Born from above!

[Bobcat]

Jesus says you must be born from above.

Scripture says he who is born from above is from heaven.

Since man does not really know where heaven is how can he know who comes from heaven or who is from above?

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Very truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

John 3:7
7 Do not be astonished that I said to you, "You must be born from above".


John 3:31
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks about earthly things. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

So, are you born from above? Are you from heaven?

[1213]

Jesus says you must be born from above.

Scripture says he who is born from above is from heaven.

Since man does not really know where heaven is how can he know who comes from heaven or who is from above?

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Very truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

John 3:7
7 Do not be astonished that I said to you, "You must be born from above".


John 3:31
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks about earthly things. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

So, are you born from above? Are you from heaven?

Where do you get the idea it means from heaven?

I think it means born of God, because:

But as many as received him, to them he gave the right to become God's children, to those who believe in his name: who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
John 1:12-13

And it means:

He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

[TRANSPONDER]

Wel,there again, we get the problem.The ambiguous talk of religion if those whose ears were not blocked by predestination Interpreted it correctly, but the disagreements suggest it's down to their own ideas and whatever biblequotes they pick to support them.

We can see with the John quote a familiar 'Real Christian' swindle. If you are a good person, you are a Christian, and if you aren't good, you aren't a Christian. Which morphs into throwing under the bus any evildoing Christian who can't be excuse with a display of repentance or just hiding him out somewhere.

But the John quote is a bit different and appears to be an idea of Paul's which of course turned out to be wrong. That just becoming converted to Jesusfaith would make you a good person, doing only good and no sin. He soon found that wasn't how it worked and the whole thing of 'forgiving sinners' had to be instituted.

Which leaves us this this big, grey elephant in the room,pointedly ignored by the Faithful - Jesus dies on the cross to overcome the sin and death from the Eden event. But we still die, and we still sin, even after converting.

So it has to be an eternal life we don't see because you don't get it until you leave town. And if you sin, you are excused if you can show your party card. So we are left with the elephantine scenario that good persons who aren't Christian believers will burn (1) while sinning Christians are Forgiven. cue the 'nor Really a Christian apologetic.



(1) and if one has the excuse that they reject hellfire - then why do we need Christianity at all?

[Bobcat]

Jesus says you must be born from above.

Scripture says he who is born from above is from heaven.

Since man does not really know where heaven is how can he know who comes from heaven or who is from above?

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Very truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

John 3:7
7 Do not be astonished that I said to you, "You must be born from above".


John 3:31
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks about earthly things. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

So, are you born from above? Are you from heaven?

Where do you get the idea it means from heaven?

Its in John 3:31. The one who comes from above is above all. But then it says the one who comes from heaven is above all. Meaning the one who comes from above comes from heaven. Then it goes on to say the one who comes from heaven testifies to what he sees and hears but nobody believes him but still goes on further to say if anyone does believe they render the truth of God. Why does it say nobody believes him and then goes on to say they could believe?

Reason is that those who do believe become the one from above, from heaven. This is totally crap for those who think heaven is achieved after you die but they really dont get it cause theyre not from above.

[JoeyKnothead]

Jesus says you must be born from above.

Scripture says he who is born from above is from heaven.

Since man does not really know where heaven is how can he know who comes from heaven or who is from above?

Faith.

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Very truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

John 3:7
7 Do not be astonished that I said to you, "You must be born from above".


John 3:31
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks about earthly things. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

So, are you born from above? Are you from heaven?

This is just more biblical claims devoid of any confirmation, or really any means to do it.

Conclusions?

There's a reason why folks hafta make empty claims, when all they have is faith.

I could claim that folks come from below with equal validity.

[Bobcat]

Jesus says you must be born from above.

Scripture says he who is born from above is from heaven.

Since man does not really know where heaven is how can he know who comes from heaven or who is from above?

Faith.

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Very truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

John 3:7
7 Do not be astonished that I said to you, "You must be born from above".


John 3:31
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks about earthly things. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

So, are you born from above? Are you from heaven?

This is just more biblical claims devoid of any confirmation, or really any means to do it.

Conclusions?

There's a reason why folks hafta make empty claims, when all they have is faith.

