Could Jesus be Satan?

[Zzyzx]

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According to the bible Satan was "cast down to Earth" – and later a "messiah" shows up claiming to know a great deal about "god", doing "miracles" (supernatural forms of magic), calling himself by the common name Jesus, and is accepted as being "god" (or "son of god") by followers.

Satan, according to lore, is credited with supernatural powers AND a lust for power, a great ego, a deceptive nature, and with being the epitome of evil. As such "he" could easily arrange a "virgin birth", could he not? With supernatural powers couldn't he also walk on water, feed multitudes from a lunchbox, turn water into wine, preach convincingly, and even arrange a "resurrection"?

Since all of that could be done by any competent supernatural being of great power, what is there to insure that Jesus and Satan are not the same being?

One might cite a bible story about Jesus and Satan being in the same place (atop a high mountain), but there were no known witnesses and there is no such mountain (from which all kingdoms of the Earth can be seen from a single point on a sphere). Thus, Satan could well have made up such a story (and in the role of Jesus, tell followers that it had happened – or have them informed by another source).

Couldn't ALL the events attributed to Jesus or God be the actions of a "Satan"? How can one tell for sure which supernatural entity produced what effects?

Couldn't "Satan" arrange for the bible to be written by worshipers / followers / believers? How can anyone be certain that they are not worshiping Satan.

What would be Satan's motivation to create a Jesus character and play the role of "the son of god"? EGO and a desire to be worshipped.

[LittlePig]

He never tempted his followers with greatness

I wouldn't say "never"

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
19:29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

People who promise something and don't deliver are called...what?

Who else do we know who deceives?

What animal is associated with deception?

Who was going to step on that animal's head?

Will adding suicide to murder and lying make one's stay in hell hotter?

If a snake eats its own tail, will it get a tummy ache?

[MagusYanam]

He never tempted his followers with greatness

I wouldn't say "never"

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
19:29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Ah, but what does he say just after that?

Jesus said to them, 'Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man is seated on the throne of his glory, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields, for my name’s sake, will receive a hundredfold, and will inherit eternal life. But many who are first will be last, and the last will be first.'

He never allowed his disciples to sink into complacency - even here, he offers the paradox, the absurdity. In this passage, he goes against the popular idea that the rich and the powerful have been given God's favour, saying instead that it will be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a wealthy man to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

[Blaze]

He never tempted his followers with greatness

I wouldn't say "never"

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
19:29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life.

Ah, but what does he say just after that?

Jesus said to them, 'Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man is seated on the throne of his glory, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields, for my name’s sake, will receive a hundredfold, and will inherit eternal life. But many who are first will be last, and the last will be first.'

He never allowed his disciples to sink into complacency - even here, he offers the paradox, the absurdity. In this passage, he goes against the popular idea that the rich and the powerful have been given God's favour, saying instead that it will be easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a wealthy man to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

Ah, but he did tempt them with greatness.

You claimed that Jesus "never tempted his followers with greatness", and I pointed out that according to scripture he did.

Whether Jesus allowed his disciples to sink into complacency or whether he kept them in high anxiety does not negate that fact.

[OnceConvinced]

TMaria. What do you think is Satan's ultimate goal? You seem to be insisting that it is to promote evil. But that is not necessarily the case. Satan's main objective is to lead people away from God. Satan does this a lot by creating false religions and cults, many of which promote very good morals and standards, but which - according to many Christians - are satanic or "false gods". Would you deny that Satan misleads people in this way?

So what if Christianity is a false religion too? What if the one true God (say the Jewish God) is enraged by people who follow the teachings of Christ? The Jewish God in particular can be very vindictive! What if he's preparing a terrible judgement on such people? In that case, Satan has done a brilliant job of leading you down the wrong path, making you think you are worshiping a loving, kind and holy being.

Just because a God appears to be loving and holy and appears to be teaching good morals and principles, does that make him a true God? What God are the Morman's worshiping? What about the Jehova's Witnesses? Don't they all teach good morals and principles? What about other non-Christian religions. Hare Krishna? Buddha? Are those true Gods because their figure heads preached good morals and ethics?

[MagusYanam]

Ah, but he did tempt them with greatness.

You claimed that Jesus "never tempted his followers with greatness", and I pointed out that according to scripture he did.

Whether Jesus allowed his disciples to sink into complacency or whether he kept them in high anxiety does not negate that fact.

So you're choosing to quote seven words that I typed out of context and relying on a quote from the Gospel completely out of context to prove my point wrong? That's rather sad, given that it completely misses what I was trying to say. My original post's main point was that Jesus did not allow his disciples to become complacent, and that even in his assurances that those who followed him would be rewarded there was always the Socratic question, the paradox, the doubt.

I was making the case that Jesus could not be considered evil, because he always encouraged his disciples to examine themselves. When they argued amongst each other as to who was greatest, Jesus again gave the paradoxical answer of the last being the first and the greatest being the least.

[Blaze]

Ah, but he did tempt them with greatness.

You claimed that Jesus "never tempted his followers with greatness", and I pointed out that according to scripture he did.

Whether Jesus allowed his disciples to sink into complacency or whether he kept them in high anxiety does not negate that fact.

So you're choosing to quote seven words that I typed out of context and relying on a quote from the Gospel completely out of context to prove my point wrong? That's rather sad, given that it completely misses what I was trying to say. My original post's main point was that Jesus did not allow his disciples to become complacent, and that even in his assurances that those who followed him would be rewarded there was always the Socratic question, the paradox, the doubt.

I was making the case that Jesus could not be considered evil, because he always encouraged his disciples to examine themselves. When they argued amongst each other as to who was greatest, Jesus again gave the paradoxical answer of the last being the first and the greatest being the least.

I know it wasn't your main point, but within your post you made a definitive statement that was in error. My intent was merely to clarify that one point.

Context would be irrelevant in this case because I wasn't addressing your entire post, only one supporting statement that is not scripturally accurate.

I'm sorry it made you sad.

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to Zzyzx in post #1]
According to LDS Doctrine Jesus and Satan are Brothers

Nuff said

[1213]

...
What would be Satan's motivation to create a Jesus character and play the role of "the son of god"? EGO and a desire to be worshipped.

Desire to be worshiped? The Satan in the Bible would not be as humble and truthful as Jesus.

A certain ruler asked him, saying, "Good Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?" Jesus asked him, "Why do you call me good? No one is good, except one--God.
Luke 18:18-19

Jesus therefore answered them, "Most assuredly, I tell you, the Son can do nothing of himself, but what he sees the Father do-ing. For whatever things he does, these the Son also does like-wise.
John 5:19

You are of your father, the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and doesn’t stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks on his own; for he is a liar, and the father of lies.
John 8:44