If you don't follow a/the Church...

Argue for and against Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
Willum
Savant
Posts: 9017
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 82 times

If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #1

Post by Willum »

If you claim to believe in the Christian god, but do not follow or believe in the practices of any church, and have your own unique perspective of this God, how can you distinguish this from a god you have simply made up?

In other words, how can you know your beliefs about God are better than a churches?
In other words, how do you know, of all the perspectives and interpretations of God, your's are correct? Or that God is what you have imagined?
And if not, how do you justify inventing or imagining a God in defiance of the certainly greater wisdom of a congregation?

If you are wrong, is it not CERTAINLY blasphemy to invent details of God you have no basis for believing are true?

User avatar
Willum
Savant
Posts: 9017
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #41

Post by Willum »

Not a thing.
You have convinced me.
Good talk.

User avatar
Willum
Savant
Posts: 9017
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #42

Post by Willum »

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #20]

What remains curious to you, has answered all my possible questions.
As stated, good talk.

User avatar
Willum
Savant
Posts: 9017
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #43

Post by Willum »

tam wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:26 pm
Willum wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:24 pm [Replying to tam in post #35]

Your evasion of both questions had convinced me definitively of your faith.
Good talk.
What are you talking about? I answered both of your questions.

Peace again.
Sorry, I was not explicit.
Myself and others pointed out contradictions, and these did not phase you at all.
You exasperated us with your inability to grasp the contradictions, leading us to definitive conclusions.

User avatar
1213
Savant
Posts: 11333
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:06 am
Location: Finland
Has thanked: 312 times
Been thanked: 357 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #44

Post by 1213 »

Willum wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:24 pm If you claim to believe in the Christian god, but do not follow or believe in the practices of any church, and have your own unique perspective of this God, how can you distinguish this from a god you have simply made up?
...
I distinguish them by looking what the Bible tells. If Church says something that is in contradiction with the Bible, I reject it.

User avatar
Willum
Savant
Posts: 9017
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #45

Post by Willum »

1213 wrote: Tue Apr 26, 2022 8:03 am
Willum wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:24 pm If you claim to believe in the Christian god, but do not follow or believe in the practices of any church, and have your own unique perspective of this God, how can you distinguish this from a god you have simply made up?
...
I distinguish them by looking what the Bible tells. If Church says something that is in contradiction with the Bible, I reject it.
I am sorry, but how do you know it is only your limited scope that tells you the church contradicts the Bible?

Your PERSONAL opinion, even from your own perspective, must allow you to acknowledge you are more likely to be wrong than a congregation.

nobspeople
Prodigy
Posts: 3187
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2020 11:32 am
Has thanked: 1510 times
Been thanked: 824 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #46

Post by nobspeople »

Willum wrote: Tue Apr 26, 2022 6:49 am
tam wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:26 pm
Willum wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:24 pm [Replying to tam in post #35]

Your evasion of both questions had convinced me definitively of your faith.
Good talk.
What are you talking about? I answered both of your questions.

Peace again.
Sorry, I was not explicit.
Myself and others pointed out contradictions, and these did not phase you at all.
You exasperated us with your inability to grasp the contradictions, leading us to definitive conclusions.
I don't think 'inability' is the correct term. Maybe disregarding would be more apt? It's nothing new within christianity: disregard what you don't agree with and latch on to what you do, then pontificate about it ad nauseam. People can't be fully faulted for this - it's what's taught to them through indoctrination. Hopefully, that wasn't a 'blanket statement'.
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

User avatar
tam
Savant
Posts: 6443
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:59 pm
Has thanked: 353 times
Been thanked: 324 times
Contact:

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #47

Post by tam »

Peace to you,
Willum wrote: Tue Apr 26, 2022 6:49 am
tam wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:26 pm
Willum wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 9:24 pm [Replying to tam in post #35]

Your evasion of both questions had convinced me definitively of your faith.
Good talk.
What are you talking about? I answered both of your questions.

Peace again.
Sorry, I was not explicit.
Myself and others pointed out contradictions, and these did not phase you at all.
You exasperated us with your inability to grasp the contradictions, leading us to definitive conclusions.
Please name these contradictions that you claim you and others pointed out.

All I have seen are people demanding support for the things I said (which support was given) and then leaving (or veering off into some new tactic) when that same request was made of them and their claims. Please note that I questioned you on your claims as well, and those questions have gone ignored and unanswered:

viewtopic.php?p=1075853#p1075853


Looking back through the thread, the following is something I find absurd:
Willum wrote: Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:17 pm I find I rather agree with Eloi, when he wrote:
You are quoting Jesus pretending to find the freedom to practice your own invented way to serve your own god,
It seems the most consistent with your context.

Please note that there was absolutely no evidence offered for the accusation that you decided to agree with. And though this may not apply to someone who does not profess to be Christian, for someone who does profess to be Christian, to admit that Christ is indeed being quoted, but then dismissing His words... that is something I find absurd (and sad).


You (and others) being unable to understand how I (and others) can know Christ and so also His Father... <- this is not a contradiction. It is just a lack of understanding and/or a lack of faith from those who do not think a person can truly know Christ, so as to truly know His Father as well. And a person can test the inspired expressions: against Christ (if indeed one can hear His voice, ASK Him for the truth of a matter, and ask for ears to hear if you want to hear His voice so as to hear the truth), against love (God is love and nothing from Him will be against love), and one can also look to what is written if one needs to SEE it (beginning with what Christ has said in what is written, since He is the One to whom God told us to listen).



Peace again to you, and to you all,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy
- Non-religious Christian spirituality

- For Christ (who is the Spirit)

User avatar
Willum
Savant
Posts: 9017
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2014 2:14 pm
Location: Yahweh's Burial Place
Has thanked: 35 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #48

Post by Willum »

Obviously someone like you could make such a claim.
But also someone of a different denomination.
And also someone who was insane, could make the same claims.

No outside observer will be able to tell the difference.

User avatar
Clownboat
Savant
Posts: 9340
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 3:42 pm
Has thanked: 882 times
Been thanked: 1240 times

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #49

Post by Clownboat »

Willum wrote: Tue Apr 26, 2022 3:18 pm Obviously someone like you could make such a claim.
But also someone of a different denomination.
And also someone who was insane, could make the same claims.

No outside observer will be able to tell the difference.
I don't care! I'm still right and I'm not even going to let your words sink in! Nah nah nah boo boo!
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU

It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco

If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb

User avatar
tam
Savant
Posts: 6443
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:59 pm
Has thanked: 353 times
Been thanked: 324 times
Contact:

Re: If you don't follow a/the Church...

Post #50

Post by tam »

Peace to you.
Willum wrote: Tue Apr 26, 2022 3:18 pm Obviously someone like you could make such a claim.
But also someone of a different denomination.
And also someone who was insane, could make the same claims.

No outside observer will be able to tell the difference.
Willum, you did not ask 'how can an outside observer know'. In your op, you asked a series of 'how can YOU know' questions.

That is what I answered.

Peace again to you.
- Non-religious Christian spirituality

- For Christ (who is the Spirit)

Post Reply