Let me show you how in John 1:1 the word God G2316 can also be translated as God’s G2316
Jhn 1:1 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, G2316 and the Word was God. G2316
Now notice in 1Co 3:23 that the Word (Christ) is shown as being God’s G2316
1Co 3:23 - And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's. G2316
So G2316 can be translated as God or God’s.
Either way would be correct because the Word or Christ is shown in scripture as God, as is shown below…
Psalm 45:7
Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
And Christ is also shown as the true God here…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So G2316 can be translated as God or as God’s, as the Word was in fact God’s.
Peace and God bless
Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Moderator: Moderators
-
- Student
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2024 6:08 pm
- Been thanked: 5 times
-
- Scholar
- Posts: 368
- Joined: Sat May 04, 2024 7:12 am
- Has thanked: 8 times
- Been thanked: 13 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #11As I believe that Jesus is God.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 11:49 am Let me show you how in John 1:1 the word God G2316 can also be translated as God’s G2316
Jhn 1:1 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, G2316 and the Word was God. G2316
Now notice in 1Co 3:23 that the Word (Christ) is shown as being God’s G2316
1Co 3:23 - And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's. G2316
So G2316 can be translated as God or God’s.
Either way would be correct because the Word or Christ is shown in scripture as God, as is shown below…
Psalm 45:7
Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
And Christ is also shown as the true God here…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So G2316 can be translated as God or as God’s, as the Word was in fact God’s.
Peace and God bless
Let me add Thayer's Greek Lexicon definition of G2316;
NT:2316 Theos, Theou, ho and hee,
a god, a goddess
1. a general appellation (name) of deities or divinities: Acts 28:6
2. Whether Christ is called God must be determined from John 1:1
3. spoken of the only and true God: with the article, Matt 3:9 his counsels, 1 Cor 2:1
his interests, Matt 16:23; Mark 8:33 things due to God, Matt 22:21
4. Theos is used of whatever can in any respect be likened to God, or resembles him in any way: John 10:34.
(from Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database. Copyright © 2000, 2003, 2006 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)
- onewithhim
- Savant
- Posts: 9280
- Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
- Location: Norwich, CT
- Has thanked: 1275 times
- Been thanked: 331 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #12That clearly tells us that the Father is God, the Source of all things. All things exist through Jesus Christ. (Revised Standard Version) The Father is God and creates through Jesus, His means of creation.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 1:34 pm1 Corinthians 8:6onewithhim wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 11:07 am"God" is the Father, YHWH. There is mention of Him throughout the verse. "HIS Son, Jesus Christ." Who is the pronoun "his" referring to? God, the Father. He is "the only true God" according to the Son. (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:25 amThere is no mention of God the Father in that verse.onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:19 amReferring to God, the Father of Jesus. This too must harmonize with other Scripture. Your view doesn't. Jesus himself said that the Father is "the only true God." (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 7:33 amI disagree. I John 5:20 is clearly talking about the Son of God Jesus Christ.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun May 05, 2024 6:29 pmAt I John 5:20 when it says "the true God," it is referring to the Father, not Jesus.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 11:49 am Christ is also shown as the true God here…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So G2316 can be translated as God or as God’s, as the Word was in fact God’s.
Peace and God bless
Jesus himself said that the Father was the only true God. He didn't include himself in that. In prayer to his Father Jesus said: "This is eternal life, that they may know 'YOU the only true God,' and Jesus Christ whom you have sent." (John 17:3, NASB)
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
Here it is again…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
-
- Student
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2024 6:08 pm
- Been thanked: 5 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #13I like the KJV better
Ephesians 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
And here….
Hebrews 1:2
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
And here….
Hebrews 11:3
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
In the above 3 verses we see that Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and the Word of God are the same, by which God created all things.
Peace and God bless
Ephesians 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
And here….
Hebrews 1:2
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
And here….
Hebrews 11:3
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
In the above 3 verses we see that Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and the Word of God are the same, by which God created all things.
