Hebrew for god is powerful one.
Are you asking for a scriptural reference?
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
- Difflugia
- Prodigy
- Posts: 3046
- Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:25 am
- Location: Michigan
- Has thanked: 3276 times
- Been thanked: 2023 times
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #38JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 5:32 pmThe Hebrew Word "God" means "powerful one" ; if there is an omnipotent creator, He is God by defintion of his omnipotence. Its like calling a black cat a black cat ... if its black and its a cat then it become less an appellation so much as a statement of fact.
So the etymology's in the Bible. Fine. Where?JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 4:25 pmI am of course, like most of the other participants in this thread, presenting facts according to the biblical narrative since the OP requested comment on the assumption of the above.
My pronouns are he, him, and his.
- Purple Knight
- Prodigy
- Posts: 3514
- Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:00 pm
- Has thanked: 1139 times
- Been thanked: 733 times
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #39That's my point. The Devil cannot always be cruel. He must know what kindness is because you show a picture of him offering bread. (I... think it's bread.) It may be for a larger nefarious purpose, and in this case it is, but taken by itself, it is a good act to offer a starving man bread. The Devil is therefore capable of good acts and at any time might commit them. He's not pure evil.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:33 pmEvil is the total lack of goodness not the total lack of intelligence. It would indeed be counterproductive to be cruel to those you want on your side, so he isnt; at least while it suits his purpose not to be.
So maybe the Devil did create life somewhere. Maybe he has a pocket universe... and maybe this is it. Maybe the people outside Eden who Cain went out and mated with were created by the Devil. Some people think white people were essentially created by the devil.
Yakub died at the age of 152, but his followers carried on his work. After 600 years of this deliberate eugenics, the white race was created. The brutal conditions of their creation determined the evil nature of the new race: "by lying to the black mother of the baby, this lie was born into the very nature of the white baby; and, murder for the black people was also born in them—or made by nature a liar and murderer".
The relevant part of this tale to this discussion is how these devil's children are written off as evil because it's their nature, almost conceding that it is even right for them to follow that nature which is a part of their creation. They can't help it. They're just going to do how they do. They were made that way.
I say that this attitude is confusing people with moths. People have intelligence, conscience, and according to the Bible, free will. That makes people special. We can do what a moth cannot. We, even if made to bash our heads into that light bulb endlessly, can in fact decide to stop. If some or all of us were made by the Devil or some evil figure, we can choose to be righteous instead.
...And that gives us the obligation to. Don't you think?
In that case you're saying that if there was some great follower of the Devil's, who could help the Devil's cause beyond measure, and this follower was about to die and Satan endured some great risk or pain to save him, well, that's just not real love. You'd be in a pinch there, because while this is certainly not unconditional love, this is also how God behaves, helping those who help him and hurting those who hurt him.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:33 pmSatan can lead a rebellion by pretending to be good and appealing to the selfish desires of others. He is not interested in love (because love is the very antithesis of what he is) but he knows its power and goes for the closest thing, infatuation. Satan can inspire infatuation and awe by his power, intelligence and beauty and like any cult leader, this leads to loyalty beyond reason which is good enough for him.
You're faced with saying at this point, well, God actually loves everybody anyway despite his behaviour toward them and the Devil doesn't really love the person he took great pains to save. It disconnects love almost entirely from any act one might ever do that helps or hurts somebody and makes love almost meaningless. I say almost because you still have God's ultimate goal being people saved, and the Devil's goal being antithetical to that - he wants people to not be saved.
- JehovahsWitness
- Savant
- Posts: 21142
- Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:03 am
- Has thanked: 794 times
- Been thanked: 1129 times
- Contact:
Re: Alright, Jehovah Exists - Why Worship Him?
Post #40I disagree; he can always be cruel, he just doesnt always have to appear to be cruel. A pedophile can give a child you candy or help it with its homework, but if the act is in preparation for a rape it is cruel, it ks not a good act its a lying, manipulative act.Purple Knight wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 4:53 pmThat's my point. The Devil cannot always be cruel.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:33 pmEvil is the total lack of goodness not the total lack of intelligence. It would indeed be counterproductive to be cruel to those you want on your side, so he isnt; at least while it suits his purpose not to be.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8