White Americans are the scapegoat

Debate and discussion on racism and related issues

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
AgnosticBoy
Guru
Posts: 1614
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 1:44 pm
Has thanked: 203 times
Been thanked: 153 times
Contact:

White Americans are the scapegoat

Post #1

Post by AgnosticBoy »

My view is that racism exists but it is not the cause of all the problems of Black Americans. But the problem is that a lot of Black Americans want to make racism the only problem and that's when it becomes a scapegoat.

The reason for my conclusion is simple. If my understanding of history is correct, I recall systemic racism like what we had in early American history, having the effect of suppressing all or most Black people. Yet we don't see that. To the contrary, I see a lot of Black people having the opportunity to become whatever they dream of, whether it be a judge, a politician, a doctor, a manager, etc. What makes this group of Blacks different than the ones who haven't made it in society? It's not as if only the rich Blacks are making it into these positions because Blacks of all different backgrounds have made it to success. So again, I ask what makes the successful group different? Clearly, it's not race (or racism).

Questions:
Given the fact that racism exists, but does it keep Black people from prospering?

Is racism as bad as it was pre civil rights era (pre 1960s)?

If you say "no" to both of the above questions, then why do you think there is so much focus on race instead of education? Is it politically-driven? Is it media propaganda?

DavidLeon
Under Probation
Posts: 701
Joined: Sat May 23, 2020 12:07 pm
Has thanked: 50 times
Been thanked: 31 times

Re: White Americans are the scapegoat

Post #2

Post by DavidLeon »

AgnosticBoy wrote: Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:31 pm My view is that racism exists but it is not the cause of all the problems of Black Americans. But the problem is that a lot of Black Americans want to make racism the only problem and that's when it becomes a scapegoat.

The reason for my conclusion is simple. If my understanding of history is correct, I recall systemic racism like what we had in early American history, having the effect of suppressing all or most Black people. Yet we don't see that. To the contrary, I see a lot of Black people having the opportunity to become whatever they dream of, whether it be a judge, a politician, a doctor, a manager, etc. What makes this group of Blacks different than the ones who haven't made it in society? It's not as if only the rich Blacks are making it into these positions because Blacks of all different backgrounds have made it to success. So again, I ask what makes the successful group different? Clearly, it's not race (or racism).

Questions:
Given the fact that racism exists, but does it keep Black people from prospering?

Is racism as bad as it was pre civil rights era (pre 1960s)?

If you say "no" to both of the above questions, then why do you think there is so much focus on race instead of education? Is it politically-driven? Is it media propaganda?
First of all I don't think it fair to say that a lot of black Americans want to make racism the only problem. I think there is a small but vocal group who get a great deal of attention and they don't represent black Americans.

I do think racism exists and does keep many black people from prospering but that doesn't mean there can't be alternative scenarios. Hiram Rhodes Revels was the first black member of the Senate in 1870; Blanche Bruce the second in 1875. That doesn't mean racism no longer existed. General speaking I think the pre '60's were worse, not that that couldn't change.

The focus is on race because it's more divisive than education. Plus I don't think the powers that be (international bankers) want us to know much about our public education system. They want to draw attention away from that. So it is politically motivated and media propaganda.
I no longer post here

Elijah John
Savant
Posts: 12235
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:23 pm
Location: New England
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 16 times

Re: White Americans are the scapegoat

Post #3

Post by Elijah John »

AgnosticBoy wrote: Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:31 pm

Questions:
Given the fact that racism exists, but does it keep Black people from prospering?
Not often. systematic, institutional racism is illegal.
Is racism as bad as it was pre civil rights era (pre 1960s)
No. There is no more legal segregation.
If you say "no" to both of the above questions, then why do you think there is so much focus on race instead of education? Is it politically-driven? Is it media propaganda?
Media propaganda. Especially CNN and MSNBC. They tend to string together a few isolated incidents and create a straw man narrative that racism is pervasive in the US, that police are out to get people of color, cannot be trusted and should be vilified. I don't know why they do this but they are fueling the fire and inflaming the situation on the streets.