Peace and God bless
-
- Scholar
- Posts: 368
- Joined: Sat May 04, 2024 7:12 am
- Has thanked: 8 times
- Been thanked: 13 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #14onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2024 12:17 pmThat clearly tells us that the Father is God, the Source of all things. All things exist through Jesus Christ. (Revised Standard Version) The Father is God and creates through Jesus, His means of creation.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 1:34 pm1 Corinthians 8:6onewithhim wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 11:07 am"God" is the Father, YHWH. There is mention of Him throughout the verse. "HIS Son, Jesus Christ." Who is the pronoun "his" referring to? God, the Father. He is "the only true God" according to the Son. (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:25 amThere is no mention of God the Father in that verse.onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:19 amReferring to God, the Father of Jesus. This too must harmonize with other Scripture. Your view doesn't. Jesus himself said that the Father is "the only true God." (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 7:33 amI disagree. I John 5:20 is clearly talking about the Son of God Jesus Christ.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun May 05, 2024 6:29 pmAt I John 5:20 when it says "the true God," it is referring to the Father, not Jesus.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 11:49 am Christ is also shown as the true God here…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So G2316 can be translated as God or as God’s, as the Word was in fact God’s.
Peace and God bless
Jesus himself said that the Father was the only true God. He didn't include himself in that. In prayer to his Father Jesus said: "This is eternal life, that they may know 'YOU the only true God,' and Jesus Christ whom you have sent." (John 17:3, NASB)
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
Here it is again…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
John 17:3
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
KJV
According to Adam Clark Commentary only true God is not in opposition to Jesus. Please find below;
John 17:3
"What is said here of the only true God seems said in opposition to the gods whom the pagans worshipped; not in opposition to Jesus Christ himself, who is called the true God by John, in 1 John 5:20."
(from Adam Clarke's Commentary, Electronic Database. Copyright © 1996, 2003, 2005, 2006 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)
- onewithhim
- Savant
- Posts: 9280
- Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
- Location: Norwich, CT
- Has thanked: 1275 times
- Been thanked: 331 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #15Yes, no objection there.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2024 1:46 pm I like the KJV better
Ephesians 3:9
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
And here….
Hebrews 1:2
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
And here….
Hebrews 11:3
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
In the above 3 verses we see that Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and the Word of God are the same, by which God created all things.
Peace and God bless
- onewithhim
- Savant
- Posts: 9280
- Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:56 pm
- Location: Norwich, CT
- Has thanked: 1275 times
- Been thanked: 331 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #16There are many people who would disagree with Adam Clarke. It is just his opinion that John 17:3 speaks only of pagan gods. Jesus said to the Father: "YOU are the only true God." He didn't say "we."Capbook wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 2:52 amonewithhim wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2024 12:17 pmThat clearly tells us that the Father is God, the Source of all things. All things exist through Jesus Christ. (Revised Standard Version) The Father is God and creates through Jesus, His means of creation.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 1:34 pm1 Corinthians 8:6onewithhim wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 11:07 am"God" is the Father, YHWH. There is mention of Him throughout the verse. "HIS Son, Jesus Christ." Who is the pronoun "his" referring to? God, the Father. He is "the only true God" according to the Son. (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:25 amThere is no mention of God the Father in that verse.onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:19 amReferring to God, the Father of Jesus. This too must harmonize with other Scripture. Your view doesn't. Jesus himself said that the Father is "the only true God." (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 7:33 amI disagree. I John 5:20 is clearly talking about the Son of God Jesus Christ.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun May 05, 2024 6:29 pmAt I John 5:20 when it says "the true God," it is referring to the Father, not Jesus.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 11:49 am Christ is also shown as the true God here…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So G2316 can be translated as God or as God’s, as the Word was in fact God’s.
Peace and God bless
Jesus himself said that the Father was the only true God. He didn't include himself in that. In prayer to his Father Jesus said: "This is eternal life, that they may know 'YOU the only true God,' and Jesus Christ whom you have sent." (John 17:3, NASB)
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
Here it is again…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
John 17:3
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
KJV
According to Adam Clark Commentary only true God is not in opposition to Jesus. Please find below;
John 17:3
"What is said here of the only true God seems said in opposition to the gods whom the pagans worshipped; not in opposition to Jesus Christ himself, who is called the true God by John, in 1 John 5:20."
