JESUS IS NOT GOD

[onewithhim]

I would very much like to get opinions on this subject. I'll provide several verses from the King James Version of the Bible, and I ask you to give me feed-back.


Jesus' words:

1) "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise." (John 5:19)

2) "My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me." (John 7:16)

3) "Neither came I of myself, but he sent me." (John 8:42)

He replied, after the Pharisees accused him of making himself God:
4) "Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the SON of God?" (John 10:36)

5) "For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say....Whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak." (John 12:49,50)

6) To his Father in prayer: "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God , and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3)

7) "I ascend unto my Father, and your Father, and to my God, and your God." (John 20:17)

To John in the Revelation:
8) "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God..." (Revelation 3:12)



Do these quotations show that Jesus was NOT God?

Do YOU believe that he claimed to be God?

[2timothy316]

IS the Word of God from God?
Yes or no

No, He is God.

So how does God speak to you and how do you know its from God?

If I posted that, every devil in the world would be repeating it.
It is a secret.

The voices you hear are not excepted as true.

Since you do not know the voice of God I will
dismiss your error as being ignorant of the truth.

You have yet to bring evidence that you hear 'the voice of god'.

[Difflugia]

You have yet to bring evidence that you hear 'the voice of god'.

This is T&D on a board that prizes civility. John 18:37 coupled with the benefit of the doubt are good enough.

[2timothy316]

You have yet to bring evidence that you hear 'the voice of god'.

This is T&D on a board that prizes civility. John 18:37 coupled with the benefit of the doubt are good enough.

That might be fine for you but not for me. Nothing in the rules of this forum says that 'the benefit of the doubt' will be good enough for all posters.

[Difflugia]

Nothing in the rules of this forum says that 'the benefit of the doubt' will be good enough for all posters.

When the biblical standard is "those of the Truth," I'd expect that rules 1 and 15 would both require 'the benefit of the doubt' in this context.

[2timothy316]

Nothing in the rules of this forum says that 'the benefit of the doubt' will be good enough for all posters.

When the biblical standard is "those of the Truth," I'd expect that rules 1 and 15 would both require 'the benefit of the doubt' in this context.

Do you understand what an unsubstantiated claim is? Did you know that a post can be reported for repeated unsubstantiated claims? If a person claims, 'God speaks to me.' and gives no evidence, that is an unsubstantiated claim and there is no allowance for 'benefit of the doubt' in debating. Benefit of the doubt = acceptance of an unsubstantiated claim. I will not do that.

[onewithhim]

What I think is ironic about you
is that you agree with me that the name of Jesus is above all names
but at the same time you deny His name is above all names.

Now that is poetic justice.

Oh wait a minute
you said
It was God who made Jesus' name above other names, but it never would include Gods name in that.

So you believe that the name of Jesus is above other names
but not all names.

Philippians 2:9
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

Notice that it is written

EVERY NAME

Every name on the earth and in heaven with the exception of the One who gave Jesus the name. That is using our power of reason. How could God give Jesus a name higher that His own when He is the one doing the giving? It is the same principle as at I Corinthians 15:24-28, part of which I quote here:

"Next, the end, when he [Christ] hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father....For he must rule as king until God has put all enemies under his feet....For God 'subjected all things under his feet.' But when he says that 'all things have been subjected,' it is evident that it does not include the One who subjected all things to him..."

So, the Scripture says that ALL things were subjected to Christ. Did that mean that God was also subjected to Christ? No, it goes on to explain that God is the exception to that fact. Our reasonable mind will help us understand that Philippians 2:9 does not apply to God, the Father, either. All things, meaning the Father, are not subjected to Christ, and neither is any name higher than the Father's name.

God is the Christ. He is my Lord and Savior. How come God is not your Lord and Savior?

God is Jehovah....an entirely separate Being than the Christ. Would God "hand over the Kingdom" to himself? Obviously Christ is handing back the Kingdom to another Person---his Father and God. Read the Scripture again please.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Which one of these is Jehovah?

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God".....Jehovah. The Word was with Jehovah. This God is the only "god" with an article in front of "god," meaning that he is the only true god.

The second "god" does not have the article. This god could be one of many. There are many gods, so we have to know more about Jesus to know that he is God's only begotten Son and the Redeemer and Savior of all of us who accept what he did. John meant to say: "In the beginning was the Word [Christ], and the Word was with Jehovah the Almighty, and the Word was a powerful important individual." The original Greek bears this out.

And, really, how can the Word be WITH God and be God himself?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to OneWay in post #768]

What does being "one" mean? Jesus meant that he and the Father were one in thought.....they were in agreement. Just as the disciples were "one" with them. You are wrong again.

Read John chapter 17, verses 21-23 in particular, and you will see that to be "one" means to be one in thoughts and goals and understanding.

Are the disciples also God?

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

My Father and I are one.

ARE YOU BLIND?

Are YOU blind to what "one" really means?? Did you read John chapter 17? Are the disciples also God??

[onewithhim]

[Replying to OneWay in post #768]


Read John chapter 17, verses 21-23 in particular, and you will see that to be "one" means to be one in thoughts and goals and understanding.

