So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Moderator: Moderators
-
- Scholar
- Posts: 467
- Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2023 10:01 am
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 11 times
So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #1Presented here, so that we may have a place to start is one biochemist's (Dr, Sy Garte) journey from staunch atheist to firm believer: So, why are you a believer, or what would you need to become a believer in some Creator GOD.
- Clownboat
- Savant
- Posts: 9706
- Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 3:42 pm
- Has thanked: 1095 times
- Been thanked: 1479 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #71Below is the claim that I was addressing. Why you continue to focus on the preaching that I <snipped> out for being irrelevant to the actual claim I was addressing is not lost on me, nor most of the readers I trust.EarthScienceguy wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 12:41 pm [Replying to Clownboat in post #66]
While you may not be aware, the debate on the nature of faith and reason is a complex and significant issue in modern Christianity. The role of reason in salvation is a key point of contention that distinguishes the various denominations and the views expressed in this forum. Littlenippers' query about the scientist's conversion to Christianity is at the core of this debate. Hebrews 11 provides insight into the relationship between faith and reason. The question of whether faith stems from reason or if a desire for reason is born from faith is what divides denominations. What some may perceive as preaching is, in fact, a thoughtful contribution to a serious debate in Christianity.You and your religion hold no power over me. I actually would believe in a god concept if evidence is ever provided that one exists. I'm guessing your pride will not allow you to believe my words though. Your pride is that you have convinced yourself that you know the unknowable. I'm not impressed!
<Snipped more preaching for being against the rules of debate here on this forum>
The claim: There is no scientific evidence that would make someone a believer.
I could imagine just some hundreds of years ago people making a claim about how no scientific evidence would make someone a believe in a heliocentric earth. Yet it happened because a heliocentric earth is real. I await for anyone to do this for any of the available god concepts.
Have you amended your thinking on this matter?
I do acknowledge your claim that faith is a significant issue in modern Christianity and find that irrelevant and not interesting concerning your claim about no scientific evidence being able to make someone a believer.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
-
- Newbie
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2024 3:28 am
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #72Hey, man! In a world so full of different beliefs and perspectives, it's all about coexistence and understanding. Rather than thinking about who to eject, maybe the groove is in finding ways to live together with love and respect. We're all sharing this cosmic journey, after all.oldbadger wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 2:29 pmYou raise some valid points about the potential drawbacks of religious education. It's important for education to foster critical thinking and inclusivity. Balancing religious teachings with secular education nursing essay writing services and encouraging open-mindedness can help mitigate these concerns. Respecting diverse beliefs and promoting tolerance are crucial for a harmonious society.totokuto12 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 3:33 am The Bible, particularly in Deuteronomy 13:1-5, provides guidance on how to evaluate prophets. It warns that even if a prophet performs signs and wonders, if they encourage following other gods, they are not to be trusted. The passage emphasizes loyalty to God and adherence to His commandments, suggesting that false prophets should be rejected and removed from the community.
Last edited by totokuto12 on Tue Sep 03, 2024 2:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- oldbadger
- Guru
- Posts: 2094
- Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:11 am
- Has thanked: 346 times
- Been thanked: 265 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #73Absolutely!totokuto12 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2024 6:49 am
Hey, man! In a world so full of different beliefs and perspectives, it's all about coexistence and understanding. Rather than thinking about who to eject, maybe the groove is in finding ways to live together with love and respect. We're all sharing this cosmic journey, after all.![]()
But thousands of years ago it could damage cohesion and security if a community wandered in it's beliefs.
Only a cohesive community could survive.
Today ...... A cosmopolitan community can survive if it's people are all open minded. Sadly..........
- William
- Savant
- Posts: 15163
- Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:11 pm
- Location: Te Waipounamu
- Has thanked: 972 times
- Been thanked: 1790 times
- Contact:
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #74These stats appear to be off.



An immaterial nothing creating a material something is as logically sound as square circles and married bachelors.
