Ark of the covenant

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nobspeople
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Ark of the covenant

Post #1

Post by nobspeople »

What is it? Some say it's an alien artifact that emits radiation, some say it's something god made.

Where is it? Some say it's in Ethiopia, some say it's in Utah, some say it's under the dome of the rock.

Why did god create it (assuming it did)? Some say it doesn't exist, some say it has something to do with god and its demanding of worship.

For discussion:
What do you think the AOTC is? Where do you think it is located today? What do you think it's for?

What else about it would you like to know?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Miles
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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #2

Post by Miles »

nobspeople wrote: Fri Apr 29, 2022 9:32 am What is it? Some say it's an alien artifact that emits radiation, some say it's something god made.

Where is it? Some say it's in Ethiopia, some say it's in Utah, some say it's under the dome of the rock.
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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #3

Post by TRANSPONDER »

If I had to risk my bank - account on it, I'd say it was a Hebrew version of the sort of tribal religious Icon that other nations had (I suspect they carried them into war on a litter) and put it in a Temple inspired by the temples that other nations had.

I doubt that they put one together during the exodus, not least because I don't believe the Exodus, but I rather see the ritual minutiae as relating to Temple rites later on, rather than some complex procedure to be observed while struggling acrodss the desert lugging this thing.

Whatever it was, it was simply a bit of Temple gadgetry and nothing stopped the Romans from taking all the divine mcguffins to Rome in a Triumphal procession.

Of course this gave the Christians the perfect cue to claim that this disaster (for the Jews) only happened because they rejected Jesus. Indeed the Prophetic utterances are reflected in the post War Jewish story of Rabbi Akiva proclaiming a prophecy of the destruction of the Temple, though just why YHWH was doing it to them is skipped over, rather.

So, conspiracy theories without an atom of support aside, the Ark was taken to Rome and nobody knows what happened to it. If it was kept for the Emperor to gloat over, rather than being melted down to bolster the national bank, we can assume some Vandal or Goth made off with it into Gaul or Swabia and it's buried there. You won't find it in Ethiopia. Unless there's a story of some previous Ark being taken there and a replica made for 2nd Temple use.

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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #4

Post by Difflugia »

TRANSPONDER wrote: Sat Apr 30, 2022 6:53 amIf I had to risk my bank - account on it, I'd say it was a Hebrew version of the sort of tribal religious Icon that other nations had (I suspect they carried them into war on a litter) and put it in a Temple inspired by the temples that other nations had.
If the Documentary Hypothesis is reasonably correct, then J only mentions the ark twice (Numbers 10:33 and 14:44). E never mentions it. If it was real, then, it was probably something Judah had, but not Israel. Most of the details, though, were invented later by the Deuteronomist and Priestly source.
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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #5

Post by JehovahsWitness »

The Ark of the Convenant was according to the bible, one of the sacred objects in Solomons temple. It went missing presumably with the destruction of the temple in the 5th century BCE and there is no mention of it in the Hebrew scriptures after the Babylonian exile.

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JEREMIAH 6: 16

No more will they say, ‘The ark of the covenant of Jehovah!’ It will not come up into the heart, nor will they remember it or miss it, and it will not be made again.
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"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

nobspeople
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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #6

Post by nobspeople »

To add to the topic:

What exactly is the AOTC?
What's its use?
What's inside?
Why did god have it designed this way?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #7

Post by JehovahsWitness »

nobspeople wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 8:03 am To add to the topic:

What exactly is the AOTC?
What's its use?
What's inside?
Why did god have it designed this way?
Well to get the full picture its best to read the account in the bible but basically it was a golden chest (a box) with carrying poles. It was reportedly commissioned by Moses after the Israelites were freed from Egypt.

What's its use? It wasnt really used for anything per se. It was a religious "relic", something that had religious meaning for the people as it figured in their holy cereomonies.

What's inside? The stone tables upon which the ten commandments were written and a few other items that were of religious significance to the Israelites.

Why did god have it designed this way? The bible doesn't say exactly nobody can say for sure, but the box did come to represent Jehovah's presence and blessing with the people of Israel. We can assume the angels on top were symbolic of worship, the gold of purity and the poles were for practical purposes as it was according to the narrative, to be carried as the Jews changed location during the course of their wandering in the desert.









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Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Sat Aug 27, 2022 10:48 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #8

Post by nobspeople »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 8:53 am
nobspeople wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 8:03 am To add to the topic:

What exactly is the AOTC?
What's its use?
What's inside?
Why did god have it designed this way?
Well to get the full picture its best to read the account in the bible but basically it was a golden chest (a box) with carrying poles. It was reportedly commissioned by Moses after the Israelites were freed from Egypt.

What's its use? It wasnt really used for anything per se. It was a religious "relic", something that had religious meaning for the people as it figured in their holy cereomonies.

What's inside? The stone tables upon which the ten commandments were written and a few other items that were of religious significance to the Israelites.

Why did god have it designed this way? The bible doesn't say exactly nobody can say for sure, but the box did come to represent Jehovah's presence and blessing with the people of Israel. We can assume the angels on top were symbolic of worship, the gold of purity and the pôoles see for practical purposes as it was according to the narrative, to be carried as the Jews changed location during the course of their wandering in the desert.
I find this story fascinating on many levels, regardless of its 'factualness'. Thanks for adding to the conversation.
Maybe I missed it, but do you think it will ever be 'found' (assuming it is findable)?
Why or why not?
Have a great, potentially godless, day!

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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #9

Post by JehovahsWitness »

nobspeople wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 8:55 am
I find this story fascinating on many levels, regardless of its 'factualness'. Thanks for adding to the conversation.
Maybe I missed it, but do you think it will ever be 'found' (assuming it is findable)?
Why or why not?

Yes it is interesting isn't it...I dont think it'will ever be found because Harrison Ford is retired.



Seriously, it was probably melted down and used for something else millenia ago; and if we are to believe Jeremiah's prophecy, it would no longer be of religious significance even if it were to be discovered in tact.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Re: Ark of the covenant

Post #10

Post by TRANSPONDER »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Sun May 01, 2022 6:12 pm The Ark of the Convenant was according to the bible, one of the sacred objects in Solomons temple. It went missing presumably with the destruction of the temple in the 5th century BCE and there is no mention of it in the Hebrew scriptures after the Babylonian exile.

Image
JEREMIAH 6: 16

No more will they say, ‘The ark of the covenant of Jehovah!’ It will not come up into the heart, nor will they remember it or miss it, and it will not be made again.
You are right. I was mistaken. The Ark of the covenant (containing it was said the tablets of the law) was gone by the time the 2nd Temple was built by Herod and the treasures paraded in Rome by Titus was the menorah and some other stuff, but I was mistaken in thinking they also had the Ark of the Covenant. Pompey (after liberating Jerusalem from the Parthians) strolled like a tourist into the Holy of Holies and remarked that it was unimpressivly empty.

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