What do you think is the most important historical 'miracle' in the bible and why?
Some example to consider:
Virgin birth
Raising of Lazarus
Feeding with the bread and fishes
Burning bush
Global flood
Resurrection
Various physical healings (deaf mute, blind men, sick woman, etc)
Have you had a miracle you'd care to share? If not, why do you think you haven't?
The most important miracle
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #2I think they are equally important.nobspeople wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 8:14 am What do you think is the most important historical 'miracle' in the bible and why?
Some example to consider:
Virgin birth
Raising of Lazarus
Feeding with the bread and fishes
Burning bush
Global flood
Resurrection
Various physical healings (deaf mute, blind men, sick woman, etc)
I think life is a miracle.
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #3I see no doubt about that. The Resurrection is the most important miracle, what Jesus was all about and the basis of Christianity. If that didn't happen, Christianity collapses (in any meaningful sense, though the believers would still keep it going as an End in itself). After that, I'd say the virgin birth (the whole divine at conception -thing). Third..I don't know it's like, after iconic Bach and Beethoven (1)...after that, please yourself. OT stuff? After the Creation everything else is diluted beer.
(1) or, if you prefer, Elvis and then the Beatles; after that, please yourself.
(1) or, if you prefer, Elvis and then the Beatles; after that, please yourself.
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #4P.s sorry. I just picked that up. Yes, I do have a miracle. In fact Four miracles. Three illnesses magically cleared up, one that embarrassing as it cleared up just as the doc. came to look at me (this was in the days when doctors actually did house calls). The other, major, biggest and most amazing miracle was financial upon which my life, future and marriage plans depended, and it fell out of the sky.
Of course I was not praying and was an atheist (lifetimer), so you - all tell me, folks, just how an atheist who never prayed got his prayers answered?
Of course I was not praying and was an atheist (lifetimer), so you - all tell me, folks, just how an atheist who never prayed got his prayers answered?
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #5I think people can make a miracle a miracle or not. In other words, it's hard to pinpoint what, exactly, is a miracle in this day and age. We don't see people raising from the dead, or global floods or many things that would trigger a 'yeah, that's a miracle' like you'd see in bible times. But many things - small things - some consider miracles. I wonder if that dilutes the meaning of the word?TRANSPONDER wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:36 am P.s sorry. I just picked that up. Yes, I do have a miracle. In fact Four miracles. Three illnesses magically cleared up, one that embarrassing as it cleared up just as the doc. came to look at me (this was in the days when doctors actually did house calls). The other, major, biggest and most amazing miracle was financial upon which my life, future and marriage plans depended, and it fell out of the sky.
Of course I was not praying and was an atheist (lifetimer), so you - all tell me, folks, just how an atheist who never prayed got his prayers answered?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #6I think it does. We've all heard 'God helped me find my car -keys', and crediting God for a recovery after five doctors and ten hours of surgery. or one person saves with another fifty dead in a collapsed mine. Or (as in kissing Hank's ass) 'maybe you'll get a raise, or you'll win the lotto or just find a $20 bill on the street.' 'What's that got to do with Hank?' 'Hank has....certain connections..'.
But significant coincidences (good or bad) enable believers to claim convincing miracles. But as I said above - such things happen to atheists, too and if they aren't miracles, why should the ones that happen to believers be? I can already hear the answer, but the point is, if it would be the same if there was no God, why should we think there is? Back to personal convictions and Faith.
But significant coincidences (good or bad) enable believers to claim convincing miracles. But as I said above - such things happen to atheists, too and if they aren't miracles, why should the ones that happen to believers be? I can already hear the answer, but the point is, if it would be the same if there was no God, why should we think there is? Back to personal convictions and Faith.
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #7This is true, but usually what we see is rare events on one end of the probability spectrum being lauded as "miracles." For instance, if someone has a serious illness that is often fatal and yet they survive, believers may be inclined to claim a miracle has occurred. It is much less likely that a death from say a common cold or some other generally survivable illness will be presented as a miracle.TRANSPONDER wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 4:56 pm But significant coincidences (good or bad) enable believers to claim convincing miracles.
Neither is a miracle, but rather an unusual circumstance where one end or the other of the probability scale occurs.
Tcg
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #8You make a good point. Miracles only seem to be associated with positive outcomes. Is that because the term automatically implies spme benign, divine intervention? If a plane crashes and 99 people survive while one is killed, the miracle is seen as the 99 survivors rather than the one that died.
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Voltaire: "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Gender ideology is anti-science, anti truth.
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #9Makes one wonder if there isn't a Miracle Scale of some sort.brunumb wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 8:46 pmYou make a good point. Miracles only seem to be associated with positive outcomes. Is that because the term automatically implies spme benign, divine intervention? If a plane crashes and 99 people survive while one is killed, the miracle is seen as the 99 survivors rather than the one that died.
1-9 survivors : ... a miracle
10-19 survivors : pretty much a miracle
20-59 survivors : not so much a miracle
60-79 survivors : hardly a miracle at all
80-99 survivors : not really a miracle
10-19 survivors : pretty much a miracle
20-59 survivors : not so much a miracle
60-79 survivors : hardly a miracle at all
80-99 survivors : not really a miracle
Or is it:
1-9 survivors :.... a miracle
10-19 survivors : a miracle
20-59 survivors : a miracle
60-79 survivors : a miracle
80-99 survivors : a miracle
10-19 survivors : a miracle
20-59 survivors : a miracle
60-79 survivors : a miracle
80-99 survivors : a miracle
And of course from an individual point of view, no matter how many survivors there are, any survivor will likely look at their good fortune as a "miracle."
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Re: The most important miracle
Post #10The most important miracle of the bible is that so many fell for it.
Evidence here is the modern insurgence of the Christian Taliban throughout various parts of the US. We see now, female reproductive rights, female health rights, are subject to the whims of the citizen, who can sue the female, simply cause she had to do her some female decisioning.
I can fetch me off to Texas, rape me a woman, getting her all pregnant and all, and turn around and sue her for aborting our "God given" offspring.
Christianity, at least as legislated in the US, is a vile, cruel example of humans trying to infect others with goofy ideas. And now they have the Supreme Court in their pocket.
Evidence here is the modern insurgence of the Christian Taliban throughout various parts of the US. We see now, female reproductive rights, female health rights, are subject to the whims of the citizen, who can sue the female, simply cause she had to do her some female decisioning.
I can fetch me off to Texas, rape me a woman, getting her all pregnant and all, and turn around and sue her for aborting our "God given" offspring.
Christianity, at least as legislated in the US, is a vile, cruel example of humans trying to infect others with goofy ideas. And now they have the Supreme Court in their pocket.
I might be Teddy Roosevelt, but I ain't.
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