Unjustified Fact Claim(UFC) example - belief (of any sort) based on personal subjective experience. (Belief-based belief)
Justified Fact Claim(JFC) Example, The Earth is spherical in shape. (Knowledge-based belief)
Irrefutable Fact Claim (IFC) Example Humans in general experience some level of self-awareness. (Knowledge-based knowledge)
- Difflugia
- Prodigy
- Posts: 3580
- Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:25 am
- Location: Michigan
- Has thanked: 3873 times
- Been thanked: 2316 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #75There's a number of posts with wacky view counts right now. My bet is that it's a bot looking for the best threads to spam based on a list of search criteria.
My pronouns are he, him, and his.
- bluegreenearth
- Guru
- Posts: 2015
- Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:06 pm
- Location: Manassas, VA
- Has thanked: 766 times
- Been thanked: 532 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #76The question in the OP doesn't account for the fact that science is only in the business of testing falsifiable hypotheses. Most hypotheses about the existence of a god are unfalsifiable. So, if the question is asking what scientific evidence would make a secular scientist believe an unfalsifiable hypothesis about a god existing, the answer is that this is not a scientific question. Scientists, like Dr. Sy Garte, who believe in a god did not acquire that belief through the scientific method (properly understood and applied) but through some unscientific method of investigation or subjective personal experience. Accordingly, there may be countless unscientific reasons why a secular scientist might acquire a belief in a god, but no scientific reason could ever justify it.LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:53 am Presented here, so that we may have a place to start is one biochemist's (Dr, Sy Garte) journey from staunch atheist to firm believer: So, why are you a believer, or what would you need to become a believer in some Creator GOD.
-
- Scholar
- Posts: 424
- Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2025 1:42 am
- Has thanked: 14 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #77In order for a secularist to believe in God he must first repent of his sins at the urging of the Holy Spirit.LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:53 am Presented here, so that we may have a place to start is one biochemist's (Dr, Sy Garte) journey from staunch atheist to firm believer: So, why are you a believer, or what would you need to become a believer in some Creator GOD.
- Clownboat
- Savant
- Posts: 9706
- Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 3:42 pm
- Has thanked: 1095 times
- Been thanked: 1479 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #78Your missing a couple steps.marke wrote: ↑Mon Jan 13, 2025 1:49 amIn order for a secularist to believe in God he must first repent of his sins at the urging of the Holy Spirit.LittleNipper wrote: ↑Thu Aug 24, 2023 9:53 am Presented here, so that we may have a place to start is one biochemist's (Dr, Sy Garte) journey from staunch atheist to firm believer: So, why are you a believer, or what would you need to become a believer in some Creator GOD.
First, a person must be convinced that they are sick (Adam/Eve's sin in the garden) and then be convinced that a religion (Christianity in this case and the blood of Christ) is the cure.
Once that happens, then a person can repent and believe a Holy Spirit is involved, but not before they are convinced of their sickness/evilness. Therefore, convincing someone that they have this 'sickness' is the first step, from there a claimed cure (repenting of sins in this case) can follow, but not before.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
-
- Prodigy
- Posts: 2509
- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:40 am
- Has thanked: 2310 times
- Been thanked: 955 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #79In order for a non-FSM believer to believe in the FSM, they must first eat of the spaghetti of life at the urging of the sauce monster.
My above claim makes as much sense (and has as much evidence) as yours. Remember we are in the science and religion subforum where evidence is key and blind faith statements or expectation of belief in statements from holy books are irrelevant.
-
- Scholar
- Posts: 424
- Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2025 1:42 am
- Has thanked: 14 times
- Been thanked: 7 times
Re: So what would make a secular scientist believe in GOD?
Post #80Blind faith in bad science is worse than blind faith in the good God.benchwarmer wrote: ↑Sat Jan 18, 2025 8:58 amIn order for a non-FSM believer to believe in the FSM, they must first eat of the spaghetti of life at the urging of the sauce monster.
My above claim makes as much sense (and has as much evidence) as yours. Remember we are in the science and religion subforum where evidence is key and blind faith statements or expectation of belief in statements from holy books are irrelevant.