I could claim that folks come from below with equal validity.

Youre trying to say Jesus words are worthless but you are using human logic that cannot get any kind of revelation.

There is proof but it is difficult to find because God wants those who are willing to work for it.

As it is written;

" If you continue in my word you are truly my disciple, then you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free."

"The man who loves me keeps my word and my Father will love him and we shall come and dwell within him."

"Enter by the narrow gate for the gate is wide and the road is easy that leads to destruction but the road is hard and the gate is narrow that leads to life and few there are who find it."

"The LORD God does nothing without revealing His secrets to His servants the prophets."

[Tcg]

Jesus says you must be born from above.

Scripture says he who is born from above is from heaven.

Since man does not really know where heaven is how can he know who comes from heaven or who is from above?

Faith.

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, "Very truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

John 3:7
7 Do not be astonished that I said to you, "You must be born from above".


John 3:31
31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks about earthly things. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

So, are you born from above? Are you from heaven?

This is just more biblical claims devoid of any confirmation, or really any means to do it.

Conclusions?

There's a reason why folks hafta make empty claims, when all they have is faith.

I could claim that folks come from below with equal validity.

Youre trying to say Jesus words are worthless but you are using human logic that cannot get any kind of revelation.

There is proof but it is difficult to find because God wants those who are willing to work for it.

As it is written;

" If you continue in my word you are truly my disciple, then you shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free."

"The man who loves me keeps my word and my Father will love him and we shall come and dwell within him."

"Enter by the narrow gate for the gate is wide and the road is easy that leads to destruction but the road is hard and the gate is narrow that leads to life and few there are who find it."

"The LORD God does nothing without revealing His secrets to His servants the prophets."

Moderator Clarification

It is also written: "4. Unsupported Bible quotations are to be considered as no more authoritative than unsupported quotations from any other book."

This can be found in the C&A Guidelines. In this subforum the Bible is not considered authoritative. Additional support is needed.


Rules
C&A Guidelines


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Moderator clarifications do not count as a strike against any posters. They serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received and/or are given at the discretion of a moderator when he or she feels a clarification of the rules is required.

[JoeyKnothead]

Youre trying to say Jesus words are worthless but you are using human logic that cannot get any kind of revelation.

There is proof but it is difficult to find because God wants those who are willing to work for it.

"Why won't they believe in me? I'm making it as difficult as I can! "

If this is the best you can do, I'm gonna keep praying to the Great Pumpkin.


...Snip the preaching...

[Bobcat]

Youre trying to say Jesus words are worthless but you are using human logic that cannot get any kind of revelation.

There is proof but it is difficult to find because God wants those who are willing to work for it.

"Why won't they believe in me? I'm making it as difficult as I can! "

If this is the best you can do, I'm gonna keep praying to the Great Pumpkin.


...Snip the preaching...

"Anyone who is not willing to pick up the cross and follow me is not worthy of me."

[Tcg]

Youre trying to say Jesus words are worthless but you are using human logic that cannot get any kind of revelation.

There is proof but it is difficult to find because God wants those who are willing to work for it.

"Why won't they believe in me? I'm making it as difficult as I can! "

If this is the best you can do, I'm gonna keep praying to the Great Pumpkin.


...Snip the preaching...

"Anyone who is not willing to pick up the cross and follow me is not worthy of me."

Moderator Clarification

If you are attempting to quote the Bible you've done so inaccurately and as I pointed out previously, the Bible is not considered authoritative in this subforum. Did you miss my post that explained this?

Rules
C&A Guidelines


______________

Moderator clarifications do not count as a strike against any posters. They serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received and/or are given at the discretion of a moderator when he or she feels a clarification of the rules is required.

[JoeyKnothead]

Youre trying to say Jesus words are worthless but you are using human logic that cannot get any kind of revelation.

There is proof but it is difficult to find because God wants those who are willing to work for it.

"Why won't they believe in me? I'm making it as difficult as I can! "

If this is the best you can do, I'm gonna keep praying to the Great Pumpkin.


...Snip the preaching...

"Anyone who is not willing to pick up the cross and follow me is not worthy of me."

Anyone who can only present Bible quotes is a preacher.

Present this "proof" you preach, and let's fuss on it.