Also, I think that many people who are quick to call others racist do so mostly because it makes them feel virtuous and it is fashionable. Virtue trumpeting. Yes, there may be a remnant of actual racism within every person (and of every race) but one does not expunge vestigial racism within one's self by projecting it onto others. This verse comes to mind: Matthew 7:3-5 New International Version (NIV)
3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
I think most racial strife would diminish if more people heeded this admonition.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Re: White Americans are the scapegoat

Post #4

Post by Zzyzx »

.
For those who deny that racism is a MAJOR problem in the US:
A close examination of wealth in the U.S. finds evidence of staggering racial disparities. At $171,000, the net worth of a typical white family is nearly ten times greater than that of a Black family ($17,150) in 2016. Gaps in wealth between Black and white households reveal the effects of accumulated inequality and discrimination, as well as differences in power and opportunity that can be traced back to this nation’s inception. The Black-white wealth gap reflects a society that has not and does not afford equality of opportunity to all its citizens. https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-front ... ealth-gap/
When the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was passed, it became illegal for employers to discriminate based on race; however, income disparities have not flattened out. After the passage of the act, the wage gap for minority groups narrowed, both in absolute difference with white wages and as a percentage of white wages, until the mid-1970s; at this time, progress for many racial minorities slowed, stopped, or reversed. As of 2009, the median weekly wage for African American and Hispanic workers was about 65 percent and 61 percent that of white workers, respectively. Asian workers' median wage was about 110 percent that of white workers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_wa ... ted_States
How do you explain 65% income and 10% wealth?
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence

Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Re: White Americans are the scapegoat

Post #5

Post by Zzyzx »

.
Addendum:
The racial wage gap is accelerating even in times of broader economic expansion. In a February update to Wilson and Rodgers’s research, EPI’s Elise Gould noted that the black-white wage gap had grown from about 22 percent in 2000 to about 24 percent in 2007 to about 27 percent in 2019. This latter spike was registered after 10 years of economic recovery.

But that wasn’t all. “It’s clear,” Gould wrote, “that education is not a panacea for closing these wage gaps,” because the black-white earnings gap had also increased among high school graduates (15 percent in 2000, then 17 percent in 2007, then 18 percent in 2019); college graduates (17, then 19, then 23 percent); and holders of advanced degrees (13, 17, then 18 percent).

In other words, higher education, far from diminishing racial wage disparities, seems now to widen them. Or to put things less cynically, a college degree fails to neutralize other factors that are steadily enlarging wage gaps between white diploma-holders and black diploma-holders.
https://newrepublic.com/article/158142/ ... inequality
JPMorgan has made it difficult for black people to get mortgage loans. In 2017, the bank paid $55 million to settle a justice department lawsuit accusing it of discriminating against minority borrowers. Researchers have found banks routinely charge black mortgage borrowers higher interest rates than white borrowers and deny them mortgages white applicants would have received. https://www.rawstory.com/2020/07/what-t ... -the-most/
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence

User avatar
AgnosticBoy
Guru
Posts: 1614
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 1:44 pm
Has thanked: 203 times
Been thanked: 153 times
Contact:

Re: White Americans are the scapegoat

Post #6

Post by AgnosticBoy »

[Replying to Zzyzx in post #4]
It is undeniable that education can help people get out of poverty. I never said education is a cure-all, but rather my point is that many Blacks are struggling because of POOR education. Not making just as much as a White guy in a big business does not mean you will suffer or be held back. It just means you won't be as rich as the White guy but nonetheless you will also be rich and can prosper. You don't need to make as much as the White guy to prosper!

Perhaps, with EDUCATION, more Black people will start their own big businesses and pay whatever the hek they want to whomever they want, regardless of race or gender?

Post Reply