Why did Jesus have to be male?

[nobspeople]

Along the same lines of the thread here
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=38174
Why did Jesus have to be male?
I assume he is though some may debate it if the above thread is any indication about what words mean and what terms were used then as they are now.

But why did God (whatever gender it is or isn't) decide to make a male version of himself/son (whichever you choose to believe)?
Why couldn't Jesus have been a female? Would the sacrifice he's said to have made been any more of less successful?
Was Jesus needed to be male in order to get respect and attention? If so, could this be why God is male?
What was the reason why Jesus was and had to be male?
Or was if simply random?

[brunumb]

The hapless couple were deceived by the serpent.

Eve was deceived, Adam was not.

More word play, or just splitting of hairs. It does not change the overall issue here. God is guilty of depraved indifference and application of undue harshness of penalty considering the actual misdemeanor committed. No love or mercy is anywhere in sight in this distasteful display from the alleged omnibenevolent God.

[Miles]

The hapless couple were deceived by the serpent.

Eve was deceived, Adam was not.

This would require a comment somewhere in Genesis indicating that Adam's understanding of the snake's remarks was different than that of Eve's. I fail to see it. All I see is "Her husband was there with her, so she gave him some of the fruit, and he ate it."

Genesis 3:1-6
3 The snake was the most clever of all the wild animals that the Lord God had made. The snake spoke to the woman and said, “Woman, did God really tell you that you must not eat from any tree in the garden?”

2 The woman answered the snake, “No, we can eat fruit from the trees in the garden. 3 But there is one tree we must not eat from. God told us, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden. You must not even touch that tree, or you will die.’”

4 But the snake said to the woman, “You will not die. 5 God knows that if you eat the fruit from that tree you will learn about good and evil, and then you will be like God!”

6 The woman could see that the tree was beautiful and the fruit looked so good to eat. She also liked the idea that it would make her wise. So she took some of the fruit from the tree and ate it. Her husband was there with her, so she gave him some of the fruit, and he ate it.

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[JehovahsWitness]

The hapless couple were deceived by the serpent.

Eve was deceived, Adam was not.

This would require a comment somewhere in Genesis indicating that Adam's understanding of the snake's remarks was different than that of Eve's.

This would require somewhere in scripture indicating that Adam's understanding of the snake's remarks was different than that of Eve's.

1 TIMOTHY 2:14 NLT

And it was not Adam who was deceived by Satan. The woman was deceived, and sin was the result.

For more details please go to other posts related to...

ORIGINAL SIN , ADAM and ... THE DECEPTION OF EVE

[JehovahsWitness]

WHO KILLED WHOM?

Adam and Eve deliberately did something which they had been reliably informed would result in their death; we generally call doing something you know will kill you ... suicide.


Biblically God is the source of all life. Jehovah did not disconnect them, they disconnected themselves!

Rather like a fan that disconnects itself from its power source, Adam and Eve immediately started to wind down, after that death was just a matter of time.

... the only way suffering and death could occur is if God made it happen by changing the original world he created.

Emphasis MINE


That's the point, God didn't change a thing, he allowed the universe follow its original fundamental "mechanism": for every action in nature there is an equal and opposite reaction. Or as the bible puts it, "What you sow you reap". If you jump out of an aeroplane you will die. If you cut yourself off from that which sustains life, be it oxygen, water, food or God... you will die. Adam and Eve did the latter, they died.

Saying God killed them is a misunderstanding of the narrative.


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Did God introduce introduce pain, suffering and death into the world?
viewtopic.php?p=1084510#p1084510

Did God inflict Adam and Eve with sickness and death?
viewtopic.php?p=1084427#p1084427

Did God murder Adam and Eve?
viewtopic.php?p=1084509#p1084509

Who killed Adam and Eve?
viewtopic.php?p=1084530#p1084530

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

FREE WILL, SELECTIVE FOREKNOWLEDGE and ... RESPONSIBILITY

[Miles]

The hapless couple were deceived by the serpent.

Eve was deceived, Adam was not.

This would require a comment somewhere in Genesis indicating that Adam's understanding of the snake's remarks was different than that of Eve's.

This would require somewhere in scripture indicating that Adam's understanding of the snake's remarks was different than that of Eve's.

1 TIMOTHY 2:14 NLT

And it was not Adam who was deceived by Satan. The woman was deceived, and sin was the result.

So, Adam knowing exactly what he was doing; knowing the snake was lying and that by disobeying god's order he was about to seal his fate and would die, went right ahead and did just that? Sheesh! God could at least have done humanity a favor and created first man with some measure of common sense, but chose not to. Nice guy, this god of the Hebrews and Christianity.---Certainly worthy of the worship he demands. Yea sure........ Praise god.

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[JehovahsWitness]

1 TIMOTHY 2:14 NLT

And it was not Adam who was deceived by Satan. The woman was deceived, and sin was the result.

God could at least have done humanity a favor and created first man with some measure of common sense, but chose not to.

There is no denying Adam made a truly catastrophic decision but the biblical narrative indicates he was not created without sense or the ability to reason differently.



