Is "Faith in God" in all religions?

[Shem Yoshi]

A quote from another thread

Faith, on the other hand, is totally unreliable in that it can lead one to believe in what is false just as readily as what is true. Think of all those who have total faith in gods other than the one you have faith in.

Many people come with arguments against faith saying that faith would lead us to believe in ANY god. And though the concept may be defined as to trust in something, to believe in something, I am utterly unconvinced that Faith in gods apart from Christianity is a prevalent concept.

That would make it a straw-man to say faith is cheap because all religions say to have faith in their god... We dont know that any religions say that apart from Abrahamic sources.

The the word "faith" is rooted in the original Hebrew...

"The Hebrew word emunah (אמונה, pronounced “eh-moo-nah”) is understood in English to mean “faith” or “belief”."
source

It's origins is biblical... It's origin is founded in faith in the God of Israel....

I dont believe any of the primary sources of Greco-Roman myths talked of having faith in their gods (like Homer) even in different words. I dont think any of the primary sources of the Egyptian Gods suggested to have faith in their gods...

Surely "salvation through grace by faith" is solely Christianity. There is no where else that teaches that...

I am not sure that any other religions ask for "faith" in their gods...

Subject for debate
Is "faith" in any other religion apart from Christianity?

Is "Faith" cheap because all gods ask for faith?

[TRANSPONDER]

[Replying to Shem Yoshi in post #26]

I read it.I would not be surprised to read a similar story for someone who had a different religion. None of the faith that pushed you to act as you did shows that it is true. None of the experiences that you hint at having had show them to be anything more than you belief in them.

The truth is, you know nothing beyond your personal experience. You can doubt or believe anyone you want but you have nothing more than what you experience, and one fact I'll have you know, no one has experienced what I have.

Despite everything you say you have experienced there is nothing that demonstrates that any God is involved at all. Once one becomes so deeply invested in any sort of belief, it is very easy for self-delusion to take over and run the show.

I have Faith in God... That said, despite everything you said, you certainly have not shown there isnt a God involved

Same goes for anyone who has 'experiences' for which they interpret they OWN perceived God, which is not yours.

And anyone that has that personal experience, isnt my experience, and is irrelevant to my beliefs.

Of course, and you are entitled to believe whatever you like. But that's not what debate is about; it is about making a case to others. And dismissing a sound case (such as 'others of other religions have the same experiences which they ascribe to Their god') is not the way to make a case. in the end, "I don't care what you say, I still believe...." is not a win, and the 'win' is in making the best case, whether anyone else listens or not.

It is an undeniable fact that no one has ever experienced what I have experienced. You draw false equivalences.

If it is about making my case to others, it is also an undeniable fact that by faith you can believe, and without faith will would never believe... This could be true even in extreme cases of skepticism.

if you want to claim two people can claim faith that contradicts, Ill have you know that Faith comes from God, not man. Who said "blessed are the peacemakers", who "holds all things together" and all things came by God.

Your argument fails because of the last. You want to have me know thatr Faith comes from God. You cannot know that and therefore have no business telling me that I should know from your assurance. For my part I'll have you know that I take exception to people trying to tell me what I should think or believe just on their say-so.

You also cannot know that no -one else has experienced what you have experienced. Unless in a nit picking sense that (e.g) nobody has ever said 'Undeniable' because nobody else ever said it that particular time (which is mere sophistry). If you claim to have had an experience of God, you cannot claim to be the only one to experience it. I do not suppose that you claim to be the only one ever to talk to God.

I would however agree that without Faith, one can never believe ... in the sense of swallowing claims without good evidence and even in the face of pretty good disproof. I'll gladly do without Belief of that kind and go with that which follows the evidence, not Faith.

[Shem Yoshi]

[Replying to Shem Yoshi in post #26]

I read it.I would not be surprised to read a similar story for someone who had a different religion. None of the faith that pushed you to act as you did shows that it is true. None of the experiences that you hint at having had show them to be anything more than you belief in them.

The truth is, you know nothing beyond your personal experience. You can doubt or believe anyone you want but you have nothing more than what you experience, and one fact I'll have you know, no one has experienced what I have.

Despite everything you say you have experienced there is nothing that demonstrates that any God is involved at all. Once one becomes so deeply invested in any sort of belief, it is very easy for self-delusion to take over and run the show.

I have Faith in God... That said, despite everything you said, you certainly have not shown there isnt a God involved

Same goes for anyone who has 'experiences' for which they interpret they OWN perceived God, which is not yours.

And anyone that has that personal experience, isnt my experience, and is irrelevant to my beliefs.

Of course, and you are entitled to believe whatever you like. But that's not what debate is about; it is about making a case to others. And dismissing a sound case (such as 'others of other religions have the same experiences which they ascribe to Their god') is not the way to make a case. in the end, "I don't care what you say, I still believe...." is not a win, and the 'win' is in making the best case, whether anyone else listens or not.

It is an undeniable fact that no one has ever experienced what I have experienced. You draw false equivalences.

If it is about making my case to others, it is also an undeniable fact that by faith you can believe, and without faith will would never believe... This could be true even in extreme cases of skepticism.

if you want to claim two people can claim faith that contradicts, Ill have you know that Faith comes from God, not man. Who said "blessed are the peacemakers", who "holds all things together" and all things came by God.

