Are you a creationist?

[Wootah]

Hi all,

The thing about creation is that we do it every moment.

- I look at a lump of matter and make it into my wife every day of my marriage.

- Apparently, there is a bunch of atoms that I recognise every day how to get back to and I call it my home.

The day you are not a creationist, you likely have lost your mind.

Are you a creationist? Thoughts?

[brunumb]

Hi all,

The thing about creation is that we do it every moment.

- I look at a lump of matter and make it into my wife every day of my marriage.

- Apparently, there is a bunch of atoms that I recognise every day how to get back to and I call it my home.

The day you are not a creationist, you likely have lost your mind.

Are you a creationist? Thoughts?

cre·a·tion·ist
/krēˈāSHənəst/
noun
noun: creationist; plural noun: creationists

a person who believes that the universe and living organisms originate from specific acts of divine creation, as in the biblical account.
"a renewed campaign by religious creationists"

adjective
adjective: creationist

relating to the belief that the universe and living organisms originate from specific acts of divine creation.
"a creationist account of the universe"

So, no, I am not a creationist. Nor do I think I have lost my mind, but that is still open to debate.

On the other hand, I make things quite regularly so I guess that makes me a creator.

[Clownboat]

When I see you steel man your opponents and debate their points then I think you will have some credit.

I am debating your points though, not seeking credit.
"You actually need to be a creationist to debate." - This is something that you said.
My reply: "Now you must be a creationist to debate? That doesn't even make sense, yet you call it reality."
Now it seems as though you forgot your own argument.

To be honest these are deep philosophical issues.

You actually need to be a creationist to debate is not a deep philosophical issue. You calling it such is just a dodge it seems. If not, would you kindly explain why a person would need to be a creationist in order to debate?

Comedy aside it shows that our words do create the purpose for the object.

Your original claim was: Everything that was created has an intelligent designer.
Snowflakes were pointed out to counter your claim. From there, you offuscate (what snowflakes?) rather than address the counter. Have you changed your stance on 'everything that was created has an intelligent designer' yet?

[Wootah]

[Replying to Clownboat in post #52]

Your original claim was: Everything that was created has an intelligent designer.
Snowflakes were pointed out to counter your claim. From there, you offuscate (what snowflakes?) rather than address the counter. Have you changed your stance on 'everything that was created has an intelligent designer' yet?

Clouds don't create snowflakes. We create clouds and snowflakes when we see them and name them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud

In meteorology, a cloud is an aerosol consisting of a visible mass of miniature liquid droplets, frozen crystals, or other particles suspended in the atmosphere of a planetary body or similar space.

Then we go deeper until we get a massive soup of fundamental particles. Then we might as well ask what is the difference between a cloud and a frog? This reminds me of this verse in the Bible

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

When we give something a name, we create it. That is my point. I credit us as intelligent designers.

[Diagoras]

and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

Two important points here:

Firstly, when I read that I momentarily thought it said the Spirit of God was hoovering over the waters, which I was somewhat amused by…

Secondly:

When we give something a name, we create it.

By your argument, the ‘Spirit of God’ must surely have been created by whoever wrote those words…?

In other words, we (humans) gave the name ‘God’ to a whole range of phenomena that were - at the time - unexplained. Humans created gods.

[Tcg]

This reminds me of this verse in the Bible

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

Which reminds me of the fact that in this subforum the bible is not considered authoritative. What else have you to support your point whatever it may be?


Tcg

[Wootah]

Which reminds me of the fact that in this subforum the bible is not considered authoritative. What else have you to support your point whatever it may be?
Tcg

What claim to the Bible being authoritative did I make?

Does anyone see a point in my posts whatever it may be? Just so that I can be sure I am making a point. My point is close to that we create our world ongoingly. Is anyone willing to 'steelman the argument'?

[TRANSPONDER]

Which reminds me of the fact that in this subforum the bible is not considered authoritative. What else have you to support your point whatever it may be?
Tcg

What claim to the Bible being authoritative did I make?

Does anyone see a point in my posts whatever it may be? Just so that I can be sure I am making a point. My point is close to that we create our world ongoingly. Is anyone willing to 'steelman the argument'?

Your quoting of the Bible makes it 'Authoritative' in your view. Otherwise you wouldn't be quoting it as thought it had authority.

And again, all your points are flawed. Creationism is used here in a very specific sense. It is Bible reliability in a rather literal sense which requires that God made everything even if not in 6 days. Your effort to extend the term 'creationism'to any act of human making or naming, is not to be entertained simply because it confuses people about what terms mean. You can use the words however you like, but we prefer to stick to general usage.

creationist
(krieɪʃənɪst IPA Pronunciation Guide)
Word forms: plural creationists
COUNTABLE NOUN
A creationist is someone who believes that the story of the creation of the universe in the Bible is true, and who rejects the theory of evolution. (Collins' English Dictionary)

I went even wider and more broadly than the actual definition.

Finally, whatever the idea was here, it is horribly blinkered to pretend that there is no difference between a cloud and a snowflake, either because clouds produce snowflakes (so a war and a television news program are the same thing) OR they are the same thing because they are all made of water molecules, so an iceberg is the same as a toilet -flush.

I suggest you go back on this one unto the drawing board, set fire to it, chop up the desk, demolish the building, dig a deep hole to the bedrock and start again with the foundations, and properly, this time.

[Wootah]

[Replying to TRANSPONDER in post #57]

A biblical creationist thinks the world was created by God. Got it.

A creationist realises that they create, imbue things with meaning. What would be a less offensive word for you?

I suggest you go back on this one unto the drawing board, set fire to it, chop up the desk, demolish the building, dig a deep hole to the bedrock and start again with the foundations, and properly, this time.

So ... back to the molecules ....

Thanks for proving my argument.

[TRANSPONDER]

[Replying to TRANSPONDER in post #57]

A biblical creationist thinks the world was created by God. Got it.

A creationist realises that they create, imbue things with meaning. What would be a less offensive word for you?

I suggest you go back on this one unto the drawing board, set fire to it, chop up the desk, demolish the building, dig a deep hole to the bedrock and start again with the foundations, and properly, this time.

So ... back to the molecules ....

Thanks for proving my argument.

A creationist going by any usage other than yours does no such thing. A creationist according to the definition even more strictly than mine is the one that goes by the Bible. It isn't which offends me but what is the meaning that everyone but you use? where is the dictionary that uses your definition?

Back to the molecules, and even further back than that, but that does not mean that one thing is the same as another. Your argument fails, deny it as you may.

[JoeyKnothead]

and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

Two important points here:

Firstly, when I read that I momentarily thought it said the Spirit of God was hoovering over the waters, which I was somewhat amused by…

Secondly:

When we give something a name, we create it.

By your argument, the ‘Spirit of God’ must surely have been created by whoever wrote those words…?

In other words, we (humans) gave the name ‘God’ to a whole range of phenomena that were - at the time - unexplained. Humans created gods.