Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

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Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #1

Post by Avoice »

Your belief and truth of Christianity is said by the NT writers to be upheld by the Hebrew Scriptures.

Yet when you defend your faith you turn to King James or the Septugiant to support the claims if the NT.

The NT writers KNEW the Hebrew Scriptures was the highest authority by which all claims must be tested.

The NT writers convinced billions of people by claiming it's doctrine is supported by the Hebrew Scriptures. Yet when it comes to showing that proof you won't go to the Hebrew. You use a translation. And have the audacity to say the Greek Septugiant is the authority. The truth you claim to have you say is upheld by highest authority - Hebrew Scriptures. But when you have to prove it you cheat

Aren't you angry at the NT writers making you have to cheat in order to make their claims appear valid? Aren't you embarrassed that your truth will fail if forced to be seen in the light of the Hebrew Scriptures? That even right now you will be forced into giving a torcherous explaination even though no explaination you could give will ever give anything other than the Hebrew the authority to determine the truth.

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #21

Post by Clownboat »

1213 wrote:The reason for me to think Jesus is the Messiah is that the people that were with Jesus thought he was the Messiah.
Muhammad had people with him that thought he was a prophet of Allah. Your reasoning is flawed. Arriving at a belief due to such flawed reasoning boggles the mind.

How bad to you want to go to heaven? How bad to you fear going to hell? Bad enough to believe animals can talk? Only if others also think such a thing! (Same reasoning as above) :shock:

Are you sure there is no embarresment? No ragrets at all? Not even one letter? :D
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU

It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco

If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #22

Post by Difflugia »

1213 wrote: Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:41 amBut, I also know that for example the translation of Old Testament that I use normally doesn't even have the word "Messiah" in it. I don't think there is direct words in modern Old Testament that says, Messiah will come in future and be like... ...there are only indirect references that some people think fits to Jesus.
Daniel 9:25-27. Most Bible translations render it "the Anointed" or "the Anointed One," but those are the only references in the Tanakh that unambiguously refer to the Messiah by that title in a somewhat distant future.

Isaiah and Jeremiah contain prophecies that were the original inspirations for later messianic expectations that led to Daniel, but both books include failed prophecies as well, so they already require a bit of a selection process.
1213 wrote: Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:41 amSome think they don't fit, which is why all ancient prophesies are problematic, because person can always interpret it to mean something else by what he desires to be truth.
Christian theology in a nutshell.
My pronouns are he, him, and his.

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #23

Post by Goat »

1213 wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 1:20 pm
Avoice wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 10:44 am ... Aren't you embarrassed that your truth will fail if forced to be seen in the light of the Hebrew Scriptures? ...
Please show one example how the Hebrew scriptures would make "my truth" to fail?
God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind.
“What do you think science is? There is nothing magical about science. It is simply a systematic way for carefully and thoroughly observing nature and using consistent logic to evaluate results. So which part of that exactly do you disagree with? Do you disagree with being thorough? Using careful observation? Being systematic? Or using consistent logic?�

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #24

Post by 1213 »

Goat wrote: Thu Apr 28, 2022 11:47 pm
1213 wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 1:20 pm
Avoice wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 10:44 am ... Aren't you embarrassed that your truth will fail if forced to be seen in the light of the Hebrew Scriptures? ...
Please show one example how the Hebrew scriptures would make "my truth" to fail?
God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind.
What makes you think my truth is that God is a man? I don't think that Bible says that the one and only true God is a man. Biblical teaching is this:

For though there are things that are called "gods," whether in the heavens or on earth; as there are many "gods" and many "lords;" yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we live through him.
1 Corinthians 8:4-6

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #25

Post by 1213 »

Difflugia wrote: Thu Apr 28, 2022 3:26 pm Daniel 9:25-27. Most Bible translations render it "the Anointed" or "the Anointed One," but those are the only references in the Tanakh that unambiguously refer to the Messiah by that title in a somewhat distant future.
Thank you, I think that is a very good scripture about future Messiah.
Difflugia wrote: Thu Apr 28, 2022 3:26 pm Isaiah and Jeremiah contain prophecies that were the original inspirations for later messianic expectations that led to Daniel, but both books include failed prophecies as well, so they already require a bit of a selection process.
Please tell how have they failed?

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #26

Post by Goat »

1213 wrote: Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:36 am
Goat wrote: Thu Apr 28, 2022 11:47 pm
1213 wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 1:20 pm
Avoice wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 10:44 am ... Aren't you embarrassed that your truth will fail if forced to be seen in the light of the Hebrew Scriptures? ...
Please show one example how the Hebrew scriptures would make "my truth" to fail?
God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind.
What makes you think my truth is that God is a man? I don't think that Bible says that the one and only true God is a man. Biblical teaching is this:

For though there are things that are called "gods," whether in the heavens or on earth; as there are many "gods" and many "lords;" yet to us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and we live through him.
1 Corinthians 8:4-6

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5
So you do not believe that Jesus is God? Just trying to establish your axioms.
“What do you think science is? There is nothing magical about science. It is simply a systematic way for carefully and thoroughly observing nature and using consistent logic to evaluate results. So which part of that exactly do you disagree with? Do you disagree with being thorough? Using careful observation? Being systematic? Or using consistent logic?�

Steven Novella

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #27

Post by 1213 »

Goat wrote: Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:48 am So you do not believe that Jesus is God?
I believe what the Bible tells, and by it, Jesus is a man, not the one and only true God.

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #28

Post by Diogenes »

nobspeople wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 11:32 am
No they ain't. Their beliefs are solid (for the most part) and take years - decades - to change even one iota. Look around and see how many of them don't seem to know the different between the words 'know' and 'believe'!

They are content on their 'knowledge' that they are right and everyone else is wrong and hell bound (though some get giddy when they think others are going to hell based on my experience).

No they're not angry.
Or embarrassed.

They're 'blessed'.
And right. :dance: :roll:
:)

When they finally "get it" and realize most of them are Christians mainly because of childhood indoctrination and step out of the bondage of fantasy they were taught at an early age, then they are embarrassed or angry or both. ... and it has little to do with the reasons stated in post #1.

In the meantime, I think nobspeople nailed it. :)
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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #29

Post by TRANSPONDER »

1213 wrote: Sun May 01, 2022 4:32 am
Goat wrote: Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:48 am So you do not believe that Jesus is God?
I believe what the Bible tells, and by it, Jesus is a man, not the one and only true God.

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5
I don't believe it, but I read it.

John 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.

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Re: Christians: aren't you embarrassed and angry?

Post #30

Post by 1213 »

TRANSPONDER wrote: Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:49 pm
1213 wrote: Sun May 01, 2022 4:32 am
Goat wrote: Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:48 am So you do not believe that Jesus is God?
I believe what the Bible tells, and by it, Jesus is a man, not the one and only true God.

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5
I don't believe it, but I read it.

John 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.
Maybe it could be good to know that according to the Bible, Jesus is the image of God. So, obviously, if you have seen the image of God, you have seen also God?

...is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. ...
Colossians 1:14-16

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