Your argument fails because of the last. You want to have me know thatr Faith comes from God. You cannot know that and therefore have no business telling me that I should know from your assurance. For my part I'll have you know that I take exception to people trying to tell me what I should think or believe just on their say-so.

You also cannot know that no -one else has experienced what you have experienced. Unless in a nit picking sense that (e.g) nobody has ever said 'Undeniable' because nobody else ever said it that particular time (which is mere sophistry). If you claim to have had an experience of God, you cannot claim to be the only one to experience it. I do not suppose that you claim to be the only one ever to talk to God.

I would however agree that without Faith, one can never believe ... in the sense of swallowing claims without good evidence and even in the face of pretty good disproof. I'll gladly do without Belief of that kind and go with that which follows the evidence, not Faith.

Faith must come from God... There is no faith without God. In the face of sin, doubt, human iniquity, there would never be faith... Human would be left to stumble to life's problems. Faith from God is the only thing that could over come that. It is rather a perfect gift from God.

[Thomas123]

SY: "There is no faith without God"

T: "There is no 'clouds' without sky"

( Forget about showers and electric kettles)
There is a name for this nonsense!
I just can't think of it?

It is almost ,an illogical fallacy, it definitely writes like a literary one!

[Thomas123]

I didn't come down in the last shower of rain. I have spent a lifetime listening to this nonsense,eg,
Nights at Devotions listening to this old Catholic dirge,Faith of our Fathers'

Faith of our Fathers! living still In spite of dungeon, fire, and sword: Oh, how our hearts beat high with joy Whene'er we hear that glorious word.

Faith of our Fathers! Holy Faith! We will be true to thee till death.

Our Fathers, chained in prisons dark, Were still in heart and conscience free: How sweet would be their children's fate, If they, like them, could die for thee!.............................

...them that die ( before the song is over)will be the lucky ones

[Thomas123]

Faith in God, should be like arm bands in a swimming pool. Not everyone needs them but you might to become a good swimmer. Swimming with armbands is not an Olympic event but if you want to enjoy the water ,they are great fun.

The idea that devotion to God makes you superhuman is a nonsense. There is much in the Gospels that promotes this. The poor preacher standing holding court with the authorities of Rome and Judaism is a good one.
My grandchild was being teased at school. I told her that she was being too nice. She replied, 'Christians are supposed to be nice!'.......no ,no ,no..
Everyone is supposed to be nice.
The idea that through faith in your God you walk around 'different' ,is illogical and dangerous.

Enjoy using the arm bands, and enjoy the water the same as the other people who go without them, and above all,.......get ones that fit!

[TRANSPONDER]

[Replying to Shem Yoshi in post #26]

I read it.I would not be surprised to read a similar story for someone who had a different religion. None of the faith that pushed you to act as you did shows that it is true. None of the experiences that you hint at having had show them to be anything more than you belief in them.

The truth is, you know nothing beyond your personal experience. You can doubt or believe anyone you want but you have nothing more than what you experience, and one fact I'll have you know, no one has experienced what I have.

Despite everything you say you have experienced there is nothing that demonstrates that any God is involved at all. Once one becomes so deeply invested in any sort of belief, it is very easy for self-delusion to take over and run the show.

I have Faith in God... That said, despite everything you said, you certainly have not shown there isnt a God involved

Same goes for anyone who has 'experiences' for which they interpret they OWN perceived God, which is not yours.

And anyone that has that personal experience, isnt my experience, and is irrelevant to my beliefs.

Of course, and you are entitled to believe whatever you like. But that's not what debate is about; it is about making a case to others. And dismissing a sound case (such as 'others of other religions have the same experiences which they ascribe to Their god') is not the way to make a case. in the end, "I don't care what you say, I still believe...." is not a win, and the 'win' is in making the best case, whether anyone else listens or not.

It is an undeniable fact that no one has ever experienced what I have experienced. You draw false equivalences.

If it is about making my case to others, it is also an undeniable fact that by faith you can believe, and without faith will would never believe... This could be true even in extreme cases of skepticism.

if you want to claim two people can claim faith that contradicts, Ill have you know that Faith comes from God, not man. Who said "blessed are the peacemakers", who "holds all things together" and all things came by God.

Your argument fails because of the last. You want to have me know thatr Faith comes from God. You cannot know that and therefore have no business telling me that I should know from your assurance. For my part I'll have you know that I take exception to people trying to tell me what I should think or believe just on their say-so.

You also cannot know that no -one else has experienced what you have experienced. Unless in a nit picking sense that (e.g) nobody has ever said 'Undeniable' because nobody else ever said it that particular time (which is mere sophistry). If you claim to have had an experience of God, you cannot claim to be the only one to experience it. I do not suppose that you claim to be the only one ever to talk to God.

I would however agree that without Faith, one can never believe ... in the sense of swallowing claims without good evidence and even in the face of pretty good disproof. I'll gladly do without Belief of that kind and go with that which follows the evidence, not Faith.

Faith must come from God... There is no faith without God. In the face of sin, doubt, human iniquity, there would never be faith... Human would be left to stumble to life's problems. Faith from God is the only thing that could over come that. It is rather a perfect gift from God.

It is the perfect system for covering up lies. It is the perfect system for denying evidence. It is the perfect system for self delusion. As such no such system can be regarded as a 'gift' from a god that made reasoning brains for us and then a 'gift' that stops using them as we should. Faith is not a good thing. It trammels reasoning, battles understanding and coarsens morals into a system of accusations against others while playing the victim. Faith is Not Good.