historia wrote: ↑Tue Aug 16, 2022 4:35 pm
Bust Nak wrote: ↑Tue Aug 16, 2022 1:38 pm
But I stand by the general idea I proposed. There are a lot of commonalities between the 'no' and 'unsure' and lots of difference between both of them and the 'yes.' Such that it would be useful to group the 'no' with the 'unsure' even if it means we lose a bit of fidelity.
But would you also agree that this depends on the context of the discussion?
If we're discussing religious demographic patterns, for example, then I would agree with you that there is utility in grouping atheists, agnostics, and even non-religious theists together under a category like "Nones," as Pew does. That makes sense.
But, on the other hand, in a college philosophy class where the distinction between atheism and agnosticism (historically understood) are meaningful, it would seem disadvantageous to collapse those two positions under one term, which is why philosophers generally don't do that.
If you agree with that, then would you also agree that, on a forum like this one, where the question of God's existence is regularly debated and the distinction between various stances on that question are meaningful, it would be disadvantageous to collapse two different positions under a single term?
I try to avoid "atheism" because it seems to have to many different meanings to many people.
I'll suggest some examples I think are valid, but different.
1. The absolute belief their are no gods and could not be.
2. Some one who absolutely does not believe in an orthodox God like that of the Hebrews. He may also believe it is 99% unlikely that any god exists, but is open to evidence there is some sort of vaguely conceived God, such as a deist might believe in. This god may even have a personality, but he takes little to no interest in people.
2. a) - z) Various combinations of the factors in (2.)
I suggest it would be misleading to call this person 'agnostic.'
I can see, however, this could be debated as well.
Is an agnostic totally open to whatever? ... no preference at all? At what point does "Pretty sure there's no god" fit into one or the other.
... and depending on how one defines 'theist' one who believes in an impersonal vague sort of god melding into the universe, I'd call that guy an atheist too.