Free will or Fate?

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sridatta
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Free will or Fate?

Post #1

Post by sridatta »

FATE & FREE WILL

This world is called as karma loka (world of actions), which means that nothing is predetermined and you have free will in complete reality. You can change your destiny by your will and effort as said by Swami Vivekananda. Gita also says that God is not interfering in any activity or fruit of the deeds of any human being and some people think otherwise due to their ignorance (Naadatte ...).

The upper worlds are called as bhoga lokas in which you are enjoying the deeds of your fruits and you will not have any freedom there. When you come back to this earth, you take birth in a specific family with certain set of conditions and your such birth is the end of bhoga loka or the last fruit enjoyed by you in the name ‘Prarabdha’.

Of course, the balance of your deeds in the form of a set of qualities (samskara or vasana) accompany you in the name ‘Sanchita’ from the upper world and influences you in the activities of your life here. Such sanchita is not the will of God, but the balance of your will only after coming from upper world.

All the deeds done by you on this earth influenced by your own set of qualities (Sanchita) form the basis for the future fruits in the upper world in the name ‘Aagami’. Thus, you are determined by your own inner qualities, which are called as destiny. These qualities are in the phase of knowledge only and hence, can be rectified by the right knowledge received from a right preacher. Thus, you can change your destiny with the help of the right knowledge and hence, you have the full freedom here.

Never say that everything happens as per will of God. It is true, but, the direction of everything is as per your will only, which decides the fruit. Freedom is given to soul to decide the direction of any action.
Hence, you are responsible for everything as I am not responsible for any fruit attained by you. You should not throw responsibility on the cycle of deeds (karma) also. Your past balance (Sanchita) is put in the closed cover. The reason for the present birth (Praarabdha) is exhausted after giving this birth.

The fruits of present deeds to be enjoyed by you in the future (Aagaami) are entered in a list, which is also kept in another closed cover. No form of the deed (karma) is interfering with you in your present life.

You are existing in full free state in this world to receive the spiritual knowledge and reform your soul without any disturbance from any external factor. This is the golden opportunity given to you to change your destiny in the state of full freedom. You are responsible for your future uplift or fall.





I am giving the basic energy to You since I the creator of energy. But, You are directing that energy in specific way and hence, You have to enjoy the fruit of the work done by You. I have supplied the electricity to Your house and I am not responsible for Your use to enjoy TV or to touch the electrified wire and commits suicide using the same current!

The fruit of My creation work is entertainment only, which alone reaches Me. I become Your vehicle and hence, I am the doer of Your work. The fruit is related to the direction of work and not to the work.

If You go to the forest, You are robbed by robbers. If You go to a city to Your relatives, You are happy. In both, vehicle and work of going are one and the same, but, fruits are different due to difference in the directions of work.



We are doing good deeds or bad deeds based on our own inherent nature. This is stated repeatedly in the Gītā as “Prakṛtiṁ yānti bhūtāni..., Prakṛtistvāṁ niyokṣyati..., Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni, gunaiḥ karmāṇi..., Kāraṇaṁ guṇasaṅgo’sya...” and so on.

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Re: Free will or Fate?

Post #11

Post by sridatta »

Compassionist wrote: Wed Oct 19, 2022 5:45 am [Replying to sridatta in post #9]

Please see https://www.dictionary.com/browse/soul I am not convinced that living things have souls. As far as I can tell, the mind is what the brain does.
When you stop taking food your awareness disappears and finally you die. Awareness is only a special work form of inert energy Awareness is not an independent entity since it is work

Therefore, awareness is only a special work form of inert energy existing in the functioning nervous system. This work depends upon the availability of inert energy that is generated from food by oxidation with the help of respiratory and digestive systems.


This work also depends upon the functioning condition of nervous system. Thus, awareness is the work depending on several systems. Generally, any work is not an independent entity and depends on the system. Awareness is the process of knowing, which is the work of functioning nervous system. Awareness is not an independent entity since it is work. It looks like an independent subject.


Similar subjects are talk, walk etc., which are also works since talk is the process of talking and walk is the process of walking. Hence, awareness, talk, walk etc. are looking like independent subjects, but if you analyze, they are works only depending on the condition of several systems.

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Re: Free will or Fate?

Post #12

Post by Compassionist »

[Replying to sridatta in post #11]

Yes, living things die of starvation given enough time. That does not prove living things have souls or spirits. That does not prove living things have free will either. You never addressed the issues I raised regarding our lack of free will.

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Re: Free will or Fate?

Post #13

Post by DJT_47 »

Predestination (based upon the foreknowledge of God)

Premise: God knows the beginning and the end, so therefore he must also know all that will occur within the entire expanse of time including everything that will occur in the middle, between the beginning and the end of time.

Predestination as discussed in the bible (below passages) can therefore be easily explained when taking into consideration the foreknowledge that God possesses as also noted in scripture, which factor is germane to the proper understanding of predestination but is most often, if not always, overlooked and not considered when examining/discussing predestination.

Further, based upon God’s foreknowledge, all things must therefore then be already determined (destiny/fate); how can they not be if God knows the future? How can God know the future if it is fluid, dynamic, and changes, unless such fluidity and change is part of His foreknowledge, which it obviously must be? If things were fluid, dynamic, and/or random and subject to unexpected or unknown constant change to God, God would not know what was going to happen in the future and would not be able nor have been able to predict future events through His prophets. So, if God does know what will happen in the future, the future must already be set or determined and unchangeable (destiny/fate).

This premise further has profound implications when considering things such as prayer. This would have to then mean that God knows that you will (future) be praying for something before you pray for it. It doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t pray for it then, it simply means that the future is already known or has already been determined (due to God’s ‘foreknowledge’ of it), and your prayers, are simply fulfilling that which is already known to God and will occur as does everything else that occurs or will occur (also due to the “foreknowledge” of God). Whatever influences we think we have upon any given thing or subject through prayer or other actions, may in fact be as such, however, such influences are already known to God by His foreknowledge, and have therefore already been determined and are just the fulfillment of that which has already been determined will/should occur.

If God knows the beginning, the end, and as stated everything in between, then one can only conclude that all things have already been determined and are NOT able to be changed (destiny/fate) by prayer or anything else (once again due to the “foreknowledge” of God) and that all things that are done are so done in accordance with God’s plan and predicated upon and consistent with His “foreknowledge”. This is not to say that certain individuals were chosen first as being special or better than others and predestined accordingly, but rather means that once the plan was set into motion (the creation of all things), that the creation itself and related natural unfolding, sequential events, including the actions taken by individuals pursuant to the exercise of their own free will, would result in various things being done and events unfolding as a result thereof, but because God knows what those things will be in advance of them happening due to His “foreknowledge”, and predestination then being consistent with said “foreknowledge. Predestination then is successive to and in harmony with the “foreknowledge” of God.

Jer 1:5 5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

Rom 8 28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

1 Pet 1:2 2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Eph 1 1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:2 Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

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Re: Free will or Fate?

Post #14

Post by Compassionist »

[Replying to DJT_47 in post #13]
Thank you for your reply. "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." - Ephesians 2:10, The Bible (ESV).

I am an Agnostic Atheist. I can't decide if God is evil and imaginary or evil and real. Both are equally possible. Did God predestine me to be so? If so, how is it my fault that I am this way?

Please see https://www.evilbible.com and http://skepticsannotatedbible.com Thank you. Why would a good God predestine anyone to do evil? Surely, a good God would predestine all to do good? Does the existence of evil prove that God is evil? Surely, a good God would have made all living things to be autotrophs instead of making some autotrophs, some herbivores, some carnivores, and some omnivores?

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