Are the disciples also God?

The SPIRIT within them is GOD.

Then they are not God, but are "one" in agreement, as the spirit helps them to be. So are Jesus and his Father....one in agreement, not one Person, just as the disciples are not all the same person.

[Difflugia]

Do you understand what an unsubstantiated claim is?

Absolutely. That's why I acknowledged that OneWay's claim would be considered unsubstantiated in any other subforum, like C&A, where real-world evidence is required. This, however, is T&D where the Bible is considered authoritative, especially words that are ascribed to Jesus himself.

If a person claims, 'God speaks to me.' and gives no evidence, that is an unsubstantiated claim and there is no allowance for 'benefit of the doubt' in debating.

Unless it's in T&D and the "evidence" is John's purported words of Jesus.

Benefit of the doubt = acceptance of an unsubstantiated claim. I will not do that.

Of course you won't.

[onewithhim]

Your post is false. In the Greek Lexicons, the true God called- Ho Theos in the second line at John 1:1, plain Theos to the word in the last line to show the difference of a capitol G God in 2nd line and small g god in the last line=100% fact. Theos is the only word for either God or god in Greek, to show the difference i explained above when both are in the same paragraph-2 Cor 4:4 the only other spot. Catholicism put a capitol G God in the last line to fit false council teaching of God being a trinity-He never was or ever will be-LOOK. 100% fact of life--Israel never served a trinity when serving the true God.

My post is not false. And the Greek Lexicons are flawed and they are of no authority
with me or the truth. If so prove it. Your theology is false and I presented my case before
the living God. He will decide if it is true or not, not you.


And if God decides I am right and you are wrong.
You will pay for it.

Get ready to pay for it.

And here you are again making up things that I did not say.
I said nothing about a trinity.
In fact there is no trinity.

You see
You have not the revelation of Jesus Christ.
That is why you are lost and believe a doctrine with errors.

I know 100% its you who are in error. The whole reason there are 41,000 different religions claiming to be christian is because of confusion caused by Catholicism translating to fit false council teachings. They are a house divided, they will not stand. They fail this true mark 100%-1Cor 1:10--unity of thought(all of Gods 1 truth) no division.= 1 single religion has Jesus.

The Spirit of wisdom said to me,
" Ask Him how many times in his life did he believe
100% it was something else or someone else that was in error
and not him, that later on he found out it was him that was deceived?"

And I am not a Christian.

So tell us,
how many times in your life
when you believed you were a 100% right
about something, only to find out later on,
you were wrong?

ADD THIS TIME TO THAT VERY LONG LIST.

The teachings of Jesus prove my teachers correct. The facts of true God worship history prove my teachers correct, so what do the others have=error.

Jesus said His Father and Him were one.
Go ask your teacher, one what? Then come back and tell me what he said.

Jesus and His Father is one, what?

Your answer?____________________________________________

Everyone already knows that answer--They are one in purpose, the living to do the Fathers will. It went on to say all followers would be one with them--obviously in purpose. Jesus assures only those living now to do his Fathers will( just like he does-John 5:30) get to enter his kingdom(be saved) Matt 7:21

If your thinking was correct and they are one in being, God would be insane--He would have fathered himself, prayed to himself, And Rev 1:1 said--here me have a revelation. But we all know none of that is true-- they are one in purpose.

No matter what truth is presented to you,
you will only come up with more NONSENCE to reply.
I have already defeated you. And God has already decided
with me and not you. But having said all that and be it as it may,
I say to you and I said to God, that you are all talk and no walk.
I told God that when it comes to you having to step out and put it all on the line
and put up your life and soul upon your words, and not just be able to walk away
with nothing lost as you think here on this forum with me, you will cut and run.
I told God that you will not do anything but talk the talk.

So how about,
let's you and I settle this before the living God once and for all.
He will judge between you and I. Winner takes all.

I say that Jesus Christ is the living God.
You say that Jesus Christ is not the living God.

I put up everything against you putting up everything
before the living God. Winner takes all.

If you are right you take it all.
If you are wrong I take it all.

Do you accept the challenge before God?

YES, I accept the challenge.
NO, I do not accept the challenge.

If you do answer
or you do not answer with a
YES, I accept the challenge.

Then it will be counted as a NO, you do not accept the challenge.

I say your going to cut and run
that you do not have faith in what you believe
as being the truth so much as putting all on the line before God.
Prove me wrong.

Jesus answered you-John 20:17, Rev 3:12-- as did his real teachers-Coll 1:3, Eph 1:13,17, 1Peter 1:3-- You wont believe them over the errors in your translations that contradict them.
So do you believe God has a God then?

No He did not, your making things up again.
You read the bible as you want to believe. You insert your own words and beliefs.

No so. It is you who are not even reading the scriptures. The Apostle John clearly writes that Jesus has a God. Read John 20:17 where Jesus says that he is returning to "MY GOD and your God," and to "my Father and your Father." Jesus states that he has a God. How else could you possibly read that?