(from Adam Clarke's Commentary, Electronic Database. Copyright © 1996, 2003, 2005, 2006 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)
IJohn 5:20 is referring to God, the Father. The verse goes: "And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding so that we may know HIM [the Father] who is true; and we are in Him [the Father] who is true, in His [the Father's] Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life." (New Standard American Bible) Jesus is not called God here. It is referring to the Father who is true (see again John 17:3), just as Jesus did. (Brackets mine.)
-
- Scholar
- Posts: 368
- Joined: Sat May 04, 2024 7:12 am
- Has thanked: 8 times
- Been thanked: 13 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #17But this verse does not also say that Jesus is not God. KJV version also did not used "period" after the phrase "that they might know thee" but followed by and.onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2024 2:23 pmThere are many people who would disagree with Adam Clarke. It is just his opinion that John 17:3 speaks only of pagan gods. Jesus said to the Father: "YOU are the only true God." He didn't say "we."Capbook wrote: ↑Sat May 11, 2024 2:52 amonewithhim wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2024 12:17 pmThat clearly tells us that the Father is God, the Source of all things. All things exist through Jesus Christ. (Revised Standard Version) The Father is God and creates through Jesus, His means of creation.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 1:34 pm1 Corinthians 8:6onewithhim wrote: ↑Thu May 09, 2024 11:07 am"God" is the Father, YHWH. There is mention of Him throughout the verse. "HIS Son, Jesus Christ." Who is the pronoun "his" referring to? God, the Father. He is "the only true God" according to the Son. (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:25 amThere is no mention of God the Father in that verse.onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue May 07, 2024 11:19 amReferring to God, the Father of Jesus. This too must harmonize with other Scripture. Your view doesn't. Jesus himself said that the Father is "the only true God." (John 17:3)Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Mon May 06, 2024 7:33 amI disagree. I John 5:20 is clearly talking about the Son of God Jesus Christ.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun May 05, 2024 6:29 pmAt I John 5:20 when it says "the true God," it is referring to the Father, not Jesus.Stewardofthemystery wrote: ↑Sat May 04, 2024 11:49 am Christ is also shown as the true God here…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So G2316 can be translated as God or as God’s, as the Word was in fact God’s.
Peace and God bless
Jesus himself said that the Father was the only true God. He didn't include himself in that. In prayer to his Father Jesus said: "This is eternal life, that they may know 'YOU the only true God,' and Jesus Christ whom you have sent." (John 17:3, NASB)
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
Here it is again…
1 John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
John 17:3
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
KJV
According to Adam Clark Commentary only true God is not in opposition to Jesus. Please find below;
John 17:3
"What is said here of the only true God seems said in opposition to the gods whom the pagans worshipped; not in opposition to Jesus Christ himself, who is called the true God by John, in 1 John 5:20."
(from Adam Clarke's Commentary, Electronic Database. Copyright © 1996, 2003, 2005, 2006 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)
IJohn 5:20 is referring to God, the Father. The verse goes: "And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding so that we may know HIM [the Father] who is true; and we are in Him [the Father] who is true, in His [the Father's] Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life." (New Standard American Bible) Jesus is not called God here. It is referring to the Father who is true (see again John 17:3), just as Jesus did. (Brackets mine.)
So I believe Clark Commentary. Of course there are those who would disagree those that accept Arian's view.
John 17:3
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
KJV
- Tcg
- Savant
- Posts: 8542
- Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 am
- Location: Third Stone
- Has thanked: 2167 times
- Been thanked: 2311 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #18[Replying to Stewardofthemystery in post #1]
Moderator Action
This is a debate forum, not a "Let me show you" forum.
Moved to Random Ramblings. Please review the Rules and Tips on starting a debate topic.
Moderator Action
This is a debate forum, not a "Let me show you" forum.
Moved to Random Ramblings. Please review the Rules and Tips on starting a debate topic.
-
- Student
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2024 6:08 pm
- Been thanked: 5 times
Re: Christ is the Word, and the Word was God’s
Post #19That’s fine, I’ll leave. Just delete my account.
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.