Adam evidently named the animals based on an observation of their characteristics. He also had the ability to reason and come to logical conclusions about the abstract since his realizing that he lacked a mate was based on what he observed around him rather than what he was told. He was also warned about the Tree of the knowledge of Good and bad and for a considerable period of time did obey the law (indicating he understood it). Arguably he even enlarged on the original law because Eve understood she was not even to touch the fruit ; its unlikely God added that little extra safety clause.

More significantly, if Eve was deceieved and Adam was not, this means he had the intellectual capacity to see through the Devil's false reasoning. He had sufficient experience and critical thinking skills not to be convinced by Satan's smooth talk. So it seems Adam had intellectual capacity, he had critical thinking skills, he was evidently created with good sense and thinking ability. If he made an unspeakably bad decision, he could not in all truth claim "I'm not to blame...God made me this way".



RELATED POSTS


Adam's sin had what effect on his children?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 60#p909860

Was Adam created with enough common sense to avoid sinning?
viewtopic.php?p=1084533#p1084533

For more details please go to other posts related to...

ORIGINAL SIN , ADAM and ... THE DECEPTION OF EVE

[brunumb]

Rather like a fan that disconnects itself from its power source, Adam and Eve immediately started to wind down, after that death was just a matter of time.

A fan does not disconnect itself from its power source. It requires an external agency. Adam and Eve did not kill themselves. Death did not exist until God initiated it. God is responsible for Adam and Eve actually dying if not the reason for it. A brutal judgement on his part led to him introducing pain, suffering and death into the world. No amount of word play can change that fact.

[Difflugia]

Merely "announcing" a terminal illness?

Amongst other repurcussions, yes.

Then your statement no longer holds. If there are "other repercussions," then it's not "merely" any one of them.

One of the other consequences of their reckless actions was they lost their home. If you dont respct the deeds of tenancy, you get evicted; why should the landlord be blamed for that? Adam and Eve had no further right to live in paradise, that as their own fault, not God's.

As hard as you're trying to abstract this, it still doesn't help your case. Before, it was "merely" the doctor announcing a terminal illness and now it's an eviction of someone that's terminally ill, but in each analogous case, whether doctor or landlord, the antagonist is knowingly withholding treatment of the illness. Neither the announcement nor the eviction is itself what shifts God from "merely" antagonist to villain. If God announced the terminal illness, but gave them the fruit of the Tree of Life, He wouldn't be the villain. If He evicted them from the Garden, but gave them the fruit of the Tree of Life, He wouldn't be the villain. You're trying to abstract away the volition that makes God the villain. Since that very volition is what defined the villainy in the first place, you can't.

Rather like a fan that disconnects itself from its power source, Adam and Eve immediately started to wind down, after that death was just a matter of time.

It seems to me that the analogy would apply in exactly the same way to a parent that stops feeding a disobedient child. You can't possibly mean it to, so what subtle nuance am I missing?

[JehovahsWitness]

...whether doctor or landlord, the antagonist is knowingly withholding treatment of the illness.

Potential remedies aside, the point being made is they bought their hardships on themselves. They provoked their own to eviction, they caused their own deaths. Their fate was their own, God was not responsible for their downfall. In fact if the narrative is to be believed, he took reasonable measures to help them avoid making such bad decisions. They ignored the warnings and carry full responsibility for the outcome.

[Miles]

...whether doctor or landlord, the antagonist is knowingly withholding treatment of the illness.

Potential remedies aside, the point being made is they bought their hardships on themselves. They provoked their own to eviction, they caused their own deaths. Their fate was their own, God was not responsible for their downfall. In fact if the narrative is to be believed, he took reasonable measures to help them avoid making such bad decisions. They ignored the warnings and carry full responsibility for the outcome.

I can be good with that. God told them of some of the consequences that would befall them should they disobey his order. They disobeyed--They suffered. However, why would a so-called "loving" god visit the consequence of their behavior on every human being that followed? What it is is a prime example of god's sense of warped morality which he seems to relish imposing on other, far lesser circumstances, such as disclosed in Deuteronomy 5:9, Deuteronomy 23:2, Numbers 14:18, Exodus 34:7, and Exodus 20:4-6.

When meting out punishment, innocence made no difference; the innocent to follow merited suffering just as well as the guilty.

Deuteronomy 5:9
Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them; for I, the Lord thy God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate Me,

Deuteronomy 23:2
“No one born of a forbidden union may enter the assembly of the Lord. Even to the tenth generation, none of his descendants may enter the assembly of the Lord.

Numbers 14:18
18 You said, ‘The Lord is slow to become angry. He is full of great love. He forgives those who are guilty and break the law. But he always punishes those who are guilty. He punishes them, and he also punishes their children, their grandchildren, and even their great-grandchildren for those bad things.’

Exodus 34:7
keeping steadfast love for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, but who will by no means clear the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children and the children’s children, to the third and the fourth generation.”

Exodus 20:4-6
4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,

Nice guy!! His demand for your praise and adoration almost makes sense . . . . . . Just like that of Donald J. Trump's.


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