Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
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Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #1Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone be allowed to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time. Basically, anyone is permitted to do anything at any time. Normal people would say ”but Seek, there are laws you have to abide by”, but my response to them is ”How do I know my belief system isn’t flawed in such a way that enables me to do criminal things?”
Last edited by Seek on Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Difflugia
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #2Since the position of every subatomic particle is indefinite and based on probabilities, the wall isn't actually there. You may punch it as hard as you want and nothing is actually there to injure your hand.Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone can decide to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time. Basically, anyone is permitted to do anything at any time. Normal people would say ”but Seek, there are laws you have to abide by”, but my response to them is ”How do I know my belief system isn’t flawed in such a way that enables me to do criminal things?”
Is that how your slippery slope works or did I miss some subtle nuance of your claim?
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #3What I’m saying is that there is no certainty in beliefs. Descartes’ evil demon argument shows that we cannot even be sure the external world isn’t a hoax created by our brain.Difflugia wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:04 amSince the position of every subatomic particle is indefinite and based on probabilities, the wall isn't actually there. You may punch it as hard as you want and nothing is actually there to injure your hand.Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone can decide to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time. Basically, anyone is permitted to do anything at any time. Normal people would say ”but Seek, there are laws you have to abide by”, but my response to them is ”How do I know my belief system isn’t flawed in such a way that enables me to do criminal things?”
Is that how your slippery slope works or did I miss some subtle nuance of your claim?
Have you had a belief you accepted as fact yet it turned out to be false or fallible?
All of our beliefs are merely circumstantial. I think someone told me that ”Truth is always relative, and subject to change in the light of future evidence”.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #4Yes, then you're sliding down the slippery slope that a lack of absolute certainty implies an absolute lack in reliability.
His thought experiment demonstrates that it's possible, but without further evidence, you're arguing that it's reasonable to accept the existence of invisible, silent, ephemeral, non-eating, non-pooping unicorns because we can't know that they don't exist.
Yes. That's up near the top of the slope, where I still am.
And in rejecting even a rough heuristic analysis of those beliefs (despite acknowledging that our understanding is "driven by probability" even as you handwaved it away), you've slid all the way to the bottom.
Here and elsewhere, once an argument can be shown to rely on "anything is possible," it ceases to be an interesting argument.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #5Is the fact that I know 2 + 2 = 4 a result of fallible, inherently subjective perception?Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone be allowed to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time.
Yeah, that's why I was able to preform a 25 foot long jump at the age of six.Basically, anyone is permitted to do anything at any time.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #6Yes. As Descartes pointed out, you can’t rule out that you’ve made a logical mistake every time you added 2 and 2 together.Miles wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:55 amIs the fact that I know 2 + 2 = 4 a result of fallible, inherently subjective perception?Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone be allowed to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #7When I come up with "4" I certainly can because I know 2 + 2 = 4Seek wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:43 amYes. As Descartes pointed out, you can’t rule out that you’ve made a logical mistake every time you added 2 and 2 together.Miles wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:55 amIs the fact that I know 2 + 2 = 4 a result of fallible, inherently subjective perception?Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone be allowed to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #8There are no guarantees for anything. There’s the slight probability that you’re lying and you don’t even know it. Have you never heard of a compulsive liar?Miles wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:09 amWhen I come up with "4" I certainly can because I know 2 + 2 = 4Seek wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:43 amYes. As Descartes pointed out, you can’t rule out that you’ve made a logical mistake every time you added 2 and 2 together.Miles wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:55 amIs the fact that I know 2 + 2 = 4 a result of fallible, inherently subjective perception?Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone be allowed to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #9Sure there are. The computer monitor I bought was guaranteed by its manufacturer, Samsung, as described HERESeek wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:21 amThere are no guarantees for anything.Miles wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:09 amWhen I come up with "4" I certainly can because I know 2 + 2 = 4Seek wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:43 amYes. As Descartes pointed out, you can’t rule out that you’ve made a logical mistake every time you added 2 and 2 together.Miles wrote: ↑Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:55 amIs the fact that I know 2 + 2 = 4 a result of fallible, inherently subjective perception?Seek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:37 am Our knowledge comes from our inherently subjective perception, which has shown to be fallible. There is no truth, merely coincidental attitudes driven by probability. If there is no truth in perception, then there is no right or wrong about anything. Anyone be allowed to steal, slander, hurt, humiliate, insult, bully, swear at or even kill anyone at any time.
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Re: Nothing is certain; everything is permitted
Post #10[Replying to Seek in post #1]
And in the end, they all run to the psychologist for a grip on life again! How? "Yes, how naughty have you really been? Are you this naughty or that naughty? Ok, not the worst!"
Other than that, scientifically, there's a reset by the 3-step treatment for the loss of moral sense, the schizophrenia, "to end the nightmares and get some sleep". The 3-step treatment is scientific ECT, Olanzapine (eg. Zyprexa) and medical sleep assistance (diazepam-based).
And in the end, they all run to the psychologist for a grip on life again! How? "Yes, how naughty have you really been? Are you this naughty or that naughty? Ok, not the worst!"
Other than that, scientifically, there's a reset by the 3-step treatment for the loss of moral sense, the schizophrenia, "to end the nightmares and get some sleep". The 3-step treatment is scientific ECT, Olanzapine (eg. Zyprexa) and medical sleep assistance (diazepam-based).
I'm cool! - Stronger Religion every day! Also by "mathematical Religion", the eternal forms, God closing the door on corrupt humanity, possibly!