Another upstanding church member is caught - again (shocker)

[nobspeople]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/lead-pastor- ... 00746.html

From the article:
“As followers of Christ, we must remember that redemption, salvation, grace, mercy and healing are all gifts given to the children of God. Although everyone must address their own convictions and consequences, our assignment as believers is not to condemn, but to be agents of God’s love, healing, justice, and reconciliation.”

As of now, their website still (seemingly proudly) features the accused (though it also has a legal disclaimer as well):
https://www.rockchurch.org/

It's not as if 'someone said he said' here; he was caught by the police directly. So while he's not 'legally guilty', he wasn't likely going there to 'convert a girl from her sinful and harmful ways'.

At what point should a church cease promoting someone caught in the act of sin and or doing an illegal act? Should the church cut ties as soon as they know what's happening, or should they wait until found guilty by the justice system?
Or should they do nothing at all? Everyone sins, right?

[POI]

Everyone sins, right?

Bingo, everyone sins This is why the run-o-da-mill Christian can simply argue 'grace'. (i.e.) "We are all sinners. God hates all sin. Let thee who has not committed any sin cast the first stone." You know, that whole chestnut

[Aetixintro]

[Replying to POI in post #2]

Again, there is a difference between petty theft and torture and murder (torture to death, animal or child). Some sins are paid for by a teaching lesson of the Purgatory while other sins qualify for Hell, straight!

To say we all sin isn't to say I am or anybody else is the same as the most awful criminal (torturer, etc). The Bible tells a story of responsibility toward God so that we do not become haters and idiots.

Jesus says to the rich, young man that he must keep the (10) Commandments to gain eternal life and I think this is most wise. We are certainly not perfect, that much is well understood.
(Mark 10:17-20.)

[1213]

...
At what point should a church cease promoting someone caught in the act of sin and or doing an illegal act? Should the church cut ties as soon as they know what's happening, or should they wait until found guilty by the justice system?
Or should they do nothing at all? Everyone sins, right?

I don't think people should obey me, but I think it is usually good to wait what is the judgment, before deciding. However, if there is really enough evidence for wrong doing, I don't think there would be any reason to continue to have him in some high position.

The overseer therefore must be without reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, sensible, modest, hospitable, good at teaching;
1 Tim. 2:3

[nobspeople]

Everyone sins, right?

Bingo, everyone sins This is why the run-o-da-mill Christian can simply argue 'grace'. (i.e.) "We are all sinners. God hates all sin. Let thee who has not committed any sin cast the first stone." You know, that whole chestnut

Agreed. But, IYO, when should the church distance itself from the accused? Or should they not - stand by them through thick-n-thin?

[POI]

Everyone sins, right?

Bingo, everyone sins This is why the run-o-da-mill Christian can simply argue 'grace'. (i.e.) "We are all sinners. God hates all sin. Let thee who has not committed any sin cast the first stone." You know, that whole chestnut

Agreed. But, IYO, when should the church distance itself from the accused? Or should they not - stand by them through thick-n-thin?

The 'beauty' about this particular religion, is that whatever decision these Christians make, they can back it up with Bible Verse(s). They can either forgive 'true repentance' (or) cast him away regardless of remorse/repent. I haven't vested much time on this particular scenario, but I'm willing to bet that if they stand behind him, it's because --- (in part or in full) the 'church' has deemed him remorseful. And if God can forgive him then so can they

[POI]

[Replying to POI in post #2]

Again, there is a difference between petty theft and torture and murder (torture to death, animal or child). Some sins are paid for by a teaching lesson of the Purgatory while other sins qualify for Hell, straight!

Not so fast You seem to be making 'objective' evaluations about 'morality'.?.?.?

You state 'theft' is lesser than 'torture'. And yet, theft is listed as one of the top 10 Commandments, while torture is not.

... To my understanding, the only sin which truly leads one straight to hell is the topic of disbelief and/or not repenting.

To say we all sin isn't to say I am or anybody else is the same as the most awful criminal (torturer, etc). The Bible tells a story of responsibility toward God so that we do not become haters and idiots.

Jesus tells people, "that which has not committed any sin can cast the first stone." Jesus hates all sin. Jesus deems all sinners. Isn't this why He felt He needed to clone himself (i.e. Jesus), send the clone (Jesus) to earth, and then have the clone (Jesus) sacrifice himself to the one who cloned Him (YHWH)? He did this for all humanity, not just some. At least, this is the story line you are instructed to believe. Hence, "your deeds are all 'filthy rags' to God." You know, etc etc etc....

Jesus says to the rich, young man that he must keep the (10) Commandments to gain eternal life and I think this is most wise. We are certainly not perfect, that much is well understood.
(Mark 10:17-20.)

Speaking of the 'rich', could God deem YOU 'rich'??? I mean, you at least have an electronic device to respond in this forum. And who knows what else you own? It's safe to say many have much less than you.

[Tcg]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/lead-pastor- ... 00746.html

From the article:
“As followers of Christ, we must remember that redemption, salvation, grace, mercy and healing are all gifts given to the children of God. Although everyone must address their own convictions and consequences, our assignment as believers is not to condemn, but to be agents of God’s love, healing, justice, and reconciliation.”

As of now, their website still (seemingly proudly) features the accused (though it also has a legal disclaimer as well):
https://www.rockchurch.org/

It's not as if 'someone said he said' here; he was caught by the police directly. So while he's not 'legally guilty', he wasn't likely going there to 'convert a girl from her sinful and harmful ways'.

At what point should a church cease promoting someone caught in the act of sin and or doing an illegal act? Should the church cut ties as soon as they know what's happening, or should they wait until found guilty by the justice system?
Or should they do nothing at all? Everyone sins, right?

If the pastor is charismatic enough and the congregation concludes they are "anointed by the Lord", their sins are much easier to forgive. Just put on a show of remorse and all is good:



Of course if it's just some dude from the church, he'll get the cold shoulder and realize it's time to move on to another church where he'll be received with open arms.


Tcg

[brunumb]

If the pastor is charismatic enough and the congregation concludes they are "anointed by the Lord", their sins are much easier to forgive. Just put on a show of remorse and all is good:

In my opinion, the only remorseful sinners are the ones who get caught and even then it is just a put on show in an effort to maintain their standing in the community.

[Tcg]

If the pastor is charismatic enough and the congregation concludes they are "anointed by the Lord", their sins are much easier to forgive. Just put on a show of remorse and all is good:

In my opinion, the only remorseful sinners are the ones who get caught and even then it is just a put on show in an effort to maintain their standing in the community.

And in the case of professional pastors, not only is their standing at stake, but also their livelihood. It's easy to get real remorseful when one's paycheck depends on it. Of course after the heat is off, remorse no longer serves a purpose. One gets their check and it's back to business as usual.


Tcg